The Nissan oil apparently contains a friction modifier called glycerol monooleate (GMO). That's very different from an oil that uses a high percentage of esters as base oils. GMO is a fairly common FM so it was clever marketing for Nissan to write "ester" on the bottle.
High Ester Synthetic Oils ?
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Originally Posted By: Mach1Owner
I've seen people say its over price, but I haven't seen anyone say that there is no ester in it.
I've only see one or two UOA's about it. Thats not really enough to do a proper judgement on.
And I've never seen Nissan/Infiniti claim that it's an ester based oil, either. And JAG's description is succinct. If you want more details, there are plenty on the board here somewhere. Also, not every UOA on the planet has been posted to BITOG. The UOAs on the "ester oil" were exactly why I stuck with PYB throughout warranty. Why would I spend $12 to $16 a litre for an oil that couldn't retain TBN or viscosity when I could get a jug of PYB for less than a litre of the dealer oil?
With respect to the UOA matter, we all know perfectly well that won't determine anything about the base stock, except by extreme inference (i.e. I know of no ester oils that shear like that). I'd wager dollars to donuts that Delvac 1 and vanilla M1 have more ester in it than Nissan's "ester oil."
The product will do nothing for me that many, many other products will do at half the price or less. As I mentioned, UOAs indicate that it isn't a long drain oil in the G37 or 370Z applications. So, they're not making Mobil or Amsoil quake in their boots. They're not priced competitively enough to make anyone quake in their boots, and that's including most boutiques. Infiniti/Nissan in Canada does little to nothing to promote it. All their literature and posters advertise Mobil products as the Canadian service fill.
For all the hype they had surrounding this oil, it's been a huge zero. It makes the Canadian marketing of PU look stellar in comparison.
I've seen people say its over price, but I haven't seen anyone say that there is no ester in it.
I've only see one or two UOA's about it. Thats not really enough to do a proper judgement on.
And I've never seen Nissan/Infiniti claim that it's an ester based oil, either. And JAG's description is succinct. If you want more details, there are plenty on the board here somewhere. Also, not every UOA on the planet has been posted to BITOG. The UOAs on the "ester oil" were exactly why I stuck with PYB throughout warranty. Why would I spend $12 to $16 a litre for an oil that couldn't retain TBN or viscosity when I could get a jug of PYB for less than a litre of the dealer oil?
With respect to the UOA matter, we all know perfectly well that won't determine anything about the base stock, except by extreme inference (i.e. I know of no ester oils that shear like that). I'd wager dollars to donuts that Delvac 1 and vanilla M1 have more ester in it than Nissan's "ester oil."
The product will do nothing for me that many, many other products will do at half the price or less. As I mentioned, UOAs indicate that it isn't a long drain oil in the G37 or 370Z applications. So, they're not making Mobil or Amsoil quake in their boots. They're not priced competitively enough to make anyone quake in their boots, and that's including most boutiques. Infiniti/Nissan in Canada does little to nothing to promote it. All their literature and posters advertise Mobil products as the Canadian service fill.
For all the hype they had surrounding this oil, it's been a huge zero. It makes the Canadian marketing of PU look stellar in comparison.
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
G-Oil was (and almost still is) supposedly a bio-based oil, which would involve esters by definition.
I heard their oil is based off of animal fat - is that ester?
G-Oil was (and almost still is) supposedly a bio-based oil, which would involve esters by definition.
I heard their oil is based off of animal fat - is that ester?
Sort of, sort of not.
triglycerides are a funny molecule that has a glycerine "backbone" (like the spine of a comb), and three dangly bits of hydrocarbon (Jamie off mythbuster's moustache)
These can be reacted with alkalis, which can bust off the glycerine backbone, and react with the dangly bits to make a soap (really good soap too, I used to make it).
They can be reacted with an alcohol, which will bust off the glycerine, and join the loose end of the dangly bit and make an ester (Used to make those too in a soda bottle as a presentation aid at work)
Biodisel is (typically) a methyl (alcohol) ester of Soybean oil (or rapeseed)...you will see "methyl soyate", "RME - Rapeseed Methyl Ester" as examples. AutoRx patent has various alcohols and wool fat to make specific esters that Frank wanted.
See Jag's Glycerol monooleate as another example.
triglycerides are a funny molecule that has a glycerine "backbone" (like the spine of a comb), and three dangly bits of hydrocarbon (Jamie off mythbuster's moustache)
These can be reacted with alkalis, which can bust off the glycerine backbone, and react with the dangly bits to make a soap (really good soap too, I used to make it).
They can be reacted with an alcohol, which will bust off the glycerine, and join the loose end of the dangly bit and make an ester (Used to make those too in a soda bottle as a presentation aid at work)
Biodisel is (typically) a methyl (alcohol) ester of Soybean oil (or rapeseed)...you will see "methyl soyate", "RME - Rapeseed Methyl Ester" as examples. AutoRx patent has various alcohols and wool fat to make specific esters that Frank wanted.
See Jag's Glycerol monooleate as another example.
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: Mach1Owner
I've seen people say its over price, but I haven't seen anyone say that there is no ester in it.
I've only see one or two UOA's about it. Thats not really enough to do a proper judgement on.
And I've never seen Nissan/Infiniti claim that it's an ester based oil, either. And JAG's description is succinct. If you want more details, there are plenty on the board here somewhere. Also, not every UOA on the planet has been posted to BITOG. The UOAs on the "ester oil" were exactly why I stuck with PYB throughout warranty. Why would I spend $12 to $16 a litre for an oil that couldn't retain TBN or viscosity when I could get a jug of PYB for less than a litre of the dealer oil?
With respect to the UOA matter, we all know perfectly well that won't determine anything about the base stock, except by extreme inference (i.e. I know of no ester oils that shear like that). I'd wager dollars to donuts that Delvac 1 and vanilla M1 have more ester in it than Nissan's "ester oil."
The product will do nothing for me that many, many other products will do at half the price or less. As I mentioned, UOAs indicate that it isn't a long drain oil in the G37 or 370Z applications. So, they're not making Mobil or Amsoil quake in their boots. They're not priced competitively enough to make anyone quake in their boots, and that's including most boutiques. Infiniti/Nissan in Canada does little to nothing to promote it. All their literature and posters advertise Mobil products as the Canadian service fill.
For all the hype they had surrounding this oil, it's been a huge zero. It makes the Canadian marketing of PU look stellar in comparison.
It says Ester on the bottle: http://fastnissanparts.com/images_products/7589.jpg
3.7's are also notoriously hard on oils, Nissan doesn't have to have their oil be for extended changes, just last for as long as the manual says, 5,000 miles. No one said it was anything amazing. Just that it has ester.
Originally Posted By: Mach1Owner
I've seen people say its over price, but I haven't seen anyone say that there is no ester in it.
I've only see one or two UOA's about it. Thats not really enough to do a proper judgement on.
And I've never seen Nissan/Infiniti claim that it's an ester based oil, either. And JAG's description is succinct. If you want more details, there are plenty on the board here somewhere. Also, not every UOA on the planet has been posted to BITOG. The UOAs on the "ester oil" were exactly why I stuck with PYB throughout warranty. Why would I spend $12 to $16 a litre for an oil that couldn't retain TBN or viscosity when I could get a jug of PYB for less than a litre of the dealer oil?
With respect to the UOA matter, we all know perfectly well that won't determine anything about the base stock, except by extreme inference (i.e. I know of no ester oils that shear like that). I'd wager dollars to donuts that Delvac 1 and vanilla M1 have more ester in it than Nissan's "ester oil."
The product will do nothing for me that many, many other products will do at half the price or less. As I mentioned, UOAs indicate that it isn't a long drain oil in the G37 or 370Z applications. So, they're not making Mobil or Amsoil quake in their boots. They're not priced competitively enough to make anyone quake in their boots, and that's including most boutiques. Infiniti/Nissan in Canada does little to nothing to promote it. All their literature and posters advertise Mobil products as the Canadian service fill.
For all the hype they had surrounding this oil, it's been a huge zero. It makes the Canadian marketing of PU look stellar in comparison.
It says Ester on the bottle: http://fastnissanparts.com/images_products/7589.jpg
3.7's are also notoriously hard on oils, Nissan doesn't have to have their oil be for extended changes, just last for as long as the manual says, 5,000 miles. No one said it was anything amazing. Just that it has ester.
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LMAO it does! Esters are where it's at with fruits.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
So does banana icecream...
Originally Posted By: Shannow
So does banana icecream...
Originally Posted By: Mach1Owner
It says Ester on the bottle: http://fastnissanparts.com/images_products/7589.jpg
3.7's are also notoriously hard on oils, Nissan doesn't have to have their oil be for extended changes, just last for as long as the manual says, 5,000 miles. No one said it was anything amazing. Just that it has ester.
But they do charge an amazing price for it.
It says Ester on the bottle: http://fastnissanparts.com/images_products/7589.jpg
3.7's are also notoriously hard on oils, Nissan doesn't have to have their oil be for extended changes, just last for as long as the manual says, 5,000 miles. No one said it was anything amazing. Just that it has ester.
But they do charge an amazing price for it.
To the OP. I hope all this discussion helps you realize it does not matter what a particular base oil a PCMO uses.
The overall formulation is the key.
The overall formulation is the key.
We made "fruit" flavourings in high school, mixing organic acids and alcohols...making esters.
The fruit flavourings are esters, and the banana one stood out to me at the time as the one that smelled most like the commercial banana icecream and lollies...the teacher brought out some expensive paint thinner...and it was banana flavouring
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isoamyl_acetate
The fruit flavourings are esters, and the banana one stood out to me at the time as the one that smelled most like the commercial banana icecream and lollies...the teacher brought out some expensive paint thinner...and it was banana flavouring
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isoamyl_acetate
Originally Posted By: Mach1Owner
3.7's are also notoriously hard on oils, Nissan doesn't have to have their oil be for extended changes, just last for as long as the manual says, 5,000 miles. No one said it was anything amazing. Just that it has ester.
I've seen the bottle already. And they're not claiming it's ester based at all. Look at the label. They don't even claim that it's synthetic.
This oil's TBN retention isn't the only thing. Real ester oils tend to maintain viscosity over OCIs, even longer ones. This oil doesn't do a great job at holding viscosity for 3000 miles; the manual specified severe service OCI has been, historically, 3750 miles, and the regular OCI at 7500. I've never seen a UOA for this Ester Oil that would make me feel comfortable going out to even 5000 miles. That's absolutely unacceptable for a premium priced product.
Shannow: The Nissan Ester Oil holds its viscosity a little longer than a banana split. I'll give it credit for that.
3.7's are also notoriously hard on oils, Nissan doesn't have to have their oil be for extended changes, just last for as long as the manual says, 5,000 miles. No one said it was anything amazing. Just that it has ester.
I've seen the bottle already. And they're not claiming it's ester based at all. Look at the label. They don't even claim that it's synthetic.
This oil's TBN retention isn't the only thing. Real ester oils tend to maintain viscosity over OCIs, even longer ones. This oil doesn't do a great job at holding viscosity for 3000 miles; the manual specified severe service OCI has been, historically, 3750 miles, and the regular OCI at 7500. I've never seen a UOA for this Ester Oil that would make me feel comfortable going out to even 5000 miles. That's absolutely unacceptable for a premium priced product.
Shannow: The Nissan Ester Oil holds its viscosity a little longer than a banana split. I'll give it credit for that.
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