Help me in my Oil Debate

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

Hello everyone, looking for opinions from folks on some oil choices I am looking into for my new car. I have PM'd some folks here already, but just looking for a general synopsis here.

The Car: 2012 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution GSR

OEM Recommends (USA): 5w30 Synthetic SN or Better
OEM Recommends (CAN): 0w30 or 0w40 M1 Synthetic

ok folks because I have OCD and think on things WWWAAAYYY too much I have come to the forum for opinions and advice.

In my Past Lancer Evo Series cars I have owned, I ran M1 products, Amsoil, Royal Purpler XPR series and Redline. I varied the oil brand based on Mods I had at the time. Some oils seem to do better with Fuel Dilution better than others, as others work better with Meth/Water injection that others. In this New 2012 Model the Engine is entirerly new (4B11T vs 4G63T) and I do not plan on modifying this Evo anytime soon. Mainly used for communting, fun, and hope to get an ocasional Track day in there.

I was planning on running the OEM factory fill which to my knowledge is M1 5w30, problem is, I feel that oil is a little on the light side considering how shear prone Turbo Charged Engines are. Especially ones with turbos spooling at over 100K RPMs at WOT. So I did some net searching since I am not really knowledgable on this new 4B11T motor. In Canada Mitsubishi recommends a different weight oil than here in the USA, so it makes me feel that the 5w30 is used primarily to keep a tab on the EPA figues. In Canada they Recommend a 0w40 or 0w30. That later used for winter is my guess.

Doing further research on this 4B11T engine there are variations of the same engine in the New Hyundai/Kia 2.0T motors. Though not the same, just similar, and they spec for a 5w40 weight oil. Now these motors are GDI motors and I realize there are Fuel dilution issues with GDI motors and the 40w may be there for that purpose.

So to make a long story longer, I was looking at using Redline 5w30 that I used in my Prior Evo. Problem there is, though I am not cheap, but for 6qts of the stuff shipped to my door with Tax and shipping charges I am looking at $85 per oil change. Thats if I do it myself!! Again, not thta I am cheap, but I want to be realistic here too. So I looked into the M1 0w40. It has the same HTHS rating as the Redline, and well many charactoristics of the redline 5w30. I can get M1 0w40 for $8 a qt, and less when its on sale. So I was thinking mmmmmm maybe that oil would be the best bang for the buck. Then I went back and said, oh screw it, it came with M1 5w30 I will just put that in it, so I am back and forth on it.

I do plan on changing the oil every 3000-5000 miles since its under warranty and that is what Mitsubishi requires. I do live in a very hot climate where summer averages 120F+ and winters can get to freezing. I don't want to switch back and forth on oils. I just want to stick with one oil. Just simplifies things. I have asked around and got some votes for both sides of the fence im walking on here. I am not trying to see which is "better" and figure out some oil war here with people throwing in 20 different brands and saying "run amsoil instead" I am not looking for that. I want people to give their trials and errors, and "why" they chose what they chose. Not just say something because you have a certain brand fetish. Something that is easily accessable and doesnt requre shipping to my house. I have been there and done that with Redline and Amsoil in the past. Both by the way are great, but just a pain in the buttox to get.

So lets keep this clean, and not mock oils. Just give your choice, and why. Appreciate it everyone.

Jeff

 

[artificialist]

My Ralliart is a similar car, and I use 10w30 Castrol Edge Gold, because where I live, temperatures never go below freezing, so I can use an oil with less of a viscosity spread. Lower viscosity spread at least theoretically lowers shearing. The reason I chose gold edge was because it is better at Sequence IVA tests than Mobil1.... A test for flat DOHC lifters which the 4B11 engine has, and the 4G63 did not have.

Edge Gold has been discontinued and replaced by Castrol TFST, however I don't know if it is better than Gold Edge on not.

 

[oggb]

Mobil 1 0w-40 would be great. It's cheaper than Redline and has proven time and time again it's a great oil.

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

Originally Posted By: artificialist
My Ralliart is a similar car, and I use 10w30 Castrol Edge Gold, because where I live, temperatures never go below freezing, so I can use an oil with less of a viscosity spread. Lower viscosity spread at least theoretically lowers shearing. The reason I chose gold edge was because it is better at Sequence IVA tests than Mobil1.... A test for flat DOHC lifters which the 4B11 engine has, and the 4G63 did not have.

Edge Gold has been discontinued and replaced by Castrol TFST, however I don't know if it is better than Gold Edge on not.


This is why I wanted to use th 0w40 M1. The valvetrain in the 4B11 is similar to Porche and the Nissan GTR to my understanding and both those brands come with 0w40 M1 as factory fill. I am leaning towards the M1 0w40 just wanted some more insight from others.

Thanks for the replies thus far.

Jeff

 

[Drivebelt]

I would lean towards a 40 weigh for a turbo engine run in a hot environment, or a A3 type 30 weight with a HTHS of 3.5 or greater. But almost all the 30 weight oils here in North America are energy saving so their typically < 3.5 HTHS.

If you're going to go with a 40 weigh I don't see the need for a 0W unless you are doing cold starts at -30C or lower or really cold winter conditions. Nothing wrong with a 0W-40, but the excellent sub-zero starting properties are not really needed.

So that leads to 5W-40's. There are many very good synthetic 5W-40 HDEOs like Rotella T6, Valvoline Premium Blue Diesel or Valvoline 5W-40 MST, Delo 400 Synthetic available on-shelf at reasonable cost that will easily do a 5K mile oil change interval in that application. These HDEOs are dual rated so they have SM/SN/SL ratings for gasoline engines besides the typical CI-4+/CJ-4 diesel ratings.

Going the 5W-40 route instead of 0W-40 opens the door to a lot of readily available oils at potentially a better price.

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

One Thing I have noticed though is the cSt @ 40c on the 0w40 is 75 vs. Th 5w30 M1 is 61.7 so in theory th 5w in the cooler weather seems to have a lower viscosity than the 0w?

Can someone explain that to me? Maybe the VI's cause problems in the cold flow?

In Therory in cold weather the 5w30 would flow faster than the 0w40?

Though in a turbo charged car I think thermal protection for the turbo is of the upmost importance. Even with water cooled turbo's of late "coking" is something that could still happen. Not sure how common "coking" would be with modern synthetic technolgies.

I think the Quaker State Ultimate Durabilty at $20 for 5qts has to be the best deal out there. Any thoughts on that?


Jeff

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

Originally Posted By: Drivebelt
I would lean towards a 40 weigh for a turbo engine run in a hot environment, or a A3 type 30 weight with a HTHS of 3.5 or greater. But almost all the 30 weight oils here in North America are energy saving so their typically < 3.5 HTHS.

If you're going to go with a 40 weigh I don't see the need for a 0W unless you are doing cold starts at -30C or lower or really cold winter conditions. Nothing wrong with a 0W-40, but the excellent sub-zero starting properties are not really needed.

So that leads to 5W-40's. There are many very good synthetic 5W-40 HDEOs like Rotella T6, Valvoline Premium Blue Diesel or Valvoline 5W-40 MST, Delo 400 Synthetic available on-shelf at reasonable cost that will easily do a 5K mile oil change interval in that application. These HDEOs are dual rated so they have SM/SN/SL ratings for gasoline engines besides the typical CI-4+/CJ-4 diesel ratings.

I see what you are saying but wouldn't the 0w40 be beneficial outside the relm of sub zero temps? Like faster oil circulation to critical parts at start up? Or is that all just a sales pitch?

Going the 5W-40 route instead of 0W-40 opens the door to a lot of readily available oils at potentially a better price.

 

[RamFan]

Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
One Thing I have noticed though is the cSt @ 40c on the 0w40 is 75 vs. Th 5w30 M1 is 61.7 so in theory th 5w in the cooler weather seems to have a lower viscosity than the 0w?

Can someone explain that to me? Maybe the VI's cause problems in the cold flow?

In Therory in cold weather the 5w30 would flow faster than the 0w40?


Jeff


This was just discussed oddly enough.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...663#Post2609663

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Mobil 1 0w40 retail price is 8 bucks and some change. Stock up when it's on sale. Alot of car repair shops stock or can order Redline and frankly 85 dollars every 5k is reasonable. Redline first, Mobil 1 second.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
In Canada Mitsubishi recommends a different weight oil than here in the USA, so it makes me feel that the 5w30 is used primarily to keep a tab on the EPA figues. In Canada they Recommend a 0w40 or 0w30. That later used for winter is my guess.


Well, it's hard to argue with M1 0w-40. However, if Mitsubishi U.S. requires 5w-30, it would be also hard to argue with it, particularly if you're concerned about maintaining warranty.

Up here, we tend to face EPA regulations just by the extension of the fact we share so many vehicles, the English language, and oil companies and their product lines.

Does the manual just "recommend" 5w-30 synthetic SN or better for the States? Or does it offer any other options for down south?

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
In Canada Mitsubishi recommends a different weight oil than here in the USA, so it makes me feel that the 5w30 is used primarily to keep a tab on the EPA figues. In Canada they Recommend a 0w40 or 0w30. That later used for winter is my guess.


Well, it's hard to argue with M1 0w-40. However, if Mitsubishi U.S. requires 5w-30, it would be also hard to argue with it, particularly if you're concerned about maintaining warranty.

Up here, we tend to face EPA regulations just by the extension of the fact we share so many vehicles, the English language, and oil companies and their product lines.

Does the manual just "recommend" 5w-30 synthetic SN or better for the States? Or does it offer any other options for down south?


Manual states 5w30 only. No other application noted. Odd huh? That what gets me. So folks in MI, USA are told 5w30 but across the lakes in CAN they get 0w40? Same car, same engine. That's why I'm confused.

Jeff

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
Mobil 1 0w40 retail price is 8 bucks and some change. Stock up when it's on sale. Alot of car repair shops stock or can order Redline and frankly 85 dollars every 5k is reasonable. Redline first, Mobil 1 second.


I agree with what your saying but the 1st couple oil changes will be done at earlier intervals. additionally why pay $85 if you don't have to? Considering the 0w40 M1 is a fair comparo to the Redline 5w30.

Jeff

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

Originally Posted By: RamFan
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
One Thing I have noticed though is the cSt @ 40c on the 0w40 is 75 vs. Th 5w30 M1 is 61.7 so in theory th 5w in the cooler weather seems to have a lower viscosity than the 0w?

Can someone explain that to me? Maybe the VI's cause problems in the cold flow?

In Therory in cold weather the 5w30 would flow faster than the 0w40?


Jeff


This was just discussed oddly enough.

Thanks for the link. I read it. Makes sense for cold weather kinda haha but in warm weather? Turbo'd cars seem to shear oil fairly quickly. So I guess I can use a 5w30 every 3000 miles or a 40w every 5000 miles? As far as shearing goes? Or get Redline 5w30 and have the bestof both worlds. Geeze this is crazy! Has to be an oil over the counter I can buy. Though I will order redline if need be. Jon at redline and I have spent some time on the phone over the years haha.


Jeff

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...663#Post2609663

 

[Bandito440]

M1 0w-40 can me had at Napa for $5/qt after the rebate. Use their online store pickup feature to get the 5qt jugs.

The warranty issue is another story, although I too would want some xw-40 in that car where you live. You might be better off with M1 5w-30 until your warranty is up.

 

[bourne]

if you are worried about sticking to the 5w30 weight , maybe you can go with a heavier 5w30 which should give you decent top end protection and keep you within warranty requirements.

Im a Valvoline fan , so my vote goes for Maxlife Full Synthetic 5w30

OR

Valvoline Synpower 5w30 MST/HST

 

[bluesubie]

Mobil1 recommends their 0W-40 for street cars that see the track. Although I'm curious to see how M1 5W-30 GF5 would hold up in a turbo. Just can't find any guinea pigs to do uoa's..

Subaru recently dropped the thicker viscosity recommendations from their manuals, but a lot of new WRX owner's are still running Rotell T6 5W-40. In one case, a guy went to the dealer for a misfire code. The dealer said the RT6 was causing the misfire (even though there were no changes to the engine), drained the Rotella, and charged the guy $100 for an oil change. Of course, his misfire returned.

If I ran 5W-30, I think I would go with one that has an HTHS of 3.5 or higher. One option is Max Life Full Synthetic, which bourne mentioned above, but I've never seen it. Motul X-clean is another. And who says you're "required" to follow a "recommendation" anyway?

-Dennis

 

[A_Harman]

It's good to see you posting on BITOG again, Jeff.

Even though RedLine 5w30 and M1 0w40 start off with the same HTHS, RedLine will probably retain its viscosity better through an oil change interval, so you do get some benefit for the extra money. But they're both excellent oils.

Mitsubishi's recommendation of M1 5w30 is a good one. M1 5w30 has Honda's HTO-06 endorsement for use in turbocharged engines.

Considering availability and price, go for the M1 0w40.

 

[alwayson]

I would also choose Mobil 1 0w40, except your American manual doesn't provide that as an option.

So you are left with Mobil 1 5w30 by default.

 

[alwayson]

Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX

Manual states 5w30 only. No other application noted. Odd huh? That what gets me. So folks in MI, USA are told 5w30 but across the lakes in CAN they get 0w40? Same car, same engine. That's why I'm confused.

Jeff



Seriously email Mitsubishi about this.

I am really curious.

 

[bourne]

Originally Posted By: bluesubie
Mobil1 recommends their 0W-40 for street cars that see the track. Although I'm curious to see how M1 5W-30 GF5 would hold up in a turbo. Just can't find any guinea pigs to do uoa's..

Subaru recently dropped the thicker viscosity recommendations from their manuals, but a lot of new WRX owner's are still running Rotell T6 5W-40. In one case, a guy went to the dealer for a misfire code. The dealer said the RT6 was causing the misfire (even though there were no changes to the engine), drained the Rotella, and charged the guy $100 for an oil change. Of course, his misfire returned.

If I ran 5W-30, I think I would go with one that has an HTHS of 3.5 or higher. One option is Max Life Full Synthetic, which bourne mentioned above, but I've never seen it. Motul X-clean is another. And who says you're "required" to follow a "recommendation" anyway?

-Dennis


Dennis , I usually find Maxlife full syn at Meijer , often on sale for 19.99 for a 5 qt jug.

Regardless, Maxlife as we know it is about to change