Head gaskets finally failed on my Subie

[subiedriver]

Yesterday afternoon, I had a small puddle of coolant under my Subie, it was coming from the right rear of the engine block, only thing it could be is the head gasket.

My car is currently torn down in the shop, getting both head gaskets replaced. With 130,000 miles on it, I'm also doing the water pump, t-stat and all the engine gaskets. The engine is out of the car, so there is no labor involved on those items.

I'm very fortunate to be an employee at the Kia shop, I get labor at $30/hour and a good discount on parts. This will end up costing me about $1200 for the whole job. It sucks, but at least I'm getting a deal!

 

[gathermewool]

Seems like you're looking at it from the right angle. Are you going to replace the valve cover gaskets, plugs, or any seals while you've got the engine out?

I know there are some engines that require nothing more than oil changes for hundreds of thousands of miles, but for around $1200, you're essentially guaranteeing another couple of hundred thousand out of this one, which isn't too bad at all.

Are you planning to run the Subie coolant with the Coolant Conditioner add? Even with the new gaskets, I think I'd still play it safe.

Oh, and please make sure to take lots of pics. It would be great to see what the old gasket looks likes like, as well as any other random shots!

 

[oggb]

120,000 miles and the head gaskets go? That isn't even the engine known for blowing head gaskets.

At least it was an external leak and it [apparently] didn't contaminate the oil.

Makes me sad to read these kinds of stories. I really like my WRX.

 

[subiedriver]

The valve cover gaskets will be replaced, as well as the spark plugs. The cam seals and all that stuff looks good, so I'm leaving it alone.

I did get a bottle of coolant conditioner and I will be using it, especially after spending this kind of money!

From what I've read, the 2004's are hit and miss, some fail, some don't. By 2005, they pretty well had it straightened out. I still love the car though!

 

[dblshock]

I was thinking a new outback but keep hearing these reports and don't 2.5's still use t-belts?

 

[Oil Changer]

Originally Posted By: dblshock
I was thinking a new outback but keep hearing these reports and don't 2.5's still use t-belts?


I keep reading these reports also.

The last I heard, they still use belts but others say chain.

 

[Eddie]

There are two versions out. The new engine uses chain drive cams and the older style uses a Timing belt. I forgot which vehicle gets the chain.

 

[gathermewool]

Only the new Forester has the FB motor with the timing chain. HG issues haven't been an issue since the early 2000's. As the 2000's wore on, fewer and fewer people complained of (at least online) HG failures. Well, the majority of failures seemed to occur at the >= 120k point, so time will tell as more later-model Subies age past that point...


My old '97 EJ25's HG's were replaced by the previous owner at around 150k, a dozen-thousand miles before I bought it.

If I were to buy an older Subie now-adays, I'd go for the "bullet-proof" EJ22.

 

[dblshock]

that new sport car '86' whatever, that motor a t-belt, HG problems?

 

[gathermewool]

Originally Posted By: dblshock
that new sport car '86' whatever, that motor a t-belt, HG problems?


The RWD BRZ? It's not even available yet.

 

[VNTS]

My pal works as a machinist for one of the best shops up here in Maine. They do most of the work for local circle tracks and are well known. My friend does all the crank and rod work and is well know for preping the heads.

He commented on how poor the suby heads are and how he has 3-4 sets every week which he has to repair for the local Suby dealers,often after other machine shops have screwed them up.
he tells me he wouldnt touch a Suby after seeing these things and talking to the service mangagers at 3 local suby stores.
They have head gasket and issues with the heads. He guesses he has repaired about 200 sets of heads in the last two years, he sick of doing them LOL.

 

[Y_K]

here is some read on the gaskets and cooling system in general

 

[Bill in Utah]

Originally Posted By: dblshock
I was thinking a new outback but keep hearing these reports and don't 2.5's still use t-belts?


Outback uses old motor that does have belts with the new CVT transmission.

Forester goes new motor that has LONG chain and old 4 speed auto.

Bill

 

[gathermewool]

Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: dblshock
I was thinking a new outback but keep hearing these reports and don't 2.5's still use t-belts?


Outback uses old motor that does have belts with the new CVT transmission.

Forester goes new motor that has LONG chain and old 4 speed auto.

Bill


I think this is strange. I can see not wanting to pair the CVT with the Forester XT (turbo model only available in the Forester, not the Outback,) but it's only 224 HP. Do you think they're taking the slow and steady approach to transitioning to the newer motor and tranny or is there something I'm missing (like having to use up all of the AT's they have lying around?)

I think a CVT Forester XT would be pretty sweet, though. Heck, I'd even take a CVT Outback XT.

 

[mechtech2]

Originally Posted By: VNTS
My pal works as a machinist for one of the best shops up here in Maine. They do most of the work for local circle tracks and are well known. My friend does all the crank and rod work and is well know for preping the heads.

He commented on how poor the suby heads are and how he has 3-4 sets every week which he has to repair for the local Suby dealers,often after other machine shops have screwed them up.
he tells me he wouldnt touch a Suby after seeing these things and talking to the service mangagers at 3 local suby stores.
They have head gasket and issues with the heads. He guesses he has repaired about 200 sets of heads in the last two years, he sick of doing them LOL.


Usually, "I have a friend" posts are weak, but this one has the ring of truth to it. Maybe it will help others.

 

[91344George]

Like others mentioned the HG problem has been correct years ago.
Any Subaru purchased during the past 6 years or so will be as reliable as any other car out there in this regard.

 

[VNTS]

He works for Butler Macmaster Engines, they do all the Ford ACT engines
http://www.fordracingparts.com/download/charts/S347JR_Engine_Specs.pdf


Originally Posted By: mechtech2
Originally Posted By: VNTS
My pal works as a machinist for one of the best shops up here in Maine. They do most of the work for local circle tracks and are well known. My friend does all the crank and rod work and is well know for preping the heads.

He commented on how poor the suby heads are and how he has 3-4 sets every week which he has to repair for the local Suby dealers,often after other machine shops have screwed them up.
he tells me he wouldnt touch a Suby after seeing these things and talking to the service mangagers at 3 local suby stores.
They have head gasket and issues with the heads. He guesses he has repaired about 200 sets of heads in the last two years, he sick of doing them LOL.


Usually, "I have a friend" posts are weak, but this one has the ring of truth to it. Maybe it will help others.

 

[ron917]

Originally Posted By: 91344George
Like others mentioned the HG problem has been correct years ago.
Any Subaru purchased during the past 6 years or so will be as reliable as any other car out there in this regard.


Subarus still have head gasket issues. Go read on subaruoutback.org, there is a whole forum dedicated to head gaskets. You will see many reports of problems well after 2003, when they were supposedly fixed.

After 2003, oil leaking from the HGs is the most common problem. My '07 Outback is seeping oil from the headgaskets at 72,000 miles. Not bad enough to drip yet, I'll just keep an eye on it and probably change them out when the the timing belt and other major stuff is due.

 

[Bill in Utah]

My 2007 Outback NA is now seeping coolant externally from the head gaskets even with use of the stop leak conditioner from Subaru being used every 2 years with fresh coolant.

Since the vehicle has a little over 70k miles Subaru said to the guy who bought mine too bad. I went in (I know the owner and salesperson well) and they will repair the one side only for only $150 plus parts (about another $200). Finally they agreed to do both for $450 incl everything. (I've agreed to go in half with the new owner to get it repaired)

So while this did not become internal (I had a UOA just before I sold it and it showed no coolant in the oil) it still is a concern. I feel it could have easily become an internal one.

Bill

 

[rcy]

Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
My 2007 Outback NA is now seeping coolant externally from the head gaskets even with use of the stop leak conditioner from Subaru being used every 2 years with fresh coolant.

Since the vehicle has a little over 70k miles Subaru said to the guy who bought mine too bad. I went in (I know the owner and salesperson well) and they will repair the one side only for only $150 plus parts (about another $200). Finally they agreed to do both for $450 incl everything. (I've agreed to go in half with the new owner to get it repaired)

So while this did not become internal (I had a UOA just before I sold it and it showed no coolant in the oil) it still is a concern. I feel it could have easily become an internal one.

Bill


I want to buy my next vehicle from you.

I had the H6 in my Outback and as far as I can tell, there are few problems with it vs the H4.