GM installing chargers for all EVs at dealers

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HoosierJeeper

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https://www.pcmag.com/news/gm-invit...up-at-1000-dealers-nationwide?mibextid=Zxz2cZ

So let me get this straight...these are level 2 chargers, so it'll take like 5-8 hours to get a full charge at one of these. Why on earth would someone sit around a dealer for that long to charge? It's like going back to the horse and buggy days where it takes 3 days to go 1000 miles. Don't see how EVs will work for people that like road trips. I've driven to/from CO straight through from WI, as well as FL to WI and back straight through. Takes about 5 minutes to get gas and get back on the road. I don't see any EV that can accomplish that.
 
I think the idea is to lure all drivers of electric vehicles to a GM dealership for whatever reason; not to recharge the population's cars for reasons of generosity.
Actually, calling these chargers "trappings", (hollow suggestions or props to establish a mood) of customer service, might be the most accurate use of the word as dealerships are known to do whatever they can to trap a customer.

COMPLETELY INEXCUSABLE NASTY COMMENT: I "can't wait" to see the grumbling clowns dealerships send outside to police the chargers.
Notoriously evil/dishonest people pretending to help customers charge their cars....? You gotta be kidding, right?
I want to hear one of those monkeys say to a customer, "Ma'am, you can't park there because it's a charging station."
Also, can you imagine how the pecking order thing will work? "It ain't my job, I did it last time!".

The natural and unwavering contempt with which the front end of dealerships displays to people can't dance well with "free services".

Hey GM, bring back the Vega. Call it the GR TT....Got it Right This Time......but build it the same way.
 
Getting a customer to stroll through the show room is priceless. That’s why the parts department is often in the middle off the building. If charging is done, the owner has time to use the facilities then hang around the showroom where the sales team can work on them.
 
HoosierJeeper said:
https://www.pcmag.com/news/gm-invit...up-at-1000-dealers-nationwide?mibextid=Zxz2cZ

So let me get this straight...these are level 2 chargers, so it'll take like 5-8 hours to get a full charge at one of these. Why on earth would someone sit around a dealer for that long to charge? It's like going back to the horse and buggy days where it takes 3 days to go 1000 miles. Don't see how EVs will work for people that like road trips. I've driven to/from CO straight through from WI, as well as FL to WI and back straight through. Takes about 5 minutes to get gas and get back on the road. I don't see any EV that can accomplish that.
Click to expand...

Correct these are of absolutely zero use to anyone on a road trip.

These will end up being used for employees driving to and from the dealership and to rotate their own fleet through.

Teslas work fine on road trips because of a decades worth of gigantic investment, right now everything else is a gamble.
 
It is another example of Mary Barra's incompetence and irresponsible use of shareholder's dollars.
How about at the end of say, two years GM publishes the figures showing increased sales that can really be attributable to having free chargers at the dealerships as to entice people to come in vs. the cost of installing and maintaining said chargers.

It reminds me of when I was working in the consumer electronics business back in the early1980's and the owner of the store decided to give away free balloons for the kids and free hot dogs and Cokes for the customers as part of a big sales event.
What we attracted were a lot of deadbeats who came in for a free lunch and wasted all of the salesperson's time pretending to be interested in buying expensive big screen TV's and audio equipment and I doubt very seriously that we sold one piece of equipment that we wouldn't have sold had we not spent a couple thousand dollars on free giveaways.
 
DwightFrye said:
It is another example of Mary Barra's incompetence and irresponsible use of shareholder's dollars.
How about at the end of say, two years GM publishes the figures showing increased sales that can really be attributable to having free chargers at the dealerships as to entice people to come in vs. the cost of installing and maintaining said chargers.

It reminds me of when I was working in the consumer electronics business back in the early1980's and the owner of the store decided to give away free balloons for the kids and free hot dogs and Cokes for the customers as part of a big sales event.
What we attracted were a lot of deadbeats who came in for a free lunch and wasted all of the salesperson's time pretending to be interested in buying expensive big screen TV's and audio equipment and I doubt very seriously that we sold one piece of equipment that we wouldn't have sold had we not spent a couple thousand dollars on free giveaways.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't peg this on Mary Barra, but the GM press team.

They are grossly Inflating the relevance of a base level requirement and trying to turn it into something it's not.

They are trying to make a silk purse out of a sows ear.
 
HoosierJeeper said:
https://www.pcmag.com/news/gm-invit...up-at-1000-dealers-nationwide?mibextid=Zxz2cZ

So let me get this straight...these are level 2 chargers, so it'll take like 5-8 hours to get a full charge at one of these. Why on earth would someone sit around a dealer for that long to charge? It's like going back to the horse and buggy days where it takes 3 days to go 1000 miles. Don't see how EVs will work for people that like road trips. I've driven to/from CO straight through from WI, as well as FL to WI and back straight through. Takes about 5 minutes to get gas and get back on the road. I don't see any EV that can accomplish that.
Click to expand...
I agree but I think it is more that EVs will along with gas have their place.
EVs will be commuter and around town cars the most. Gasoline will rule the open road in both comfort and convenience for the foreseeable future.
It's really a personal choice. I would like an EV for local car (if the price is the same only) that we dont take on road trips and pretty much sits around the house and does 5000 miles a year IF that. Gasoline rules for me and my SUV.

I'll be shocked if and when the price of an EV will get down close to a gas car/ SUV of the SAME size. Right now this is what gets me the most, current EVs are very small in size and something the general population does not like. The people in this forum are not the "general population"
An example is the demise of 4 door sedans. I doubt the average middle class family will go for a small 4 door sedan for more money over an SUV that uses gasoline as their main vehicle.
 
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alarmguy said:
I agree but I think it is more that EVs will along with gas have their place.
EVs will be commuter and around town cars the most. Gasoline will rule the open road in both comfort and convenience for the foreseeable future.
It's really a personal choice. I would like an EV for local car (if the price is the same only) that we dont take on road trips and pretty much sits around the house and does 5000 miles a year IF that. Gasoline rules for me and my SUV.

I'll be shocked if and when the price of an EV will get down close to a gas car/ SUV of the SAME size. Right now this is what gets me the most, current EVs are very small in size and something the general population does not like. The people in this forum are not the "general population"
An example is the demise of 4 door sedans. I doubt the average middle class family will go for a small 4 door sedan for more money over an SUV that uses gasoline as their main vehicle.
Click to expand...
I agree. I'm not against EVs per se, I think everyone should have the choice to buy what they want without ESG getting in the way. I think for the average person to transition, they need to be fully on parity with gas for charge/refuel times, range and chargers compared to gas pumps. People don't really have to think about it with gas or use some route planner etc. Just run till its empty, pull off, 5 mins later you're back on the road for another 400-500 miles. Until EVs hit that, I think a substantial amount of people won't be able to fully replace gas.
 
alarmguy said:
I'll be shocked if and when the price of an EV will get down close to a gas car/ SUV of the SAME size. Right now this is what gets me the most, current EVs are very small in size and something the general population does not like
Click to expand...

I've known a few people who have a smaller commuter car they use to commute to work (50-mile or so one-way commute) while the wife drives the big SUV around.

Maybe that's more common in this area, where the jobs and the houses that job allows one to afford are quite far apart...
 
Human nature is avoidance to change. Post after post sez EVs have to be like ICE vehicles to be widely accepted. Human nature...
Well, here's some facts for you: The Model Y, a very expensive vehicle, will be the #4 (or higher) selling car in the world this year, of any kind.
In 2023 or 2024 it is expected to take the #1 spot. The Model Y is already the #1 vehicle by revenue. Perhaps it is already accepted?

But to your price point; what if Tesla releases a Model 2, or whatever Musk calls it?

Regarding GM chargers, GM has to charge their demonstrators, right? Can't just plug 'em into 120 for that whopping 4 mph!
 
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DwightFrye said:
It is another example of Mary Barra's incompetence and irresponsible use of shareholder's dollars.
Click to expand...
A corporate decision was made. Installing chargers nationwide (worldwide?) likely isn't the brainwork of one person.
I love how people affix blame as if they know what they are talking about. It's always so neatly bullseyed.
Ever notice how 'pat' today's arguments are? It's always boils down to just one person or just one reason....as if life's developments occur in a vacuum.

Playing the "caveman from the past who doesn't understand anything new" card, is a little tired.
Honestly, the number of people here who exclaim the limitations of EVs as if they discovered it is amazing.
EV makers publish their vehicle's ranges.
If they obscure the ease of recharging, that's on them.....but don't act like that EV's inability to go from NY to LA is something they've been hiding.

That so many trips are local and capable of being done with any nascent tech car is a fact which should be common knowledge.
Macy's had electric delivery trucks in New Jersey in the '20's and '30's; my dad saw them.
Nobody ever thought one was going to drive to Atlanta.

Some people react to electric cars like a kid to castor oil. Use the tool where it's effective. Buy one or not.
 
HoosierJeeper said:
https://www.pcmag.com/news/gm-invit...up-at-1000-dealers-nationwide?mibextid=Zxz2cZ

So let me get this straight...these are level 2 chargers, so it'll take like 5-8 hours to get a full charge at one of these. Why on earth would someone sit around a dealer for that long to charge? It's like going back to the horse and buggy days where it takes 3 days to go 1000 miles. Don't see how EVs will work for people that like road trips. I've driven to/from CO straight through from WI, as well as FL to WI and back straight through. Takes about 5 minutes to get gas and get back on the road. I don't see any EV that can accomplish that.
Click to expand...
I suspect you'll see lots of dealer putting in a level 3 charger as well if they have that kind of power easily accessible and there is the demand for it. These are relatively cheap to install in the right circumstances and a level 3 charger could be generating maybe $80 per hour of revenue with no staff required.
Also I suspect almost no one will do a full charge at these, for a smaller car, even half an hour on a level 2 gets you 20-40 miles range.
 
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I replaced my 21 year old BMW a year ago last August. A new Tesla Model 3 was price competitive with a new or newer BMW, Mercedes or Lexus. And it's increased in value since I bought it.

In my experience (and I have a garage) a Tesla is ideal for local use. It would be ideal for any reasonable length commute. The Model 3 Standard Range Plus is okay on a cross country drive though you do have to be organized and plan ahead; an ICE vehicle would be more convenient.

But then again I don't know of any vehicle that is ideal for everything.

When at home, it takes a few seconds to recharge after every use - which is much quicker than the usual fueling up process.

After 16 month's almost daily use it still has over 400 Km range. I didn't know how to check it when it was new so I can't compare.
 
Mark Ruess mentioned this in one of his interviews about GMs transition to EVs. I recall him saying that dealers would install multiple kinds of chargers depending on need, infrastructure availability and support, as well as committment to brand servicing. Owning an EV is a personal decision and I personally dont try to judge anyone for making the decision in that regard.

I am a huge believer in that we all need to be happy with what we drive given the costs and tradeoffs of owning any vehicle as costs to do so keep increasing.
 
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I just wonder if they'll install a boost transformer to increase the usual 208V found in a commercial building with 3-phase power to the 240V a level 2 charger needs to give maximum charge rate.
 
Kira said:
A corporate decision was made. Installing chargers nationwide (worldwide?) likely isn't the brainwork of one person.
I love how people affix blame as if they know what they are talking about. It's always so neatly bullseyed.
Ever notice how 'pat' today's arguments are? It's always boils down to just one person or just one reason....as if life's developments occur in a vacuum.

Playing the "caveman from the past who doesn't understand anything new" card, is a little tired.
Honestly, the number of people here who exclaim the limitations of EVs as if they discovered it is amazing.
EV makers publish their vehicle's ranges.
If they obscure the ease of recharging, that's on them.....but don't act like that EV's inability to go from NY to LA is something they've been hiding.

That so many trips are local and capable of being done with any nascent tech car is a fact which should be common knowledge.
Macy's had electric delivery trucks in New Jersey in the '20's and '30's; my dad saw them.
Nobody ever thought one was going to drive to Atlanta.

Some people react to electric cars like a kid to castor oil. Use the tool where it's effective. Buy one or not.
Click to expand...
Which is fine - if EVs weren't being forced on us. If the people want them, let them buy them. But same for ICE - if people want them, keep building them as well. Instead, the powers that be seem to want to force us onto a technology that can't truly replace the predecessor yet in all use cases that people are accustomed to.
 
JeffKeryk said:
Human nature is avoidance to change. Post after post sez EVs have to be like ICE vehicles to be widely accepted. Human nature...
Well, here's some facts for you: The Model Y, a very expensive vehicle, will be the #4 (or higher) selling car in the world this year, of any kind.
In 2023 or 2024 it is expected to take the #1 spot. The Model Y is already the #1 vehicle by revenue. Perhaps it is already accepted?

But to your price point; what if Tesla releases a Model 2, or whatever Musk calls it?

Regarding GM chargers, GM has to charge their demonstrators, right? Can't just plug 'em into 120 for that whopping 4 mph!
Click to expand...
Model Y #17 in USA 2021 cars sales and just because it’s expensive does not overshadow the fact it’s just a pinhead world wide of total vehicle sales of much less expensive cars.
Forward looking statements is just fortune telling for 2024, I’ll make my own, and Tesla’s market share will continue to shrink as it has been doing with new EV makes hitting the market.
Not that its a bad thing it’s just an inconvenient truth of new competition.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/g36005989/best-selling-cars-2021/
 
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EV Hater: “There’s not enough chargers in rural areas, so EVs will never work”

GM: “OK, we’ll install 40,000 chargers at dealers in even the smallest of towns and even let the dealers choose where else to install them in their small town, because they know their towns the best”

EV Hater: “Aghhh, but I hate it!


Straight from GM:
Through the Dealer Community Charging Program, GM and its dealers are working together to expand charging access in communities, including underserved rural and urban areas where EV charging is often limited or non-existent.
Click to expand...
https://news.gm.com/newsroom.detail.html/Pages/news/us/en/2022/dec/1207-charging.html


This is of course in addition to the 3,250 DC fast chargers GM, Pilot and EVgo are installing.

Having more Level 2 chargers is actually a good thing. No point in blocking a DC fast charger when you don’t need one.
 
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