GM 0w-40, Super Tech 0w-40, M1FS 0w-40, and Supercar.

[4WD]

I've watched that video too. What I found interesting was it was the lower rod bearing that failed. I never saw a lower rod bearing fail before the upper in my, almost, 60 years of wrenching.

Some speculation about the crank dimensions at this time …

 

[buster]

Basically they threw SA out the window, and they probably fast tracked all 0w40's to keep confusion down being there are now several. Make it customer foolproof so anyone that walks into a AZ and grabs the ESP 0w40 by mistake at least has the dexos R approval.

While viscosity may help, this to me is more of a manufacturing defect of some sort where a heavier viscosity may help. I'm skeptical it will.

 

[Navi]

While viscosity may help, this to me is more of a manufacturing defect of some sort where a heavier viscosity may help. I'm skeptical it will.

I can say expertly quite a few manufacturing defects in this GM vehicle beyond the engine...

 

[cammyfive79]

I can’t follow the first part of your reply - but my 2022 is on a dealership warranty that requires them to do the oil changes. So that’s still the P66 0W20, but it’s a 5.3L as is my 2017 which ran 0W20 for 60k.
I run it to +/- 60% OLM and then boost with 2 quarts EC30 which is a mono with ester and moly etc …
(Hopefully it keeps it clean - 5 minutes with Fumoto, no ramps) …

Wait....do you add 2qts EC30 to the already full sump when you reach 60%?? Or are you draining 2qts of whatever is in there and replacing with EC30?

 

[cammyfive79]

Which is what I am thinking this is, a delay. well said

The same can be conjectured about the extended drain interval OEM free maintenance programs; throw any long term issues on the customer after the warranty period comes to an end. I read yesterday that Hyundai was doing away with their free maintenance program presumably in a cost cutting effort to hedge against tariffs.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

And also if they start using the oil as new, CAFE under the rug?

Guess that thicker oil stuff about thicker oils causing impacts to the fleet mileage has been BS all along, just like experts here reminded people hundreds, if not thousands of times.

All engines have a limit of a minimum HT/HS & MOFT to keep hard parts apart. It’s not a recommendation, it’s a requirement… just because there may be CAFE benefits or mileage claims, they don’t trump reality.

 

[4WD]

Wait....do you add 2qts EC30 to the already full sump when you reach 60%?? Or are you draining 2qts of whatever is in there and replacing with EC30?

Note Fumoto comment

 

[loneryder]

I watched a new YT video last night from "I Do Cars" regarding an L87 engine that precedes the recall range, but has the exact same issue. The engine had nearly cooked one of the crank/rod journals to a crispy black; clearly a lack of "lubrication" to some degree.
Note: cannot link the video here due to embedded profanity.

He called into question the range of the recall, as well as why some other platforms don't seem to have the problems even though they are of the same displacement (Camaro and 'Vette) and timeframe. Further, many engines have used the same con-rod bearings for several iterations of engines with no problems, so it cannot be the bearings themselves. He alluded to the fact that it might be a manufacturing issue with the crank and not a design issue, but had no proof; only conjecture. If so, I don't see how a thicker oil is going to stop these failures, though it may delay them outside of warranty.

As time goes on, I think we'll see little parts of evidence start to amalgamate into the full story, but it will take time.

Have they ever recommended 0-20 in a Corvette or Camaro??

 

[frankbee3]

I watched a new YT video last night from "I Do Cars" regarding an L87 engine that precedes the recall range, but has the exact same issue. The engine had nearly cooked one of the crank/rod journals to a crispy black; clearly a lack of "lubrication" to some degree.
Note: cannot link the video here due to embedded profanity.

He called into question the range of the recall, as well as why some other platforms don't seem to have the problems even though they are of the same displacement (Camaro and 'Vette) and timeframe. Further, many engines have used the same con-rod bearings for several iterations of engines with no problems, so it cannot be the bearings themselves. He alluded to the fact that it might be a manufacturing issue with the crank and not a design issue, but had no proof; only conjecture. If so, I don't see how a thicker oil is going to stop these failures, though it may delay them outside of warranty.

As time goes on, I think we'll see little parts of evidence start to amalgamate into the full story, but it will take time.

I watched the same video last night. That poor engine must have experienced a flat rate mechanic at least once during its hard life.

I didn’t notice any profanity in Eric’s video. He is normally well spoken and doesn’t use bad language. He is one of the most decent shows on YouTube in my opinion.

I am curious to see what the failure mode is though. Poor oiling, tolerance, bad batch of material, or contamination during manufacturing? Mather several things stacked up?

I wouldn’t be happy to find out about the recall if I had one of the recall cars though..

 

[haggler]

The fact that GM "verified" Dexos R out of M1 vanilla 0w-40 and ESPx4 basically over night indicates super car was a cash grab on corvette owners (and Camaro LT1). This wasn't done for Camaro or Corvette owners.
This to me indicates there will be future changes to recommendations in the manual. Like in 19' for Camaro v8s when 0w40 esp was "recommend" as the only track and street oil (5w30 d1g3 "allowed" for street only). This last time I used 5w30 ESP vs 0w40 Espx4 and didn't see much difference but I don't track.
L87 and later could see 0w40 required and 5w30 optional if not available.

 

[burbguy82]

Guess that thicker oil stuff about thicker oils causing impacts to the fleet mileage has been BS all along, just like experts here reminded people hundreds, if not thousands of times.

All engines have a limit of a minimum HT/HS & MOFT to keep hard parts apart. It’s not a recommendation, it’s a requirement… just because there may be CAFE benefits or mileage claims, they don’t trump reality.

i have theorized that the light oil thing at least in some cases, is geared toward an engineered failure, under the guise of CAFE.

To me this topic is profound.

I could see, in my limited knowledge of oil, that a light oil could perfom well in some engines, under some conditions. A "heavy" pickup either pulling a trailer, or using all 400+ hp at WOT is not one of them.

under x power, and y weight, z is required to keep those parts from each other sort of thing. again no expert, but them boys at gm seem to rhink that a thicker oil is the fix

 

[edyvw]

i have theorized that the light oil thing at least in some cases, is geared toward an engineered failure, under the guise of CAFE.

To me this topic is profound.

I could see, in my limited knowledge of oil, that a light oil could perfom well in some engines, under some conditions. A "heavy" pickup either pulling a trailer, or using all 400+ hp at WOT is not one of them.

under x power, and y weight, z is required to keep those parts from each other sort of thing. again no expert, but them boys at gm seem to rhink that a thicker oil is the fix

Short trips, super cold areas benefit from thinner oils.
But CAFE does not work that way.
Auto stop/start is another example. We traded starters and engine mounts for 1mpg.

 

[burbguy82]

Short trips, super cold areas benefit from thinner oils.
But CAFE does not work that way.
Auto stop/start is another example. We traded starters and engine mounts for 1mpg.

i agree. in 2010 i moved to wyoming, where in rhe morning it was -40.

i was running 10w30 in my tahoe, switched to 0w30 and there was a huge difference in startup.

 

[Patman]

Have they ever recommended 0-20 in a Corvette or Camaro??

Never

 

[edyvw]

i agree. in 2010 i moved to wyoming, where in rhe morning it was -40.

i was running 10w30 in my tahoe, switched to 0w30 and there was a huge difference in startup.

I was more referring to KV100.
0W30 you are using is probably AFE? Or some other ILSAC oil. At the same time you have 0W30 like Castrol Edge that I use currently in BMW and Toyota and that is HTHS 3.5 or higher oil.
But in really cold areas, very short tripping, thin oils like 0W20 are beneficial as engines don’t sometimes reach operating temperature at all. You actually want thin stuff there as it flows better at KV40.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

i have theorized that the light oil thing at least in some cases, is geared toward an engineered failure, under the guise of CAFE.

To me this topic is profound.

I could see, in my limited knowledge of oil, that a light oil could perfom well in some engines, under some conditions. A "heavy" pickup either pulling a trailer, or using all 400+ hp at WOT is not one of them.

under x power, and y weight, z is required to keep those parts from each other sort of thing. again no expert, but them boys at gm seem to rhink that a thicker oil is the fix

I don’t know how to breach this topic faithfully without violating multiple board rules, so I didn’t. But your idea just touches one of my theories in the first paragraph. Now, rather than part question, turn it into an imperative and put hundreds of millions of “free” money into that equation… and it starts to make more sense

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

The fact that GM "verified" Dexos R out of M1 vanilla 0w-40 and ESPx4 basically over night indicates super car was a cash grab on corvette owners (and Camaro LT1). This wasn't done for Camaro or Corvette owners.
This to me indicates there will be future changes to recommendations in the manual. Like in 19' for Camaro v8s when 0w40 esp was "recommend" as the only track and street oil (5w30 d1g3 "allowed" for street only). This last time I used 5w30 ESP vs 0w40 Espx4 and didn't see much difference but I don't track.
L87 and later could see 0w40 required and 5w30 optional if not available.

All of the dexos scheme is a cash grab. GM charges oil manufacturers for every single quart that carries a license number. The rest of your argument is irrelevant after that.

 

[loneryder]

Never

I didn’t think so.

 

[Sienna dude]

This is a new thread that is kind of joining a few different threads. I find this topic to be very disingenuous as a whole, and looking for those opinions here about the fact pattern that these events elude to.

There are a few things I find interesting and coincidental and untruthful all at the same time..........

1.) About a month before the GM recall change, Supertech shows up with a random 0w40 with no approvals on the bottle, at the same price or more than M1 FS

2.) M1 FS all of a sudden is (by GM) a Dexos R rated oil, even though it has not had that approval in the past, nor does it still have it on the bottle as of yesterday.

I wonder how long GM knew that these engines AND I SUSPECT THERE WILL BE OTHERS< like the 5.3, and any other truck engine that is calling for 0w20.......were failing do to whatever, be it lack of lube, or bad materials, etc......

How many people have paid for this issue already, and got a new engine.? Even with the years before the recall.

I have been a GM truck guy my whole life, and I am glad they are making the "fix".......but their level of trust for me has been hurt. They need to take full ownership, Toyota style..........

I get it, you need the stuff in place to fix the issue, before you announce the issue......i get it, but how long has this been known at GM, years and years? Is it just to the point where there is no hiding it?

You are right. They need to give brand new motors to people, like Toyota. Oil filter, oil and oil cap deal is the biggest joke ever. Every owner will now be nervous that how much damage was done to their motor before the "fix"

 

[Sienna dude]

I have been using 0W-20 in my Honda and Ford F-150 V8 for years without any problems but after reading all this hype about heavier oils I am seriously considering just moving up to heavier weights in these vehicles. On the other had I kind of doubt weather switching to a heavier weight on the 6.2 GM engines will help that much. IMO it's more of an engine design problem than an oil problem.

Your Honda is fine, sleep like a log at night.