Fun with a 1998 Plymouth Voyager

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Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
I've done my good deed for the week and hopefully she won't let the people who worked on this thing touch it again. I simply cannot believe some people.

Well done and good on you for going out of your way to help her out. Kudos.
 
Sounds like an excellent Sunday afternoon neighbor get together project.
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1. Cars are tough. Enough said.

2. She is lucky to have a neighbor like you OP. Good job for taking care of her.
 
So, update: My wife just got a text from her, it is "leaking something and acting funny". It is still running (good) but the "warranty" on the refurb tranny install was apparently only 30 days, and it was out of commission for 30 days because of the ignition issue.

I haven't had a chance to go see where it is leaking, or to ask her, it may be minor but this was my concern with respect to putting any money into it, as given the quality of the other work that was done, my fear that the work done when the transmission was replaced may have been of the same calibre. I t would seem my fears may have been reaffirmed here unfortunately
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I hope it is something minor, but I am doubting it.
 
I think the best thing you can do is steer her into a more reliable model if she has buy a new car. Hoping you can get it fixed though. Mopar FWD transmission issues are never fun.
 
Just spoke to her on the phone, it is leaking ATF. There's a reputable tranny shop like two blocks from her house, I've advised her to take it there tomorrow and get an estimate. This will determine where we go from here.
 
I was a Mopar tech at a dealer in the late 90's and we used to see some of those vans that were so poorly take care of that it was just depressing. The soccer mom knows where to put the key, the gas, and witch pedals make it go and stop, and that's about it. Maintenance isn't something that's needed,lol.

One thing we used to see constantly was the vans not shifting out of first gear. I'm talking vans less than 6 months old. WHat was the issue????? One of the easiest wires to get to under the dash was always the wire alarm installers would tap into for the new alarm. It caused an issue with the control module and the trans wouldn't shift out of 1st. For the 2 years I was at that dealer we got at least one van in a week with this problem.
 
Originally Posted By: eljefino
I briefly had a y2k town & country. Gave up on it. Had lots of low-lead-solder gremlins.

And this main engine wiring harness fault. Spliced around it.



There are some interesting electrical issues with this era of Chrysler vehicles it seems. I am trying to sort out a 2000 Dakota 4.7 that I really don't have time for, and while looking into why it may be throwing P0171 and [censored] PS fluid everywhere, I discovered that the PS pressure switch can leak into its connector, the fluid can then wick down the harness, and go to the bank 1 O2 sensor connector, causing my problems (maybe). If you're lucky it stops there...I have a gut feeling I'm not lucky, but I have a PS pressure hose, O2 sensor, and pressure switch on hand whenever our shop at work or I can get around to looking into it. A PS leak killing an O2 sensor and maybe more...nice, that deserves some kind of engineering award.

Good call on assessing before getting the shift cable OVERKILL. Often with vehicles like this, fixing one or two problems reveals a few more.
 
Originally Posted By: camrydriver111
30 days is pretty short for warranty, or is that the industry standard?


That's backyard mechanic who got the tranny from the wreckers warranty
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Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: camrydriver111
30 days is pretty short for warranty, or is that the industry standard?


That's backyard mechanic who got the tranny from the wreckers warranty
smirk.gif



And likely charged full rebuild price for. Some cut-rate mechanics really do a good job holding older vehicles together for folks who can't afford a different one. Unfortunately this van was taken for a ride by shysters.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: camrydriver111
30 days is pretty short for warranty, or is that the industry standard?


That's backyard mechanic who got the tranny from the wreckers warranty
smirk.gif



Yup...guess whose warranty is 30 days? Pull-A-Part.

LKQ is 6 mo/6K mi. That's as good as it gets with a used trans.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
So I was back from Texas for less than 24hrs when my wife asks if I could take a look at her friend's van, which apparently had been out of commission for over a month. I knew it was a MOPAR product but couldn't remember whether it was a Caravan or Voyager, not that it mattered. Apparently it wouldn't start.

My wife lends her the '06 to go get groceries and when she returns my wife brings up me taking a look at it. The conversation then entered the land of people with questionable aptitude who probably should not be touching vehicles and she's trying to replace this van because of it not starting. I discuss with her the merits of holding onto a vehicle that she "knows" versus buying another cheap used vehicle that is a whole other can of worms in terms of unknowns. She acknowledges this and then expresses that she is just extremely frustrated.

So I ask her what it is doing, she said it was randomly dying and then simply wouldn't start the one day. She had a "mechanic" friend come over and he:

1. Replaced the coil pack. No change.
2. Took the ECM with him because he was sure it was the ECM (WTH???) because his "reader" showed it had misfires (same reason he changed the coil pack).
3. Was going to come and change all the spark plugs (which had not happened yet) when she got frustrated and got him to return the ECM.
4. Said it needed a fuel pump.

He had then apparently cranked it until the battery died and then told her she probably needed a starter
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I brought over one of my battery chargers since it was late (and dark), hooked it up and said I'd take a look at it the afternoon of the following day when the battery would be charged and we'd have light.

So with daylight on my side I discover that he had not put the ECM back. It was connected, but it was just laying in the engine bay
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I decided I'd fix that later.

Do some basic troubleshooting:

1. Get her to turn the key on with my head near the tank: Yes, the fuel pump is coming on.
2. Check line pressure at the rail. Yes, we have fuel pressure.
3. Check for spark. Nope, we have no spark. Check the connection to the coil pack, it is not in great shape, the harness has been "repaired" and somebody broke the connector at the coil pack.
4. Closely examine "repair" which looked like a Jerry-Rig (electrical tape) and am able to easily pull one of the connections out of the electrical tape. Problem found I think to myself.

So I remove the electrical tape from the connection that was broken, discover that whomever had done the "repair" had simply twisted the wires together (no solder or shrink). I reconnect them, have her roll the van over and it starts right up.

At this point I have her drive the van over to my place so I can properly fix this. When she gets there I'm noticing the van seems to have the transmission slipping. She informs me that the cable is not well connected since she had the transmission replaced not long before this other issue started. I'm a little concerned what I might find.

And how
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So the shift cable is literally just draped over the top of the pole for the gear selector. The attachment and bushing is missing. Apparently the guy that swapped out the transmission decided that zip ties were sufficient here. They weren't.

I priced out a cable (the piece does not come separately) through my dealer and told her once we've determined that the transmission may hold up, that I could install it for her. I was concerned at the quality of the work performed, though it looked as though the transmission install, aside from the cable MIGHT have been OK.

So, I cut out the hacked coil wiring and solder and weather shrink'd it back together. Cleaned and then put some dielectric grease on the plug and it was running like a champ. Though I am concerned about the harness and why it was cut into in the first place.

This led me to take a look at the shift cable issue and work a temporary solution that was safe enough for her until we could change the cable. Pulling off the air intake tubing, nothing had been tightened down
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There was visible dirt in the intake tract, which, unfortunately, was not surprising.

I was able to use a rubber bushing I had in my toolbox to firm up the connection, then I capped it with a washer and clamped it firmly with a miniature C-clamp. Tested it, it worked properly. I told her that this was only temporary and it would need to be fixed properly soon.

Then checked the transmission fluid level. It wasn't on the stick.

Picard-facepalm.jpg


Put in a quart of AMSOIL Multi-Vehicle (yes, this takes ATF+4, I didn't have any and this fluid is "compatible"). Boom, we had gears. It was barely on the stick. Capacity is 9.1 quarts. I put in two more quarts and it JUST brought it to the bottom of the safe range, but I had no more fluid left. I advised that this would need to be rectified and that she would need to watch for fluid loss (there was no visible leaking) as either it was improperly filled when the transmission was replaced or it was losing fluid. Either wasn't good.

Re-attached and properly tightened all the intake plumbing, re-attached the ECM to the fender, re-attached the power steering reservoir which was floating around the engine bay and brought it up to the safe level (it was extremely low) and then took it for a test drive. Worked as well as one could expect for a vehicle this poorly maintained.

I hooked up my scanner, there were codes for both banks misfiring (not surprising given the connection situation) as well as a pending one for the transmission (again, not surprising). I cleared them, test drove it, and nothing came back.

She's now driving the van and it is working properly. Saved her a huge chunk of money, as she'll only be out around $140 for the cable assembly once I am comfortable that replacing it is worthwhile. The van has roughly 200,000Km on it (120,000 miles). This is its 2nd transmission, the first one died because it somehow ended up with a hole in the case. She didn't seem to know how that happened
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Anyways, I've done my good deed for the week and hopefully she won't let the people who worked on this thing touch it again. I simply cannot believe some people.


Awesome work OVERKILL!

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This leads me to believe that I have done the right thing in re-firing Antonio.
 
So update from the tranny shop:

It has multiple leaks going on including the axle shaft seals. Obviously new parts were not used in the transmission replacement
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She's not happy but really has no recourse through this idiot. The shop has quoted her around $400 to fix IF they don't find anything else wrong (that's replacing all the gaskets and seals that are leaking). They are concerned, given the quality of work (boy, that sounds familiar eh?) That there may be larger issues.

She's currently figuring out what she's going to do.
 
I'd get on the horn to the original trans shop and demand they fix it. Even if it's outside their so called standard warranty. They did a [censored] job and should fix it. Maybe a phone call from you instead of her will do the trick. If they hear someone that knows what their talking about they maybe more inclined to stand behind their so-called work. Being firm but polite goes a long way.
 
Originally Posted By: satinsilver
I'd get on the horn to the original trans shop and demand they fix it. Even if it's outside their so called standard warranty. They did a [censored] job and should fix it. Maybe a phone call from you instead of her will do the trick. If they hear someone that knows what their talking about they maybe more inclined to stand behind their so-called work. Being firm but polite goes a long way.


It wasn't a trans "shop", it was a mechanic friend of her dad's that did the work. She's going to have more luck going through her dad after him (which she's currently working on) than me calling him.

Basically, he installed a tranny he got from the wreckers with no degree of proper prep, this is the impression I get of the situation. And while a used transmission can be a cost effective way of keeping a beater on the road, the execution in this case has resulted in her being out more money than if she had just had a proper trans shop do it in the first place. Quite unfortunate but perhaps there is a lesson there? I dunno. Having a "buddy" that you don't know from Adam wrenching on your vehicle when you are on a budget has the very real chance of going quite sideways. That appears to be what has happened here IMHO.
 
Does she have the financial means to get a better car?

Owning a car this old while not being mechanically inclined is going to be financially painful.
 
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Does she have the financial means to get a better car?

Owning a car this old while not being mechanically inclined is going to be financially painful.


I don't believe so, hence it being a bad position to be in for her
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Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: satinsilver
I'd get on the horn to the original trans shop and demand they fix it. Even if it's outside their so called standard warranty. They did a [censored] job and should fix it. Maybe a phone call from you instead of her will do the trick. If they hear someone that knows what their talking about they maybe more inclined to stand behind their so-called work. Being firm but polite goes a long way.


It wasn't a trans "shop", it was a mechanic friend of her dad's that did the work. She's going to have more luck going through her dad after him (which she's currently working on) than me calling him.

Basically, he installed a tranny he got from the wreckers with no degree of proper prep, this is the impression I get of the situation. And while a used transmission can be a cost effective way of keeping a beater on the road, the execution in this case has resulted in her being out more money than if she had just had a proper trans shop do it in the first place. Quite unfortunate but perhaps there is a lesson there? I dunno. Having a "buddy" that you don't know from Adam wrenching on your vehicle when you are on a budget has the very real chance of going quite sideways. That appears to be what has happened here IMHO.


I can second that whole paragraph.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
So update from the tranny shop:

It has multiple leaks going on including the axle shaft seals. Obviously new parts were not used in the transmission replacement
smirk.gif


She's not happy but really has no recourse through this idiot. The shop has quoted her around $400 to fix IF they don't find anything else wrong (that's replacing all the gaskets and seals that are leaking). They are concerned, given the quality of work (boy, that sounds familiar eh?) That there may be larger issues.

She's currently figuring out what she's going to do.


It sounds not likely ?? But I hope they can cut her some kind of a deal on the work.

It's nor obligated or mandatory, but I feel sometimes people really do catch a [censored] break.

To me, it seems "giving up" when you ask friends and family if they have "a car" they can let you have. Sometimes, someone has one they don't use or don't use that much and help the friend in need with either gifting it or saying "here, use this.."
 
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