Front Suspension Rebuild?

[CrackyWainwright]

We had several cars back in the 80s and 90s (Audi 5000S, Mercury Cougar, Ford pickup truck, for example) that wouldn't hold an alignment after 100,000 miles. Repair shops told us that due to the complicated geometry of front suspensions, it probably wasn't worth it to try to repair the cars and that they were worn out beyond repair.

How true is this now days? Can front suspensions that will no longer hold an alignment be reliably rebuilt or will that vehicle always have poor alignment? What kind of shop could really do this sort of work?

We have an automotive program at the local community college where I live. I've talked with a few of the graduates, and they have little knowledge and NO motivation to tackle front suspension work. Many of those young men will tell you they would rather tear into an engine or transmission than work on suspension components. Is this the common view?

 

[exranger06]

You absolutely can rebuild a suspension so it's good as new. You just need to find a shop willing to do it, or do it yourself.

 

[HoosierJeeper]

Anything can be rebuilt. Not that many parts to a front end, just shocks/struts/coils, sway bar stuff, control arms, steering rack and tie rods. Ball joints. Less stuff to worry about than an engine or trans!

 

[The_Jeff]

There's lots of money in front ends. They still last 100-150k even though powertrains are good for 300k. Those tech grads are fools, and/ or the curriculum is inappropriate.

 

[Lolvoguy]

Originally Posted By: eljefino
There's lots of money in front ends. They still last 100-150k even though powertrains are good for 300k. Those tech grads are fools, and/ or the curriculum is inappropriate.


On a cost-benefit basis, I can see why the tech would rather work on an engine trans.

 

[Cardenio327]

Originally Posted By: CrackyWainwright
We had several cars back in the 80s and 90s (Audi 5000S, Mercury Cougar, Ford pickup truck, for example) that wouldn't hold an alignment after 100,000 miles. Repair shops told us that due to the complicated geometry of front suspensions, it probably wasn't worth it to try to repair the cars and that they were worn out beyond repair.


Sometimes it is something silly that makes alignments not stick to old cars. For instance, on MacPherson struts that are attached to the steering knuckle with 2 bolts, if those bolts are old and have been removed a few times they can cause camber to shift a tiny amount out of adjustment, which will have a huge effect on toe and the toe will have a huge effect on tire wear.

It really depends on how much you want to spend and how much your vehicle is worth to you.

 

[Superflop]

Just did thus sort of thing to my 02 saab a month or two ago. All new control arms, bushings, ball joints, tie rod ends, sway bar bushings and hardware.. then off for an alignment. Its no big deal only took a couple of hours.

Btw I do suspension repair at work often, its only a pain when the components are old and rusty.

 

[JMJNet]

Depends on what car/truck we are talking about? instead of generality, with so many types/brand/construction of car, it is hard to determine the issue.

 

[Kruse]

Since you mentioned a few Ford products, I have yet to see an alignment that wouldn't hold the settings on a Ford vehicle PROVIDED THAT ALL FAULTY PARTS WERE REPLACED. This includes my '71 Cougar that has a somewhat unorthodox type of front end, at least compared to later vehicles. However, I have seen a few vehicles that could not get into alignment because of faulty junk replacement parts. The old Ford Twin-I beam front ends just wore tires faster than other types of front ends, period.
Within the last couple of months I've replaced almost the entire front on earlier vehicles, specifically a '95 Mustang, a '96 Thunderbird and a '98 Ranger. No problems whatsoever getting them into proper alignment. While I can't talk about how they'll be doing 100K miles from now, the tires have been having zero wear problems so far.

 

[Rick in PA]

They've made things a lot easier with two developments. First is that lower control arms are available fully loaded, bushings and ball joint come installed. Second is "quick struts" the strut, spring, spring bushings and upper bearing are all assembled and ready to go.

I've done two sets of lower control arms. Not a bad job when you don't have to deal with pushing bushings and ball joints out & in.

I recently did a set of struts where I had to disassemble and install the spring on a new strut and new hardware (quick struts weren't available for the car). I did have to purchase a spring compressor for the job. Not a bad job overall.

I have a set of quick struts for another car. That job should go pretty quick (keeping fingers crossed), I don't anticipate any problems, 5 bolts on each.

The couple of cars I've worked on were all bolt-thru-hole, no slots, no shims. When I took the last one in for alignment the only thing that needed adjustment was the toe-in, and that was just a tweak.

 

[Colt45ws]

I have the parts to rebuild the front on my 02, I just need the tools to do it.
I agree there is no reason you can't do it.

 

[HangFire]

Originally Posted By: CrackyWainwright
We had several cars back in the 80s and 90s (Audi 5000S, Mercury Cougar, Ford pickup truck, for example) that wouldn't hold an alignment after 100,000 miles. Repair shops told us that due to the complicated geometry of front suspensions, it probably wasn't worth it to try to repair the cars and that they were worn out beyond repair.

How true is this now days? Can front suspensions that will no longer hold an alignment be reliably rebuilt or will that vehicle always have poor alignment? What kind of shop could really do this sort of work?

My decades of experience with Ford products is they don't hold an alignment after 125-150K without lots of new parts. With my previous Taurus, it was one part after another that kept it out of alignment after 120K or so until death at 172K. I should have just replaced everything at once. But replace enough parts, and then they'll hold the alignment. With an old 80's Ford Escort it may be a bad alignment, as there are limited adjustment options sans slotting mods, but once repaired it'll hold it, whatever it is.

On mileage, my 150K+ Toyota and 170K+ Honda still hold their alignments just fine, with zero replaced parts (so far). No strike that, I replaced a frozen rear camber washer in the Pilot (big deal). But that was a rust freezing problem, not a loose problem. I know sooner or later something will loosen up, and it'll be time to throw parts at them. I won't make the same mistake. Once things start to go up, I'll replace them in pairs at a minimum, probably just everything at once and get it over with for another 175K miles, or whatever it turns out to be.

 

[Oldmoparguy1]

A few years ago I replaced the struts, the rack, radiator, fan, motor and trans mounts and a half shaft on a 1994 Dodge GC with 230k on it. Up until then, It hadn't had any front end work for the 6 years that we owned it, has now over 243K on it, still has the original ball joints. This is normal for these mopar minivans. I have owned 8, we are currently driving 3, 2 with over 200k miles. These are the lowest maintenance vehicles I have ever owned.

BTW: The parts came from a 1995 organ donor, including a set of tires.

 

[andyd]

Originally Posted By: Oldmoparguy1
BTW: The parts came from a 1995 organ donor, including a set of tires.
Heh heh You cheapskate! I did the same with my BMW. With careful measurement of the tie rods, I even set the toe.

 

[Lolvoguy]

Originally Posted By: HangFire
My decades of experience with Ford products is they don't hold an alignment after 125-150K without lots of new parts. With my previous Taurus, it was one part after another that kept it out of alignment after 120K or so until death at 172K. I should have just replaced everything at once. But replace enough parts, and then they'll hold the alignment. With an old 80's Ford Escort it may be a bad alignment, as there are limited adjustment options sans slotting mods, but once repaired it'll hold it, whatever it is.

On mileage, my 150K+ Toyota and 170K+ Honda still hold their alignments just fine, with zero replaced parts (so far). No strike that, I replaced a frozen rear camber washer in the Pilot (big deal). But that was a rust freezing problem, not a loose problem. I know sooner or later something will loosen up, and it'll be time to throw parts at them. I won't make the same mistake. Once things start to go up, I'll replace them in pairs at a minimum, probably just everything at once and get it over with for another 175K miles, or whatever it turns out to be.


Within the next month or so I plan on replacing the stock setup on my Focus with the SVT upgrade. Since the rest of the suspension has 100 k miles on it, I'm planning on replacing all tie rods, control arms (incl ball joints) and sway bar bushings with new stuff (since it's going to be apart anyway, and i'll need an alighment regardless). I'm pretty stoked for the upgrade