Front L & R lower rear bushings to be replaced...
- Thread starter badtlc
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Is that the subframe bushing? Doesn't look like a control arm bushing.
I'm surprised that these are bad already on a 2007 model.
I'm surprised that these are bad already on a 2007 model.
Who said they are bad?
! SAFETY ISSUE !
NHTSA will want to know, and, if they REALLY are bad on that new of a car ford should replace gratis. Bring to Factory dealer where purchased and talk to the Sevice Manager. In fact set up a meeting well ahead of planned vist.
Be sure to Tell 'em to take a hike if they say, "We'll help you 50% of the bill"(which really means: We will jack the bill and help you 0%)
! SAFETY ISSUE !
NHTSA will want to know, and, if they REALLY are bad on that new of a car ford should replace gratis. Bring to Factory dealer where purchased and talk to the Sevice Manager. In fact set up a meeting well ahead of planned vist.
Be sure to Tell 'em to take a hike if they say, "We'll help you 50% of the bill"(which really means: We will jack the bill and help you 0%)
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Is that the subframe bushing? Doesn't look like a control arm bushing.
I'm surprised that these are bad already on a 2007 model.
First, these are not mine pictured. My arms haven't falling that far to the point they are rubbing. Mine still have about another 1" to fall to get there. The bushings are obviously torn or whatever you want to call it, though.
There are over 102k miles on the vehicle. I'm fairly sure they wore out prematurely because the rear brake drums are out of adjustment. the back wheel currently spin freely and IF the brake drums have ever been cleaned and adjusted it was at the 40k mile mark. So with the rear brakes not carrying any load for who knows how long, combined with the wife's penchant of using the brakes as much as possible along with some recent trips fully loaded, I think the front end had been carrying an extra portion of the stress it was not designed to carry.
With replacement and then cleaning/adjusting the rear brakes, everything should be fine.
Is that the subframe bushing? Doesn't look like a control arm bushing.
I'm surprised that these are bad already on a 2007 model.
First, these are not mine pictured. My arms haven't falling that far to the point they are rubbing. Mine still have about another 1" to fall to get there. The bushings are obviously torn or whatever you want to call it, though.
There are over 102k miles on the vehicle. I'm fairly sure they wore out prematurely because the rear brake drums are out of adjustment. the back wheel currently spin freely and IF the brake drums have ever been cleaned and adjusted it was at the 40k mile mark. So with the rear brakes not carrying any load for who knows how long, combined with the wife's penchant of using the brakes as much as possible along with some recent trips fully loaded, I think the front end had been carrying an extra portion of the stress it was not designed to carry.
With replacement and then cleaning/adjusting the rear brakes, everything should be fine.
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Oh, so those ARE control arms, and the bushings are that shot that the arm is essentially worked its way down to the bottom of the through bolt. Yes, those are toasted. The brake theory may be true, but I wager that the front control arm bushings are designed to withstand much more force than that. If they've failed early, the brakes might have been a contributing factor, but I think there may have simply been something wrong with them, like a manufacturing or assembly defect. Or even a design defect. It looks to me that the control arm's bushing "cup" may not surround enough of the bushing to prevent the migration that you see in that photo.
Is this is a common problem on your vehicle?
Is this is a common problem on your vehicle?
Remember my bushing do not look as bad as those pictured and my vehicles has 102k miles on it with not working rear brakes. My arms are at least 1" higher or so than those. YOu can just start to see the bushing coming out the top of itself.
I don't see how I could make the case of a design or manufacturing defect.
I don't see how I could make the case of a design or manufacturing defect.
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Remember my bushing do not look as bad as those pictured and my vehicles has 102k miles on it with not working rear brakes. My arms are at least 1" higher or so than those. YOu can just start to see the bushing coming out the top of itself.
I don't see how I could make the case of a design or manufacturing defect.
Have a bushing slide out of the control arm isn't a normal way they should wear, the rubber should break down or tear before it allows the control arm to move out of its designed position.
It doesn't lool like it allows the control arm to get really loose though, so I doubt there will be a safety based recall. 6 years and 100k miles is not acceptable life either so maybe ford has a secret warranty out on them?
Remember my bushing do not look as bad as those pictured and my vehicles has 102k miles on it with not working rear brakes. My arms are at least 1" higher or so than those. YOu can just start to see the bushing coming out the top of itself.
I don't see how I could make the case of a design or manufacturing defect.
Have a bushing slide out of the control arm isn't a normal way they should wear, the rubber should break down or tear before it allows the control arm to move out of its designed position.
It doesn't lool like it allows the control arm to get really loose though, so I doubt there will be a safety based recall. 6 years and 100k miles is not acceptable life either so maybe ford has a secret warranty out on them?
I've replaced plenty of control arm bushings and ball joints. It's very labor intensive. I prefer, now, to simply purchase an entire new control arm, often a quality one from eeeebay or discount online source. It renews everything, and is 4000% easier. Time is money, and it may, in the end be cheaper too.
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Originally Posted By: badtlc
I don't see how I could make the case of a design or manufacturing defect.
Again, I believe the rear brake issue should be a multiplier here at best, and not a cause. When the front brakes are used (regardless of whether the rear brakes are working), the wheel and tire try to slow while the car pushes forward, so the control arm pivots back toward this rear compliance bushing, and the forward bushing, which is likely more or less in line with the drive shaft, is used as the pivot. So this compliance bushing experiences mostly lateral forces as the control arm tries to push and pull against it, parallel to the ground. I don't believe there are any forces that try to "walk" the control arm off the bushing like that.
I understand that yours aren't quite as bad as the one in the picture, but the fact that another one is experiencing the same type of failure, and may have working rear brakes, leads me to believe that these premature defects are related by either a manufacturing or design issue. Ford certainly didn't intend for Escape owners to have to replace suspension bushings so early.
I don't see how I could make the case of a design or manufacturing defect.
Again, I believe the rear brake issue should be a multiplier here at best, and not a cause. When the front brakes are used (regardless of whether the rear brakes are working), the wheel and tire try to slow while the car pushes forward, so the control arm pivots back toward this rear compliance bushing, and the forward bushing, which is likely more or less in line with the drive shaft, is used as the pivot. So this compliance bushing experiences mostly lateral forces as the control arm tries to push and pull against it, parallel to the ground. I don't believe there are any forces that try to "walk" the control arm off the bushing like that.
I understand that yours aren't quite as bad as the one in the picture, but the fact that another one is experiencing the same type of failure, and may have working rear brakes, leads me to believe that these premature defects are related by either a manufacturing or design issue. Ford certainly didn't intend for Escape owners to have to replace suspension bushings so early.
Here is a YouTube video on an Escape with an identical problem.
There is also apparently a TSB on control arm bushing inspection from Ford:
http://www.phila.gov/fleet/Warranty Recalls/tsb09-05-01.pdf
It looks like an issue that Ford has seen before. As the TSB notes, even if the bushings are failed, it's not a condition where the control arm can come off the vehicle (it's still retained by the bolt), but the condition won't get any better either.
http://www.phila.gov/fleet/Warranty Recalls/tsb09-05-01.pdf
It looks like an issue that Ford has seen before. As the TSB notes, even if the bushings are failed, it's not a condition where the control arm can come off the vehicle (it's still retained by the bolt), but the condition won't get any better either.
Maybe buy a hockey puck and cut a couple chunks out to slip under the control arm back in that pocket? Put a bolt through to hold it there.
That bushing should only see lateral loads and no vertical ones, so I think it should work without transfering any vibration.
That bushing should only see lateral loads and no vertical ones, so I think it should work without transfering any vibration.
Just get the entire lower control arms from Rock Auto and replace them yourself. Much easier and you'll have new lower ball joints which are probably nearing failure at that mileage anyhow.
While you're in there, check the tone rings on the outer CV joint. They're known to have rust build up underneath and eventually break, causing ABS issues that can cause accidents at highway speeds. The tone rings are just pressed on the CV joint and are easy to replace if broken.
While you're in there, check the tone rings on the outer CV joint. They're known to have rust build up underneath and eventually break, causing ABS issues that can cause accidents at highway speeds. The tone rings are just pressed on the CV joint and are easy to replace if broken.
Get a replacement control arm from a reputable suspension parts company.
I am not sure about your car, but some companies do not even sell control arm bushings separately, you get stuck buying the whole arm.
I am not sure about your car, but some companies do not even sell control arm bushings separately, you get stuck buying the whole arm.
Originally Posted By: Cujet
I've replaced plenty of control arm bushings and ball joints. It's very labor intensive. I prefer, now, to simply purchase an entire new control arm, often a quality one from eeeebay or discount online source. It renews everything, and is 4000% easier. Time is money, and it may, in the end be cheaper too.
We got a winner! I didn't see this thread but my shop called me when the Escape was in and asked if they could just replace both control arm assemblies. The price was the same because the labor was more than cut in half. I was happy with that. In case anyone cares, I was charged about $550 for the job including a 4-wheel alignment. I think it was $450 for the control arm replacements and labor.
Also, the rear brakes were definitely a significant contributor to the premature wear, IMO. The rear brake drums were cleaned and adjusted. The rear-end now stays completely planted during braking where as before for as long as I can remember owning the car the nose would always sink by a very noticeable amount during braking. It drives completely different now. It was REALLY bad before.
And just for clarification, my old bushings were tearing/torn but had not torn to the point the arm fell down. I only used those pictures to show which bushing I was talking about.
I've replaced plenty of control arm bushings and ball joints. It's very labor intensive. I prefer, now, to simply purchase an entire new control arm, often a quality one from eeeebay or discount online source. It renews everything, and is 4000% easier. Time is money, and it may, in the end be cheaper too.
We got a winner! I didn't see this thread but my shop called me when the Escape was in and asked if they could just replace both control arm assemblies. The price was the same because the labor was more than cut in half. I was happy with that. In case anyone cares, I was charged about $550 for the job including a 4-wheel alignment. I think it was $450 for the control arm replacements and labor.
Also, the rear brakes were definitely a significant contributor to the premature wear, IMO. The rear brake drums were cleaned and adjusted. The rear-end now stays completely planted during braking where as before for as long as I can remember owning the car the nose would always sink by a very noticeable amount during braking. It drives completely different now. It was REALLY bad before.
And just for clarification, my old bushings were tearing/torn but had not torn to the point the arm fell down. I only used those pictures to show which bushing I was talking about.
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