anyone in the area that knows how to set timing ? i bought a timing light but i'm a retard, if someone could help a mental midgit i'd appreciate it...
Fresno/Clovis
- Thread starter Pontius Pilate
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Which engine are we talking about? Why aren't you in San Diego?
* What year Honda Civic?
* What are the timing specs?
* Is their a vacuum advance diaphram on the distributor?
* Fuel injected or carbureted?
* Has the distributor ever been taken out and reinstalled?
* Where are the timing marks located on the engine?
* Does it have a powertrain control module? (PCM)
* Does the car have a tachometer?
* Does the timing light have a tachometer?
Also remember that the timing must correspond to a specific engine RPM.
It looks like you are doing everything correctly from what I can tell.
* What are the timing specs?
* Is their a vacuum advance diaphram on the distributor?
* Fuel injected or carbureted?
* Has the distributor ever been taken out and reinstalled?
* Where are the timing marks located on the engine?
* Does it have a powertrain control module? (PCM)
* Does the car have a tachometer?
* Does the timing light have a tachometer?
Also remember that the timing must correspond to a specific engine RPM.
It looks like you are doing everything correctly from what I can tell.
1993
16 degrees BTDC at 650rpm for the manual
i don't know about vacuum advance on the dist, theres only the 4 spark plug wires....thats it, i know on most cars there is another wire that goes off to the coil or something but mine is either built into the cap or not present.... there are no vacuum lines on it that i can see.
fuel injected
taken out or reinstalled - dont know, i bought it with 154k, i know i never did....just took the cap off and cleaned it up
timing marks are on the flywheel, easy to see
PCM - don't know, but i doubt it.
tach - yes
my timing light doesn't, just a button that turns the light on... there were more expensive lights that had digital readouts and everything but at $40 for the cheapie thats all i could grab.
but doesnt it seem odd from a design standpoint that the distributor would have to be all the way retarded to get correct timing? seems like it should be in the middle somewhere from the factory.... i know when it comes time to smog they will not let it go with that, there are some kind of rules regarding how many degrees of timing it can be changed from the factory spec
16 degrees BTDC at 650rpm for the manual
i don't know about vacuum advance on the dist, theres only the 4 spark plug wires....thats it, i know on most cars there is another wire that goes off to the coil or something but mine is either built into the cap or not present.... there are no vacuum lines on it that i can see.
fuel injected
taken out or reinstalled - dont know, i bought it with 154k, i know i never did....just took the cap off and cleaned it up
timing marks are on the flywheel, easy to see
PCM - don't know, but i doubt it.
tach - yes
my timing light doesn't, just a button that turns the light on... there were more expensive lights that had digital readouts and everything but at $40 for the cheapie thats all i could grab.
but doesnt it seem odd from a design standpoint that the distributor would have to be all the way retarded to get correct timing? seems like it should be in the middle somewhere from the factory.... i know when it comes time to smog they will not let it go with that, there are some kind of rules regarding how many degrees of timing it can be changed from the factory spec
civic 1.5 liter D15B7 manual.... i go back and forth, mostly here in fresno though...
i tried to set it according to the book, i used a jumper to short the ECU so it can't make adjustments to the timing while i am...
then hooked timing light to #1 plug wire
then black clip to ground strap on engine
then positive clip to positive on battery terminal
started engine and it got to normal temp
then checked with light and it wasnt quite right, but it seems to be right with the distributor pushed all the way forward (retarded), i just can't understand why the timing would be correct while set all the way retarded, something is amiss and i'm not smart enough to figure it out... im sure it would take 5 mins to do....
i tried to set it according to the book, i used a jumper to short the ECU so it can't make adjustments to the timing while i am...
then hooked timing light to #1 plug wire
then black clip to ground strap on engine
then positive clip to positive on battery terminal
started engine and it got to normal temp
then checked with light and it wasnt quite right, but it seems to be right with the distributor pushed all the way forward (retarded), i just can't understand why the timing would be correct while set all the way retarded, something is amiss and i'm not smart enough to figure it out... im sure it would take 5 mins to do....
Are you able to get the timing in spec even though you have to turn the distributor as far as it will go?
It sounds to me like the distributor needs to be "re-stabbed." Meaning you would bring the number 1 piston up to top dead center on the compression stroke, timing marks on zero, pull the distributor out, insert the distributor back in while keeping the rotor pointed towards number 1 cylinder.
The rotor will turn as you are lowering the distributor into the distributor bore because the distributor gear is meshing with the cam gear; or whatever gear is used to drive the distributor. When the distributor is all the way lowered in, the rotor should point towards number 1 cylinder at TDC on the compression stroke.
Timing marks on zero.
If the distibutor is stabbed correctly, then it should be about 10d BTC at its mid position, so that you can reach 16d BTC before it's turned all the way.
It sounds to me like the distributor needs to be "re-stabbed." Meaning you would bring the number 1 piston up to top dead center on the compression stroke, timing marks on zero, pull the distributor out, insert the distributor back in while keeping the rotor pointed towards number 1 cylinder.
The rotor will turn as you are lowering the distributor into the distributor bore because the distributor gear is meshing with the cam gear; or whatever gear is used to drive the distributor. When the distributor is all the way lowered in, the rotor should point towards number 1 cylinder at TDC on the compression stroke.
Timing marks on zero.
If the distibutor is stabbed correctly, then it should be about 10d BTC at its mid position, so that you can reach 16d BTC before it's turned all the way.
I'm assuming the red mark is on the flywheel and the pointer is on the transmission housing, correct? The red mark also representing 16d BTDC correct?
yes the red mark is on the flywheel... it looks like this
mark -red mark- mark white mark
so there is a mark, then immediately next to that is the red dot then immediately next to that is another mark like the first, so it's 3 marks right next to eachother and then a big gap and a white mark, i'm assuming it represents 16d btdc
the pointer is above the marks, probably the tranny housing....looks like a V
mark -red mark- mark white mark
so there is a mark, then immediately next to that is the red dot then immediately next to that is another mark like the first, so it's 3 marks right next to eachother and then a big gap and a white mark, i'm assuming it represents 16d btdc
the pointer is above the marks, probably the tranny housing....looks like a V
Oh I see now, so then the pointer is not actually a scale with degree numbers, but just a V-notch? So then you aligning the red mark in between the V-notch right?
This is what I would do: Find out for certain what the red mark indicates; and if it does in fact represent 16d BTDC, then breath a sigh of relief and relax.
I once had a car that called for 22d BTDC, and I would turn the distributor as far as it would go until the vacuum advance banged up against the A/C compressor; at that point it was exactly 22d BTDC.
This is what I would do: Find out for certain what the red mark indicates; and if it does in fact represent 16d BTDC, then breath a sigh of relief and relax.
I once had a car that called for 22d BTDC, and I would turn the distributor as far as it would go until the vacuum advance banged up against the A/C compressor; at that point it was exactly 22d BTDC.
the electronic repair manual says
16d + - 2d (red) BTDC
heres the timing section from the book if you want to take a look
http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/8470/timing15dl.png
it might need to be restabbed, i dont know what could have happened/failed/worn out to need the timing completely retarded to be in spec.... are you familiar with the emmissions law regarding timing? i heard they only allowed like a 2d variation from spec to be allowed or something, and when the guy sees my distributor he's probably gonna pop a brick...
i think my car may idle up to 100 rpm's below their spec (650) if i were to adjust that to be 650 how much would that affect the timing mark? would it not have to be completely retarded, or would it need to be more retarded? my guess is more retarded since when the rpm's went up with the fan coming on the mark moved backwards toward to driver's seat
16d + - 2d (red) BTDC
heres the timing section from the book if you want to take a look
http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/8470/timing15dl.png
it might need to be restabbed, i dont know what could have happened/failed/worn out to need the timing completely retarded to be in spec.... are you familiar with the emmissions law regarding timing? i heard they only allowed like a 2d variation from spec to be allowed or something, and when the guy sees my distributor he's probably gonna pop a brick...
i think my car may idle up to 100 rpm's below their spec (650) if i were to adjust that to be 650 how much would that affect the timing mark? would it not have to be completely retarded, or would it need to be more retarded? my guess is more retarded since when the rpm's went up with the fan coming on the mark moved backwards toward to driver's seat
Judging by the diagram you posted, it looks as though the timing marks are on the crank pulley and not the flywheel, is this right?
Is the belt side of the engine on the driver's side or passenger side?
Which direction do you turn the distributor to advance the timing?
You may already know this but, you have to adjust the idle speed at the throttle plate while you are dialing in the ignition timing, so that you have 16d BTDC @ 650 rpm. Usually you would go back and forth between the throttle plates and the disributor until the timing specs are at the specific idle speed, which in your case is 650 rpm.
Is the belt side of the engine on the driver's side or passenger side?
Which direction do you turn the distributor to advance the timing?
You may already know this but, you have to adjust the idle speed at the throttle plate while you are dialing in the ignition timing, so that you have 16d BTDC @ 650 rpm. Usually you would go back and forth between the throttle plates and the disributor until the timing specs are at the specific idle speed, which in your case is 650 rpm.
"Are you able to get the timing in spec even though you have to turn the distributor as far as it will go?"
seems to be, the red mark is lined up with the pointer and is stable, until the fan for the engine kicks on then the mark will move slightly towards the driver's seat then back when the fan kicks off... the rest of the stuff you posted is beyond me....
seems to be, the red mark is lined up with the pointer and is stable, until the fan for the engine kicks on then the mark will move slightly towards the driver's seat then back when the fan kicks off... the rest of the stuff you posted is beyond me....
probably the crank, i dont know too much about cars...
the timing belt is on the driver's side.
pushing the distributor towards the trunk of the car advances it, the honda engines turn the opposite of normal engines so that may have something to do with it.
the timing belt is on the driver's side.
pushing the distributor towards the trunk of the car advances it, the honda engines turn the opposite of normal engines so that may have something to do with it.
Let me just ask you this: When the red dot is lined up with the pointer, what does your tachometer say?
550 rpm's, right about there... it depends cause if i drive it around for about 15 mins then park it in neutral it can dip and sit at about 350 rpms and idle there, then go up to around 450 then go back down to 350.... probably the fan kicking on
Have you tried to adjust the idle speed? I'm assuming since the timing is adjustable, then the idle speed should be adjustable too.
I would recommend that you go to PepBoys and pick up Haynes manual #42024. It covers Honda Civic and del Sol for 1992-1995.
The manual should tell you how to do some basic things such as adjusting the idle speed. I would imagine that it involves turning a screw next to the throttle body. The idle speed does need to be 650 @ 16BTDC.
As far as the fans causing the change in idle speed, this shouldn't happen. Are your fans electric? Because if they are, then they shouldn't cause any mechanical load on the engine what so ever.
I would recommend that you go to PepBoys and pick up Haynes manual #42024. It covers Honda Civic and del Sol for 1992-1995.
The manual should tell you how to do some basic things such as adjusting the idle speed. I would imagine that it involves turning a screw next to the throttle body. The idle speed does need to be 650 @ 16BTDC.
As far as the fans causing the change in idle speed, this shouldn't happen. Are your fans electric? Because if they are, then they shouldn't cause any mechanical load on the engine what so ever.
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