Fram XG10575 Good Replacement for AC Delco PF63?

[viscous]

"LO" specifically mentions "shelf life", by definition that's straight from the blender in an unopened airtight container container
A sump is "in service' so that's a different set of rules

Good point. I assumed, however, that if the synthetic and conventional exhibit similar oxidation characteristics in the sump, they would do the same in a sealed bottle. Perhaps not.

I would trust Fram’s range of pressures more than the AC Delco claim it bypasses at exactly 22 psi.

I wonder if GM is attempting to report the "midpoint" PSI of the bypass valve's journey from closed to fully open. Or are they reporting the "fully open" PSI? I had shared ryster's concerns, but perhaps I should re-evaluate:

The XG10575 might be better constructed, but I have serious doubts the bypass is rated at 22psi.

 

[ABN_CBT_ENGR]

Good point. I assumed, however, that if the synthetic and conventional exhibit similar oxidation characteristics in the sump, they would do the same in a sealed bottle. Perhaps not.

I can guarantee you not. Let me explain. ( technically this could be infinite almost so just the high points)

Remember, its usually the additives that start reacting- not so much the base oils.

New Sealed Oil- this oil just got poured from a high speed machine from tanks. Many of these tanks have heaters, agitators and dosing pumps. Some never go dry and only get cleaned during maintenance cycles ( maybe change overs). These are not sterile conditions nor are they laboratory accurate.

So, its very possible "dirty oil" has percentages in the high range, gets some air then it starts degrading albeit very slowly.

Same scenario but in a machine sump- here you have literally a 1-2 punch.

The oil is first subject to "no telling what" from the air, process chemicals, leeching, chelation, reactions, heat, moisture and even Arby's Sauce. That goes where it goes.

Then the oil is mechanically worked ( scattered, smothered, covered, sheared and served over hash browns)- this mechanically breaks down everything.

Some of these breakdowns stop when settling, others don't.

The best anyone can ever get is an estimate of oxidation that's trended over time and machine specific.

That's a lot of variables right there for a brand new oil.

Too many "what if's" and " what percentages of ingredient x is in this bottle" to drill down very deep.

Whether the base is dino or synthetic is a consideration but a minor one overall.

 

[viscous]

Let me explain...

Good info. I was aware of the lack of cleanliness standards for new oil, but it sounds worse than I imagined.

To be clear, I didn't assume that oil in unopened bottles oxidizes at the same rate as oil in the sump. I assumed that if the rate of "sump oxidation" doesn't depend heavily on whether the oil is conventional/synthetic, then the rate of "bottle oxidation" also wouldn't depend heavily on whether the oil is conventional/synthetic. Is this assumption incorrect?

 

[ZeeOSix]

Does the wide bypass range of the redesigned PH10575 seem suspicious? Did Fram redesign this filter properly so that it actually matches the 22 PSI specification of AC Delco PF63? Would anyone have reservations about installing a Fram XG10575 (Ultra Synthetic) in an application calling for AC Delco PF63?

Fram's cross reference tool says their 10575 is a replacement for the ACDelco PF63. So why would someone have any reservations? Fram specifies the 10575 for your vehicle. Isn't that good enough, or don't you think the engineers at Fram know how to specify their own filters?

 

[viscous]

Fram's cross reference tool says their 10575 is a replacement for the ACDelco PF63. So why would someone have any reservations?

Perceived risk is always higher with a non-OEM part. However, sometimes the risk is worth the benefit of potential better performance (e.g. longer life, better filtration). It's a trade-off.

...don't you think the engineers at Fram know how to specify their own filters?

I assume they do, but "aftermarket" filters are often designed to replace multiple different OEM filters. Perhaps the "aftermarket" filter isn't the best replacement for each OEM filter it's recommended to replace. Maybe the engineers sometimes recommend parts that don't meet OEM specifications precisely, but are "close enough."

 

[ZeeOSix]

Perceived risk is always higher with a non-OEM part. However, sometimes the risk is worth the benefit of potential better performance (e.g. longer life, better filtration). It's a trade-off.


I assume they do, but "aftermarket" filters are often designed to replace multiple different OEM filters. Perhaps the "aftermarket" filter isn't the best replacement for each OEM filter it's recommended to replace. Maybe the engineers sometimes recommend parts that don't meet OEM specifications precisely, but are "close enough."

The AC Delco PF63 is specified for more than one engine ... so the logic is really no different than an aftermarket filter fitting more than one engine.

 

[ABN_CBT_ENGR]

Good info. I was aware of the lack of cleanliness standards for new oil, but it sounds worse than I imagined.

To be clear, I didn't assume that oil in unopened bottles oxidizes at the same rate as oil in the sump. I assumed that if the rate of "sump oxidation" doesn't depend heavily on whether the oil is conventional/synthetic, then the rate of "bottle oxidation" also wouldn't depend heavily on whether the oil is conventional/synthetic. Is this assumption incorrect?

Based on my experience in testing both with all things equal- yes and I would vigorously challenge claims to the contrary paying close attention to the baseline claims they were based on.

 

[viscous]

I assumed that if the rate of "sump oxidation" doesn't depend heavily on whether the oil is conventional/synthetic, then the rate of "bottle oxidation" also wouldn't depend heavily on whether the oil is conventional/synthetic. Is this assumption incorrect?

Based on my experience in testing both with all things equal- yes and I would vigorously challenge claims to the contrary paying close attention to the baseline claims they were based on.

Oh, I see. I didn't quite follow your explanation in Post #42, I guess. Synthetic/dino is a minor consideration in determining the rate of "sump oxidation," but a major consideration in determining the rate of "bottle oxidation"?