Fram High Mileage questions and thoughts.....

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I'll start off my admitting that most of my posts throughout the years have been probably a little longer and filled with more text than is actually needed. This post will be no different. lol There is some back story, some questions, some observations, and other thoughts. You don't have to read all if it if you don't want to smile Fram High Mileage Oil Filters - I know that these have been touched on in the past, but this is my first experience with them. Two days ago one of my "buddies" asked me to help him change his oil since he is 74 years old, suffering from COPD, and just broke his arm falling. Me: "sure, come over. I'm actually at Walmart now so I can pick up the stuff. What do you want?" Him: "I ONLY want Mobil 1, the synthetic kind (I think to myself huh?? anyway..) 5w30 - High Milage. MAKE SURE IT'S HIGH MILEAGE!" -Side note. I can't wait until I am old and grumpy and can get away with hating everything and always being in a bad mood hahah Me: "Ok, got it. What kind of filter do you want?" Him: "A Fram. MAKE SURE YOU GET ME THE GOLD ONE! I DON'T WANT THE ORANGE ONE. They are S#!T -He then goes into telling me for 5 minutes about all of the engines that blew up because of those orange filters 50 years ago when he was young. again, hahaha gotta love it. Me: "Copy. I'll see you in a little bit" So I grab jug of M1HM5w30 like he wants, and a Fram Ultra filter He makes it over, I drive his '04 Mountaineer 4.0l up on the ramps. Drain the oil. Remove the old filter. He then grabs the bag from WalMart and starts yelling at me. Him: "What the h#ll is this!!!???? I SAID GET THE GOLD FILTER, I DON'T WANT THIS FILTER!" Me: "THAT IS THE GOLD FILTER! LOOK AT IT!" Him: "Are you stupid! don't you ever listen?! look at the one you took off, that is what I wanted!" So I grab the old filter. It is a Fram High Mileage. I guess I could see how in someone's eyes that it could be gold. He proceeds to tell me that he swears by the Fram High Mileage filters. He has used them for 111k on his truck which right now has 204k on the odo. So back to WalMart to get this HM filter. So, done with the back story and on to some questions. Does anyone truly know what is in the high mileage device that is installed in the filter? or at least have something better than just a guess? Fram says it has time released additives that save the world. Sounds legit. I would expect to see a high mileage filter that claims it uses some sort of special filter element that helps with older engines some how before I would expect to see a time release capsule installed into a filter. That being said, I don't see any reason why these filters would ever cause any damage to an engine by having time released additives that go off into your oil. From all of my years around automobiles, it is my opinion that for the most part engines are pretty tough. They see all sorts of abuse that most BITOG'ers would cringe over and 9 times out of 10 they just keep running. Good oil, bad oil, old oil, incorrect oil, additives of all shapes and sizes, heck; even solid particle additives. It seems to be that HM oils have a place in the market. They fulfill a need, or at least the perception that they are needed thanks to marketing. Does any engine actually ever NEED a HM oil? Doubtful. I've never seen an engine manufacturer state that "After 75,000 miles, a High Mileage Oil is required for proper operation. High Mileage filters on the other hand, I'm not really sure. It does not seem plausible to me that a filter manufacturer- one that does not produce engine oils, would be smarter than some chemists in a lab who are designing a high mileage oil. I would "think" that any high mileage oil would provide the same benefits as Fram claims their time release additives would. There are many people who use HM oils and claim that they have helped with their higher mileage engines. This may be accurate. Team up a HM oil and add a HM filter? You might have the stoutest additive pack ever for a high mileage vehicle. Now it has gone from good oil to super good oil lol. So regardless of if the filter is actually doing anything to help prolong the life of his engine, I don't really know. But given the fact that he has used them for over 100k and things are still working great, I wouldn't see any reason to stop at this point. I just wish we knew more about what is going on. I wonder if it would be possible to dissect one of these filters and send it off for oil analysis? I should email Blackstone and see if this is possible unless anyone actually knows what these filters consist of. That's it for now.
 
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I,too,have always wondered what that "time released additive" it. The thought of him grabbing the WM bag and immediately spotting the wrong filter sounds hilarious!! :^)
 

ZeeOSix

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Originally Posted By: Johnny248
-Side note. I can't wait until I am old and grumpy and can get away with hating everything and always being in a bad mood hahah.
I think that happens around here sometimes too - LOL. Motorking explained at one time what kind of goo was in that "time released casual". Supposedly it does work and keep the oil in better condition on old vehicles.
 
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been a while since i've seen one opened, but IIRC down in the Dome end of the Fram HM Filters, there's a Dollop of blue Goop. not sure what it is exactly, but it's the HM additive, that slowly dissolves through the OCI.
 
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The blue goop is unicorn tears. Good for you. I'm happy to help out friends, but only while they're pleasant and appreciative. Being called stupid would have meant the end of my free labor. You've got more patience than I do.
 
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The Ultra would be a better filter, higher efficiency and capacity than the HM, which is an extra guard with the additive basket. The additive basket is good stuff, but your running M1 HM which will not likely be depleted in any sensible OCI. The HM filter would be better paired with a cheap dino for a 3-5k interval which it needs the extra help keeping the TAN down and oxidation under control. They use the stuff on a much larger scale on the Fram TRT over the road filters, and they have proven themselves to double intervals the companies were using before, so the additives are proven with millions of miles. http://www.framheavyduty.com/products/oil-filter/fram-wearguard-trt-oil-filter-silver-tph
 

ZeeOSix

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Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
The Ultra would be a better filter, higher efficiency and capacity than the HM, which is an extra guard with the additive basket.
I wouldn't let the guy know the HM is essentially an orange can (EG) with a goo tablet inside. He obviously thinks the goo is doing something for him. eek
 
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
The Ultra would be a better filter, higher efficiency and capacity than the HM, which is an extra guard with the additive basket.
I wouldn't let the guy know the HM is essentially an orange can (EG) with a goo tablet inside. He obviously thinks the goo is doing something for him. eek
Or better yet,since he was being grouchy and grumpy,you should inform him he is basically using an Orange Can of Delight grin Or better yet since it has a nice special filling,it's an Orange Can of Desire haha.
 

Johnny248

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Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
I,too,have always wondered what that "time released additive" it. The thought of him grabbing the WM bag and immediately spotting the wrong filter sounds hilarious!! :^)
Yeah lol He's that kinda of old guy who is talks to everyone like he's known them forever and just says whatever is on mind. I've know him for a long time so I take no offense at him yelling at me and things like that. I just yell back at him and tell him to shut the h#ll up lol It's all good
 

Johnny248

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Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
It would be funny to tell him it's essentially an orange can and ask why his engine never exploded? He'd deny it was the same.
Oh god... I'm sure if I did we would be doing this all over again tomorrow with some new filter which he swears by and doesn't know about yet lol
 

Johnny248

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Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
The Ultra would be a better filter, higher efficiency and capacity than the HM, which is an extra guard with the additive basket. The additive basket is good stuff, but your running M1 HM which will not likely be depleted in any sensible OCI. The HM filter would be better paired with a cheap dino for a 3-5k interval which it needs the extra help keeping the TAN down and oxidation under control. They use the stuff on a much larger scale on the Fram TRT over the road filters, and they have proven themselves to double intervals the companies were using before, so the additives are proven with millions of miles. http://www.framheavyduty.com/products/oil-filter/fram-wearguard-trt-oil-filter-silver-tph
I didn't know about the use in the heavy duty filters. Thanks for sharing that.
 

Johnny248

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Originally Posted By: Bandito440
The blue goop is unicorn tears. Good for you. I'm happy to help out friends, but only while they're pleasant and appreciative. Being called stupid would have meant the end of my free labor. You've got more patience than I do.
It's just how he talks. He is actually a nice guy, he just yells all the time and [censored] about everything .
 
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Clearly his vehicle has gotten to 200k miles by adding something more than the manufacturer's requirement. Think of all those poor Mountaineer owners who only got 100k out of their vehicles because they used inferior oil filters. He is certainly smart or lucky that he avoided the OCOD or the Toughguard or the Extended / Ultra made by the same company. There's nothing like a data point from a long term user to prove beyond doubt that a product is worth buying and using. So you really need to get him on BITOG. We need more people like him to tell us all what works in the real world and not in studies or the lab. Lastly, I hope Fram and Motorking are listening and have plans to add some goop to their Ultra filters too otherwise we'll have to switch from Ultra to High Mileage once we get to 75k miles.
 
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Im not even going to weigh in on the OCOD and Fram HM discussion, but I loved your story! I was laughing the whole time crackmeup
 
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I don't know about the value or effectiveness of the "goo" in these HM filters, but you are a better man than me for putting up with this old guy's outbursts.
 
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Originally Posted By: R80RS
I don't know about the value or effectiveness of the "goo" in these HM filters, but you are a better man than me for putting up with this old guy's outbursts.
^ Apparently Mr. Tough guy here has now problem telling an old, sick gentleman with COPD who is set in his ways how the cow ate the cabbage. Good job...
 

Johnny248

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Originally Posted By: jk_636
Im not even going to weigh in on the OCOD and Fram HM discussion, but I loved your story! I was laughing the whole time crackmeup
Thanks smile
 
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As mentioned in a previous post this story is proof that 'no good deed goes unpunished'. And your "buddy" is proof that ignorance is bliss. As for the HM filter and HM oil. HM oil has seal conditioners that are designed to reduce or eliminate gasket leakage and other additives. The HM filter gel as I understand it is designed primarily to reduce TAN. Imo, one is better off choosing a quality oil and filter to match the oci, and run it a reasonable oci rather than relying on an unknown oil filter additive. The oil companies' primary business is to produce oil with an ad package to match, I'll trust them to know what's best for my engine. But if your buddy wants to pay $2-2.50 more for an orange can with the gel basket, his money, his call. Another thing to keep in mind, there was also a filter produced for many years called the Double Guard with PTFE (teflon) treated media. It was advertised and marketed to extend engine life. Turns out, not at all. I do really like your idea of sending the gel to Blackstone for analysis. Wonder if it can be heated to a liquid state without changing the chemical properties. Wouldn't see why not. I'd even contribute to the analysis.
 
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