Fram/Fram Ultra

[MarkStock]

Originally Posted By: sayjac
As for using cartridge filters, I also learned at the Fram labs that while more environmentally friendly, cartridge filter use on vehicles actually adds to the cost per unit in the manufacture of a vehicle. While the amount specified didn't seem that great when the total number of vehicles manufactured is considered the cost differnce is substantial. Just something to consider if more vehicles and manufacturers choose to stick with canister over cartridge filters.


Yes that's another one of the trade offs. But the number of used spin on filters with leaking oil in land fills is scary.

Fram sould probably be quite scared if manufacturer's moved to cartridge filters. Users would get a scare when they opened their FRAM filter box to find their filter was made entirely out of the same material as the box!

 

[KevGuy]

Originally Posted By: MarkStock
Originally Posted By: sayjac
As for using cartridge filters, I also learned at the Fram labs that while more environmentally friendly, cartridge filter use on vehicles actually adds to the cost per unit in the manufacture of a vehicle. While the amount specified didn't seem that great when the total number of vehicles manufactured is considered the cost differnce is substantial. Just something to consider if more vehicles and manufacturers choose to stick with canister over cartridge filters.


Yes that's another one of the trade offs. But the number of used spin on filters with leaking oil in land fills is scary.

 

[RiceCake]

Nice to see those filters recycled, but the fact is, probably more canister filters wind up tossed in a regular trash, full of oil, causing oil contamination.

The cartridge filters, well, should be recycled, but at least less oil ends up in the trash if they're just tossed.

 

[MarkStock]

Yes not all oil filters get recycled.

I heard that the recyclers actually reject a lot of FRAM's because they are not technically oil filters. Many consumers still remain confused about that one.

Update: You only see one FRAM filter in the video above, so it seems the message is getting through.

 

[Jim Allen]

Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Originally Posted By: DirtRacer53
I used to think that that Fram Tough guard oil filters were a decent oil filter (I already felt OCOD were junk to begin with) until I decided to cut open one I had in my stash. Now I wont let an Orange or Silver can touch my truck. Now I use Purolator P1's (or classics if I'm in a pinch) and I've been happy with them and I know they are a quality filter for the price.

When you cut the Fram open, what was it exactly that scared you? Anything like this?
Failed Purolator Classic
Or this?
Damaged Purolator Classic
Or maybe..this?
PureOne, more torn media.

As usual there are claims, but no proof of an actual problem. Thats believed because its Fram. Read the links with visual proof. Even with proof, responses are defenses and accusations because its a purolator. "you damaged it opening it up"!, "the pictures are doctored"!.

The whole OCOD thing is silly. "I don't care if there's a hole in the media, so long as there's metal end caps"!


Leaky, you hit the nail on the head.

This, "OCOD, slowly I turned" attitude is irrational. The one liners commonly seen are idiotic. I hear some occasional cogent and well considered arguments against the low end Fram filters that compares/contrasts design features and cost/value, but most often, it's a totally useless, frat-boy type comment. The design features are debatable... especially here at BITOG... but no design is universally good nor universally bad.

Face it, the number of oil filters built with fiber endcaps since 1962, when Fram implemented the process in mass production, may well be nearing the BILLIONS by now. It's an industry-accepted design that more than one company besides Fram uses. We will never be privy to actual failure rate data, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were pretty well even amongst all the different methods of retaining media. If the fiber endcaps were failing like "the internet" would have us believe, Fram would have either gone belly up or gone to a different design. Neither would OE manufacturers accept the risk of failures by placing Fram built filters on their new cars.

Personally, I will do my best to purge "OCOD" from my spoken or written vocabulary just to set myself apart from that particular "attitude." That doesn't mean I will be buying low end Fram filters because I don't think they are a particularly good value. But if that value judgement was to change, I wouldn't hesitate to go in the orange direction just because of the endcaps.

 

[KCJeep]

Very good post Jim.

I sometimes run them just to thumb my nose at the nonsense surrounding them. My only real issue with the orange can is value factor, not design. I've never had a "problem" with one either, and I can't say that about Puro, Champ or Wix.

My last UOA was during an orange can run and insoluables were .2 and it held up great. They work fine, but my favorite filter at entry level pricing is Motorcraft.

The Ultra appears to be a value leader in top tier filters, complete opposite of it's entry level cousin.

 

[Propflux01]

Then just a question for thought, knowing how companies are in to save money, why then, if the fibre end cap design is so flawless, does Frams higher end filters NOT use them? Seems to me if nothing were up with them, then they simply would concentrate the extra "protection" on the element itself and not what holds it in?

 

[KCJeep]

Originally Posted By: Tim H.
Then just a question for thought, knowing how companies are in to save money, why then, if the fibre end cap design is so flawless, does Frams higher end filters NOT use them? Seems to me if nothing were up with them, then they simply would concentrate the extra "protection" on the element itself and not what holds it in?


The fiber end caps bond really well to the media in the EG and TG according to Fram due to similar make up. The Ultra is totally different though, multiple layers of synthetic fiber media with wire mesh backing, thus the reason to use metal endcaps to "cup" and hold the Ultra's filtering element. A Fram rep mentioned that here and so did someone else who'd recently been on a tour with them, makes sense.

It's also the reason most filters with metal endcaps extend down a bit over the filtering media and "cup" it, it won't really bond very well with the media so some extra grip is needed. Fram's fiber media caps are flat, ever seen a flat metal endcap? I haven't.

 

[Jim Allen]

KC is right. You need a metal endcap/endcup with synthetic media and the wire backing that is absolutely necessary.

TimH.: Nobody said fiber endcaps were flawless but neither can it be said that metal endcaps are. The question on which is "closer to flawless" would be the one to debate but it can't be answered with the reliability data currently available.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: sayjac

Clearly in the case of ZO6's posted 14459, there was a failure. Having used one from the same lot and seeing something similar, imo there was some issue with construction. IIRC, seems that 14459 lot had two less pleats than some previous 14459's that ZO and I had both previously used and dissected with no issues observed. It's also one of the reasons, in addition to more media area, I prefer the PL/L14610's for their uniform tight pleating.


Yes, I believe that the 2 less pleats in the L14459 (vs the PureOne PL14459) contributed to that pleat bending over from the oil flow and tearing the pleat at the root on that Purolator Classic. Another thing about that filter was the media seemed very brittle and would not flex much and you could hear it tearing with very little flex from the media.

Damaged Purolator Classic

I used my last PureOne PL14459 and cut it open after the last OCI on my Altima V6. All was good, and it has 2 more pleats than the L14459 that had the failure. I'm using the PL14610 now for the same reasons that sayjac is ... tighter pleats and more media area.

 

[steve20]

don't forget about the uniform filtration standard across each specific Fram product line: all orange cans filter at the same effeciency, all silver filter at an even better level,and all gold cans filter at 99%+. Unlike the Purolators which have some exceptions (namely the 14610) which filter at a lower effeciency level: 40 mics instead of 20.

 

[steveh]

Originally Posted By: steve20
don't forget about the uniform filtration standard across each specific Fram product line: all orange cans filter at the same effeciency, all silver filter at an even better level,and all gold cans filter at 99%+. Unlike the Purolators which have some exceptions (namely the 14610) which filter at a lower effeciency level: 40 mics instead of 20.
When I looked at the Fram website,they only list three filters PH8A,3387A, and 6607 when they rate the efficiency.