Ford V-10 Lifter Noise (Ticking)

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fbergski

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Last May I purchaed a 2004 F250 CC Auto with the 6.8L V-10 with 56K on the odometer. Bought it from the second owner a Ford mechanic at a local dealership. I drove it prior to purchase and scrutinized it pretty good.

Just recently I've noticed (at 62K) that I've got lifter noise from the drivers side cylinder head. Looked at the exhaust manifold and cannot see any broken studs, purchased a stethoscope from harbor freight. From checking both heads at the valve cover bolts I can definitely tell a difference in sound between the two.

I can't remember ever hearing any lifter noise prior to purchase and right after as I normally drive with the windows up (normal in California). When I took delivery he said he had a full service done (oil, filter, tranny etc) so my guess is they use MC 5w-20 at his dealership.

Since he didn't have any maintenance records I did a oil change at 58K with MC 5w-20 to clean any gunk out if there was any. Then at 60K I changed the oil with VWB 5w-20 that I had purchased. I notice this ticking only at idle and when you go through a drive through. You can barely hear it if you are in an open area. I'm using the recommended MC oil filter.

So would changing from MC 5w-20 semi-syn to dino VWB 5w-20 cause this lifter noise at idle?
 
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Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Sure it's not the spark plugs?
Or the exhaust manifold(s)?
 
Just had an interesting failure on a 4.8 3V. The roller on the rocker seized, no damage to the cam. Just gonna replace the rocker. Thought it was a phaser.
 
These newer engines are getting pretty complicated with lots of bits and pieces any one of which could on failure cause problems. For me if I owned one of these vehicles with variable cam timing and other complications I'd use the best engine oil and filter I could and never run extended oil change intervals and trade the vehicle just before the factory warranty expired. I can't imagine owning one of these new vehicles with all their fancy gadgets on a long term basis. The resale value of a car with failed goodies has got to take a big hit.

A co-worker with a factory supercharged Mini just barley out of warranty had a vacuum pump failure that ate the cam chain that ate the engine. The dealer quoted $7K to fix it. They did not budge on the month out of warranty. And this with a Mini that was carefully driven and maintained, kept in the garage at home and work and never abused. Guess who's never going to buy a complicated vehicle, again. Guess who's never going to buy a BMW vehicle again.... This car is virtually scrap.
 
We're not helping the OP, but I'm with Jack on this complex engine world. I much prefer to give up some MPG and HP to keep it simpler. I like a nice, short and 'dumb' timing chain system so a pushrod engine is my favorite.
 
Originally Posted By: Chris142
Does the v10 have cam phasers?


My understanding is that the 3V V-10 does not have cam phasers like the 4.6/5.4. However, the OP's 2004 truck would be the 2V version, so it definitely does not have cam phasers.
 
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First - I'll move this to a more appropriate forum; this isn't about HDEO. It's a PCMO question, as seen in his last paragraph.


Next, topic; exhaust studs. He says he can't see any broken ones. I would only caution that this isn't where you should stop checking. I have seen more than one stud stay in position, despite being broken. The stud won't back out or fall out, but it was indeed broken and needed replaced. I worked on my neighbor's V-10 Excursion that had five of the ten driver's side studs broken, but one appeared OK until we went to take the manifold off. So it is possible that seeing them in place does not mean they aren't broken. Physically check them with a wrench. I would encourage you to take the manifolds off and check all studs.

Next, the 3v V-10s did NOT have cam phasing, as did the 3v 4.6L and 5.4L engines. That is because the V-10 has a balance shaft in one head that takes up the room that the phasers needed to exist. Therefore they could not fit the phasers in the V-10 3v heads. That extra balance shaft is needed to quell the inherent imbalance of the V-10 crank. The V-8 engines don't have the primary crank imbalance, so they don't' have that extra balance shaft in the head, so they can fit the phasers in the 3v heads. Just info at this point; none of the V10s had cam phasing despite valve arrangement.

Also, ticking can come from injectors. And that sound is often difficult to distinguish between a lifter and injector; they are very close together. It can be done, but it takes time and patience. One of the best ways to check for this is to swap the injectors from side to side. Yes - that's a lot of work. But trial/error is part of diagnosis at times.


I would suspect the exhaust studs first; it's the easiest to check for and cheapest to remedy.


However, if you think that your oil selection has caused the ticking, then there is an easy way to tell. Do a few OCIs back-to-back with those two lubes. If you can repeatedly make the tick appear and leave with the brand oil you've chosen, then you've got your answer. However, I highly doubt the difference between MC 5w-20 and VWB 5w-20 is the cause of your concern.
 
2v engine, I've checked injector noise with a scope and all of them have the same sound. Will physically check the drivers side exhaust manifold this weekend.

My post is incorrect the ticking is coming from the passenger side bank not the drivers side.
 
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Just my experience with the (very similar) 5.4L 2V:

1. It is normally the passenger side manifold that the studs fail on. If it hasn't been replaced yet, that should be your first suspect.

2. I thought it was fixed for '03, but if this engine still has the three thread plug holes, the sound of a backed out spark plug is basically the same as an exhaust leak. If the manifold is fine, this is where I'd check next. If this is the case, the plug will eventually launch.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
I thought it was fixed for '03


Long-thread heads on 2v 6.8L started in Nov. 2003.

4.6/5.4L were addressed a year earlier (Nov. 2002).
 
I went through something similar with my V10. Root cause was a small exhaust leak. Was much easier to diagnose after a few weeks when the studs fell out and the noise got much louder. I ended up replacing both manifolds and the truck has been fairly quiet ever since. I say "fairly" quiet because it has never really been silent. Mine has some pretty noticeable piston slap when cold, and some slight valve train noise.
 
I have a 2003 f-150 5.4 2v, 72k well mantained, it has a cold start up ticking noise (right side) for about 40-50 seconds. I am pretty sure it is due to piston skirt slap.
 
Originally Posted By: Lapham3
We're not helping the OP, but I'm with Jack on this complex engine world. I much prefer to give up some MPG and HP to keep it simpler. I like a nice, short and 'dumb' timing chain system so a pushrod engine is my favorite.


+1
 
Originally Posted By: Hullucorn
The 2004+ 5.4 3v's have the variable time system. (phasers,VCTs, ect.)


2004 F-150s got the 3V. F-250/350 didn't get the 3V until 2005. The OP's 2004 F-250 has a 2V engine.
 
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