Filters and oil analysis

westex39 · Feb 14, 2003

A question just came to mind. What effect does the oil filter have on the oil analysis? For instance, Mobil 1 5w30 with a filter that filters to 45 microns absolute vs. Mobil 1 5w30 and a filter that filters to 20 microns absolute?
Are our oil analysis being skewed by the oil filters we use?

Terry · Feb 14, 2003

Tex, normal spectography looks at 10 Um and lower particles, even bypass systems on a internal combustion engine aren't efficient enough to skew the results.

Now if you use a machine to recondition oil thats filtering 1/2 um, yes.

Terry · Feb 14, 2003

Wow, I found you guys....Good point Spector, what you look at in a spectrographic analysis related to oil filters is whether the filter is an impediment to keeping the oil wedge in place.

Flowus interuptus. cold start, high Rpm, full throttle high demand etc. Excessive lateral G in a racing or sports car.

Also a filter that goes into bypass and stays there would show increased engine wear more than likely.

So the efficiency rating of a filter is not what you are reading from wear values but overall operation of the filter.

Solids or insolubles readings are excellent for showing the efficiency of the filter to trap larger sludge components, the solids show the amount of residuals in circulation.

Hope that answers your question.

Ken2 · Feb 15, 2003

So...is a particle count of motor oil a better way to judge oil filters?

Ken

Terry · Feb 15, 2003

Could be if you are sure the oil filter isn't the generating culprit.

Spector · Feb 15, 2003

well then, is it a waste of time and money to try to compare filters via oil analysis results. From what you say there is no quick and dirty way to compare one filter to another, even on the same engine in a control situation.

???????????

Bror Jace · Feb 16, 2003

Yep, I now take oil filters and wipe the thread area with a little motor oil on a paper towel. There is a great deal of metal residue from when the threads are cut and I don't want those metals being mistaken for wear metal.

I just wish I could get at more of the filter's innards.

--- Bror Jace

Spector · Feb 16, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by Bror Jace:
Yep, I now take oil filters and wipe the thread area with a little motor oil on a paper towel. There is a great deal of metal residue from when the threads are cut and I don't want those metals being mistaken for wear metal.

I just wish I could get at more of the filter's innards.

--- Bror Jace

How about a vacuum to suck the shavings out?

TooSlick · Feb 16, 2003

I do think oil analysis can be used to evaluate oil filters, but not with a single test. If the filter is more effective in removing 5-20 micron particles, then these won't be circulating around in the system and generating many more additional smaller particles that would register on oil analysis. I call this "bootstraping" the wear process ....

For example, I have seen a clear correlation between using 3 um by-pass filters and significantly lowering wear rates in diesel engines. The primary mechanism is through removal of agglomerated soot particles.

In order to use oil analysis to test oil filters, you'd really need a small fleet of vehicles operating under the same conditions. You'd have to get baseline data on each and compare the wear patterns using the same oil filter and air filter. Then you could start running a matrix of different oil filters and see if you can impact the results.

TooSlick
Dixie Synthetics

Bror Jace · Feb 17, 2003

Spector, a vacuum? The residue I'm getting off the threads is fairly heavy at times but I'm not talking about actual loose shavings.

Take an oil filter you have laying around and wipe down the threads with a paper towel and a few drops of oil, you'll see what I mean.

Careful not to cut your finger on the threads ... they can be sharp.

I just can't see a vacuum being much help.

--- Bror Jace

Greaser · Feb 18, 2003

I've looked at every filter that I put on vehicles and very seldom found any shavings...but just in case I ALLWAYS use a little compressed air to give them a "blow out" before I install.

YZF150 · Feb 18, 2003

I use a magnet. I have a rectangular magnet about 1.5" x .5" x .25". I stick that in the outlet and swirl it around a bit. It is quite common to find fine metal dust on the magnet when I pull it out.

Bror Jace · Feb 18, 2003

Greaser, if you really give a filter a good shot of compressed air, you could rupture something inside ... or at least damage the filter media (blow holes in it). I don't know if you're doing anything wrong ... because it's all about technique.

YZF150, That's a good idea ... but I have no suitable magnet.

I guess I'll just stick to wiping down the threads.

--- Bror Jace

Greaser · Feb 19, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by Bror Jace:
Greaser, if you really give a filter a good shot of compressed air, you could rupture something inside ... or at least damage the filter media (blow holes in it). I don't know if you're doing anything wrong ... because it's all about technique.

YZF150, That's a good idea ... but I have no suitable magnet.

I guess I'll just stick to wiping down the threads.

--- Bror Jace

I have a reducer on my air gun and give it a gentle 10 psi from a distance of about 4 inchs..almost a bit more than blowing in it with my own breath...then look inside to see if anything is in there that shouldn't be...good to go

Norm Olt · Feb 20, 2003

There is a company that builds a 5-yr guaranteed Stainless Steel oil filter system (and I can't remember the name, dammit!) that allows you to clean it (to your little heart's content) prior to every re-installation.

System 1! That's it:http://www.system1filters.com

Even has a 5 micron sock (That oughta' do it!), and ss construction so toss it into the parts washer or run it under the tap.

Shouldn't find any shavings, paint chips (my favorite!), cardboard or dirt, etc.

Filters and oil analysis

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