Filter and cooler questions

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chenobylite

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Hi all. New here, first post. I'm looking for opinions on auto tranny and PS filtration, specifically some pointers on bypass or a full flow remote mount for the tranny on my Supra and one for the PS. Anyone have any experience with the little Magnefine filter in either application?

Also, not a filter question but I'd like to put a tranny cooler on another car I have. Does anyone have any experience with the billet coolers? Or how about this little number, both cooler and filter?

http://tinyurl.com/73t7x

I'm limited on space so I'm trying to get the most cooling bank for the buck. I realize a stacked plate cooler is best but I just don't have room for it.

Any input is appreciated...

Chernobylite.
 
When it comes to lubrication (engine or tranny), filters and coolers are great - you can't go wrong. I use the magnefine on my wife's space-limited Sebring. I suppose the smaller billet coolers would be great for space-limited applications as well. Some coolers and filters are betters than others, but ANY cooler and filter is WAY better than none.
 
Tnanks for the replies.

RJ, why do you think it's unecessary? It seems to me that PS is just a hydraulic system and the biggest killer of hydraulic systems are dirt and heat. And every PS system I've seen has a fine mesh screen already in the tank. If you look at that screen you'll be surprised at how much crude it collects so I'd think an even finer filter in the return would be a plus.
 
I use a Magnefine Filter on 3 vehicles on the transmission. You can buy them from Emerging Enterprises, one of our BITOG Site Sponsors:


Magnefine Filters

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I take a lot of heat from friends / family about my "filtration fascination". With the power steering a turkey baster fluid replacement is cheap and painless. I believe the Magnefine, while suitable on PS systems, serves best on automatic transmissions.
For my transmission I have a TP filter.
 
Gary: Much obliged. I've read a lot your stuff on here and it's always top notch. Vetteman: #7? I'm impressed
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RJ: I'd like to use a TP filter on my tranny too. I've seen the Permacool tranny remote spin on filter kit but I'm assuming it's full flow. I'd much rather use a TP bypass instead. How does one go about connecting it up? Is there a fitting with an orifice that installs in one of the tranny lines? There has to be some way of developing a differential pressure so oil is sent to the TP right?
 
If the Magnefine works good for the ATF it will work equally well for the power steering. If you have a lot of room you have a lot more choices. I put a large dual remote system on a a trailer towing Dodge Cummins awhile back. I was surprised at how dirty the filter was after only one trip from Dallas to the west coast and back. It is a new truck. The next change shouldn't be as loaded with wear particles. The power steering system doesn't generate as much wear particles but it doesn't take much to cause problems.
Clean is always better than dirty. My old Ford tranny has almost no wear particles. It is well broken in.

Ralph
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Ralph, I see you sell these TP bypass filters. How would I connect it to my transmission in such a way as to prevent full flow thru it?
 
A magnefine is a great add on. One local trans shop puts one on every refit. They all shed metal ..and converters do kick out crap from time to time.

As far as a cooler. I've never used a billet type ..but the frame rail type are very effective and are very easy to fit under just about any vehicle.
 
quote:
Ralph, I see you sell these TP bypass filters. How would I connect it to my transmission in such a way as to prevent full flow thru it?
Click to expand...
Until Ralph answers you ..I believe that there is an internal bypass that allows most of the flow to bypass the tp filter. I haven't gotten the "fat" on how this is done from a "nuts and bolts" (tubes and restrictors) POV.
 
quote:
Originally posted by dkcase:

Vetteman is now actually the owner of the site.

He is in fact Numero Uno -- but Bob Winters will always be #1.
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Click to expand...
cheers.gif


The inmates in this asylem are indeed fortunate to have had two consecutive keepers of the keys of such high caliber.
 
There are several ways to hook up a TP filter on a transmission. The way I did it on the Dodge Cummins is I installed a Perma-Cool ATF filter first then I put a Perma-Cool 187 Ford sandwich adapter on and ran oil lines to the Motor Guard. All of the oil goes thru the full flow filter but some is diverted to the Motor Guard first to be cleaned.
The Perma-Cool mount takes a 3/4"-16 thread filter so you can use the regular Perma-Cool ATF filter or a regular motor oil filter, such as, a Toyota, Chrysler, etc. The Motor Guard M-30 ATF is for putting in series with the oil cooler. It has an element bypass orifice inside the filter. Normally the orifice is in an external fitting. The reason I used a dual filter on the Dodge is it has 1/2" fluid lines. I don't see why you couldn't put a tee in one of the fluid lines for pressure and return the clean fluid to the oil pan with a self tapping hollow bolt or a drain fitting that you can find in an auto parts store. You would use a filter with no internal bypass orifice for that.

Ralph
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Ok, I think I understand. My car also has 1/2" transmission cooling lines so riddle me this:

1) If I add a Permacool full flow kit and parallel the MG with a sandwich adaptor (as you did) do I use a regular M-30 or the ATF model?

2) What produces the restriction in the Permacool full flow/sandwich adapter setup so some of the stream goes thru the M-30? The full flow filter is enough to do it?

3) Different subject. I have a second car with a factory engine oil cooler. The sending unit is a bear to get at and I don't want to drain to the pan. What options do I have? Will a sandwich adaptor on the factory full flow filter work using a standard M-30?

4)Instead of a sandwich adaptor can I use a M-30 ATF in series with the oil cooler? Remember we're talking about engine oil now and a different car. If so, won't the internal 1/8" orifice restrict flow to the cooler and raise my oil temp?
 
The sandwich adapter is a 181 not a 187. It probably doesn't matter but I would use the MG-30. Normally you remove the 1/16" orifice so that the MG-30 can filter all it can. The rest of the fluid the engine or tranny needs goes thru the relief valve to the inlet of the full flow filter. The spring in the relief valve in the adapter is what keeps the oil going thru the MG-30.
Some people are installing a remote oil filter mount with four ports for motor oil. They aren't using the sandwich adapter but are using the extra ports to hook up the Motor Guard. They are using the resistance thru the full flow filter to heat up the Motor Guard. One of the guys has three Motor Guards in parallel on a 12 valve Cummins using the four port remote mount. I think that is what Perma-Cool recommended. One guy in Santa Cruz, CA removed one battery to make room for the full flow filter and a Motor Guard. It is a Ford Powerstroke.
I do the system on large compressors where the pressure drop is 3 PSI thru a clean filter but I haven't tried it with an engine. The sandwich adapter is a sure thing for low flow rates such as my 20 HP Kohlers. You can use the MG-30 ATF in series with the engine oil cooler because you can get a huge flow of hot oil thru the 1/8" orifice. You can use the MG-30 with the sandwich adapter on the stock filter mount. The MG-30 ATF would have an advantage in vary cold areas because the bypass orifice would help heat up the filter faster.
I recently sent two MG-30 ATFs to the Edmonton Alberta area for a pipe line welder and the truck that hauls it. They will be used with sandwich adapters on motor oil. I'm not sure that Perma-Cool sells an ATF filter for large lines. They recommended a motor oil filter relocation kit which has 1/2" oil lines. the kit and the ATF filter takes the same full flow filter so it doesn't matter. On the Cummins I used a Motor Craft FL 1 A. on the transmission. I took a MG-60 off his Powerstroke fuel and put it on the tranny on the Dodge. He was concerned that the Cummins fuel pump was to weak to handle a depth filter. That didn't stop a guy in San Diego. He installed a kick butt pump that sounded something like Air Dog. I hope this helps. With a little thought you can make any of the submicronic filters do what you want them to. My experience is with TP filters. I have never seen some of these filters. I put an inline fuel filter with a transmission magnet on it on my tractor powersteering. If it plugs up the fluid line will break or come off.
The tractor already looks like a fruit tree loaded with TP filters.

Ralph
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Ok Ralph, got it. Thanks for your time. I'll be placing an order as soon as I figure everything out.

Btw, I looked at the photos on your website. The blue hose isn't Parker Push-Lok is it? If so are you aware that hose isn't approved for anything but air and water?
 
Here's a couple threads I posted about installing an Amsoil bypass filter on my transmissions:
http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=36;t=000178#000000

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=36;t=000125#000000

All my vehicles are now equipped with one and I'm very happy with the results. To summarize, I installed a brass "T" in the cooling circuit to draw oil for the filter, then routed the oil through the filter(the mount has a built in flow restrictor), and then returned the cleaned oil to the transmission, either into the dipstick tube or into the pan.

It has much better filtration than a full-flow filter and does not introduce any backpressure to the transmission cooling system.
 
Olympic, thanx for the links. It seems to me I could just put one of these TP filters directly across the lines going to my transmission cooler. Not in series but across them. Seems that some oil would go thru the filter just from the pressure drop of the cooler. Is my logic faulty on that?

I'm a bit confused. Why would the bypass filter mount need a restrictor? Isn't the filter media dense enough as it is?

What are those hoses in the engine oil install? Aeroquip? Considering everything involved in those setups that must have been a serious amount of cash.

[ October 10, 2005, 08:06 PM: Message edited by: chenobylite ]
 
You could try mounting the bypass across the cooling lines but I'm doubtful there is enough pressure difference to generate flow through the bypass.

The way I have my bypass mounted, I am drawing ATF out of the cooling circuit(after the coolers) and returning it to the pan. As I understand it, the ATF returning to the trans from the coolers is used to lubricate the output section. So the restrictor is necessary to limit flow so that the output section is not starved of fluid. The Amsoil filter is capable of flowing atleast 1 quart/minute, probably alot more. I wanted to limit flow to 0.5 quarts/minute.

I'm not exactly sure what a TP filter is capable of flowing so you'll have to measure it yourself. But if you manage to get it to work like you wanted(flow from one cooler line to the other), flow rate shouldn't matter. Your only concern would be how much fluid is bypassing the cooler and whether or not that might cause a problem with overheating.

I used an Amsoil BMK13 dual remote bypass kit on my engine. It's a complete kit that comes with the mount, hoses, block adapter, etc. Cost is around $200 retail, less if your a preferred customer. The trans bypass was very reasonable. About $60 for the mount, filter, hoses, etc. You could use this exact same setup on your engine as well. Just install a "T" at the oil pressure sender to draw oil, route it through the filter and back to the valve cover or pan.

I've actually remove the dual remote bypass from most of my cars engines. I've found that unless you're running uber expensive oil or have a crankcase that holds 5 gallon of oil, you're not saving any money with a bypass filter that costs $30 each.

Of course a TP filter changes all that because the replacement elements are next to free.
 
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