Few questions about ATF cooler line drain method

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I plan to use the cooler return line method on my 2004 Civic. I did this on my Nissan Frontier but it's was several years ago.

On the Civic, which line is the return line that needs to be removed?

Is there any reason to drain from the drain plug first (requiring a new plug washer)? I can't remember if I did that or not.

Does it need to be in drive to get all the old fluid out?

what size tube will fit on the cooler hose nipple?

I was going to buy two gallons of ATF.
 
I find that the return is usually the top line. Last time I did it I kept it in each gear for a few seconds to clear out the fluid.
 
The return is usually the cooler one after 10 minutes of driving (not idling). You get less mixing if the transmission pan is drained and refilled before you start the flush. Try 3/8" line that seems to be pretty common. You can look up on the Amsoil website by vehicle and it will tell you how much it holds. Three gallons sounds better than two. I would go with four to be sure. Can always return a gallon, but a PIA if you run out and are not finished. If you do not drain the pan first, you probably need 2-3 QTs more than total capacity. If you drain it, then maybe 1 QT extra or none extra.
 
Thanks a lot.

The total fill is 6.4qts. So shouldn't 2 gallons be more than enough?

Can anyone else confirm the return line is on top and that 3/8" ID hose will fit?
 
Originally Posted By: BrianL
Thanks a lot.

The total fill is 6.4qts. So shouldn't 2 gallons be more than enough?

Can anyone else confirm the return line is on top and that 3/8" ID hose will fit?


Feel which one is hotter after a 5-10 minute drive. The return line will be cooler; or while idling for 15 minutes, etc.
 
is it necessary to use return line ?
Can IN line be used as well ? thx
 
Originally Posted By: Ndx
is it necessary to use return line ?
Can IN line be used as well ? thx


IDK, but I'd imagine more risk of burning or potential for the hose you use to 'melt' if ATF is really hot.
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You can use either line. Take both loose, disable the ignition (pull coil wire or injection fuse), crank the engine and see which the ATF flows out of.

If you dump the sump first, you'll have a better flush that gets the transmission cleaner sooner. In any case, with a Honda, so much drains out of the sump that two or three sump drains is easier and does as much good as a line flush.
 
Originally Posted By: Ndx
is it necessary to use return line ?
Can IN line be used as well ? thx


Its best to do the flush so you flush out the ATF in the cooler also. Best but not 100% mandatory. You need to connect your clear tubing to be in the flow while the ATF is still being pushed. If you have your own piece of clear tubing, you can connect it at the transmission side of the supply line or the cooler side of the return line.
 
Originally Posted By: Ndx
is it necessary to use return line ?
Can IN line be used as well ? thx


No! There is no pressure on the "in" line, the fluid is being pumped via the pump in the trans thru the "out" line to the cooler.

Donald has the procedure outlined it very well. I agree, drain the trans and refill, then do the cooler line bit. You gotta figure on some wastage doing it this way, i.e. pumping out more than the actual capacity. If the entire trans hold six quarts, then 2 gallons is likely enough... assuming no mistakes of mishaps.

I disagree with the comment above that repeated drain & fills are adequate. Actually, I would say it's not ALWAYS adequate. There are two reasons to change the oil in an automatic transmission, to replace degraded oil and to remove contamination from wear, break-in, etc. A trans creates the majority of it's contamination in the first 5K miles, so if it's the first change, you want to evacuate as completely as you can to remove the maximum amount of contamination... and that's best done with a fluid exchange preceded by a drain & refill. I don't know if the Civics have that little filter (quite inadequate, really) that some of the bigger Honda cars an Minivans have, but for the most part, you have to remember that it's essentially unfiltered oil

For routine maintenance after that first complete change, if sone before the oil is severely degraded, I wouldn't argue too much against a drain & fill method.

If the fluid is really degraded, I would also point to a cooler line service to completely eliminate the old oil as much as possible.

If you plan to keep the car for many miles, I would also advise an inline trans filter... the Magnefine (Google it) being the most effective of the easy-to-install trans filters. It would mount into the "in" line wherever it's convenient and protected from heat or damage. It will extend the life of the oil as well as the trans.
 
Originally Posted By: ltslimjim

Feel which one is hotter after a 5-10 minute drive. The return line will be cooler; or while idling for 15 minutes, etc.

I had read that earlier, but was hoping someone knew for sure. When I drive, it's always a lot longer than 5-10 mins.
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Originally Posted By: Jim Allen
Originally Posted By: Ndx
is it necessary to use return line ?
Can IN line be used as well ? thx


No! There is no pressure on the "in" line, the fluid is being pumped via the pump in the trans thru the "out" line to the cooler.

I don't quite understand this. If it's a loop, if there's pressure on one line, why wouldn't there be pressure on the other line of the same system?
Pressure from the transmission pump pumps the fluid, so if you remove the cooler feed ("in") hot line where attached to the cooler (from transmission), how could you not have pressure there if it's coming straight from the transmission? You're just capturing it earlier than you would after going through the cooler and capturing it at the return (cool) line. Am I missing something?
 
BTW, do auto parts stores have this clear tubing, or only hardware stores?
 
Originally Posted By: BrianL
Originally Posted By: Jim Allen
Originally Posted By: Ndx
is it necessary to use return line ?
Can IN line be used as well ? thx


No! There is no pressure on the "in" line, the fluid is being pumped via the pump in the trans thru the "out" line to the cooler.

I don't quite understand this. If it's a loop, if there's pressure on one line, why wouldn't there be pressure on the other line of the same system?
Pressure from the transmission pump pumps the fluid, so if you remove the cooler feed ("in") hot line where attached to the cooler (from transmission), how could you not have pressure there if it's coming straight from the transmission? You're just capturing it earlier than you would after going through the cooler and capturing it at the return (cool) line. Am I missing something?


The loop is disconnected for the service, so nothing comes out of the return line going back tot eh trans. If you all mean can you remove the out line from the cooler that goes back to the trans, then sure.
 
^Yes, thats what I meant anyway. lol

...and driving long enough for the transmission to get warm should be enough time for some change in the temperature of the lines to determine which is TO the cooler and which is the return FROM the cooler.

If you drive a while, engine bay temps can cause both lines to feel the same at that point, so 15 minutes highway should be all it takes to get at least a warm line to the cooler while the return should feel less warm or close to the cold start.

BTW, I'm pretty sure you can find which is the return line from the cooler by looking on a parts site that shows the cooling system or the A/T with their respective out/in lines to/from cooler.
 
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