Ethanol.

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: Ursae_Majoris
One of my degrees was in economics. I know econometrics and statistics. I know how to filter statical noise and outliers from data sets.

You can run paper numbers all day long, but real life does not resemble them much.


That's an EXCELLENT point. Many people here continue to ignore real world evidence in favor of paperwork!

 

[ARCOgraphite]

One big assumption is that the E10 blend is within a few % of proper. Given the realities of splash blending, HOH contamination and "Guesstimating" by fuel haulers you can (and many have pumped) fuel with well over 20% ethanol. I recommend all to get a test kit if you feel you've purchased a mis-blended" tank of fuel as any Engine damage will NOT be covered under warranty.

(I am not associated with this company)

http://www.fuel-testers.com/order.html

 

[mechtech2]

swalve - A drag car optimized for nitro, a methanol race car, and a factory street car are tuned for their various expected fuels.
This is done to get the most from them.
Pure alcohol has high octane and can be dumped in massive quantities to get good power.
But adding 10% to pure gasoline [without raising octane] results in a decrease of BTUs/gallon. So we must use more gallons for the same energy output.
There are other factors, like you mentioned, but this one can't be ignored.

 

[Samilcar]

Originally Posted By: BBDartCA
Buyrealgas.com is not comprehensive in the least bit to where E0 can be found. Its just user-submitted info.

I wish more people would realize that. Every single gas station I've been to in Iowa gives drivers a choice of E0 straight gas or a separate nozzle for the ethanol blended E10. Buyrealgas shows exactly zero stations in Iowa where straight gas is sold.

 

[Benzadmiral]

This site, which I first heard about here: http://pure-gas.org/index.jsp, is updated by users. Using it I found at least three pure gas stations in my area. It mentions two in Iowa.

 

[swalve]

Originally Posted By: mechtech2
But adding 10% to pure gasoline [without raising octane] results in a decrease of BTUs/gallon. So we must use more gallons for the same energy output.
There are other factors, like you mentioned, but this one can't be ignored.


Right- a little under 4%. That doesn't account for the results people are claiming.

 

[Kestas]

Originally Posted By: lewdwig
Originally Posted By: BBDartCA
Buyrealgas.com is not comprehensive in the least bit to where E0 can be found. Its just user-submitted info.

It doesn't show any E0 in my area and I know there are a lot of gas stations in my area that sell it. I prefer E10 and it was hard to find a few years ago so I've looked at half the pumps in the county.

lewdwig, it would be good to know where these stations are. Since Michigan dropped the requirement of labeling the pumps, I haven't been able to verify any stations that sell E0 in SE Michigan.

It's also good to know that Iowa makes E0 available. I assumed that E0 is even more difficult (or impossible) to obtain in Iowa (corn country) than in SE Michigan.

 

[IndyIan]

Originally Posted By: severach
Ethanol is mandated to reduce pollution in the big cities. There were better ways to do it. Ethanol was politically tenable.

E85 is a push for the greenies. The public isn't buying either.

Actually I think E85 is pushed by large agro industries... People can only eat so much food and cattle can only eat so much corn... How can we sell more proprietary seed, herbicides, and fertilizer? Make food crops into fuel crops!
I imagine the increase in the dead zone in the gulf of mexico could be correlated to the rising corn production in the mississippi watershed...

 

[Samilcar]

Originally Posted By: Kestas

It's also good to know that Iowa makes E0 available. I assumed that E0 is even more difficult (or impossible) to obtain in Iowa (corn country) than in SE Michigan.


It does seem odd. Just this year ethanol interests attempted to introduce legislation at the statehouse to make Iowa like Minnesota (make it illegal to use E0 in a road going vehicle). Thankfully, this effort died pretty quickly.

 

[shrooms]

Ban Ethanol!

If my state rep or candidate in NOV promises to eliminate Ethanol, he/she will get my vote.

 

[sasilverbullet]

Not sure if this is true, saw it somewhere, Aren't there problems with E10 if it sits in your gas tank for a while?

 

[Kestas]

Yes, it's called "phase separation". You could search the archives using that phrase for more detail on the phenomenon. It's why boaters insist on using E0 for boats that will see significant storage.

http://www.epa.gov/oms/regs/fuels/rfg/waterphs.pdf

 

[Brett Miller]

Next to a certain fellow in Washington who will remain nameless, Ethanol is the biggest farce perpetrated on the Americn public in many years. How can a product that has a negative energy return be a good idea?