Dual piston brake caliper swap?

[Stu_Rock]

I just found out today that there's a dual piston caliper that's a direct fit for the front brakes in my car, which are currently single piston. Not only that, but they're the same price!

The piston area is the same between the two, so the clamping force will be the same. If you want specifics, the difference is one 2.5 inch piston or two 1.77 inch pistons; both provide 4.9 square inches of area in the bore.

The big difference is that the dual piston caliper takes a pad that's nearly twice the size as the single piston caliper.

My question to brake gurus out there is this: would there be any noticeable performance change--good or bad--that would result from a swap?

 

[chrome]

If you have the same piston bore area, then technically the force exerted by a given hydraulic pressure on the pads will be exactly the same.

The only advantage on the dual piston setup will be the larger pad size (more pad material = longer life), and perhaps a more even force distribution by the pad on the disc surface.

If it is a direct swap, and same price, by all means give it a try. Will the pads be the same price too?

 

[BuickGN]

Agreed with the above. With that larger pads, you may notice slightly lower pad temps but pad wear will be the largest benefit.

 

[Stu_Rock]

The big pads are about 10% more expensive ($50 instead of $46).

Of course, I wouldn't need to buy new calipers if I keep my current brakes, but they're still cheap--$61 per side. I'm still intrigued by the idea.

I agree that more pad material should keep temperatures down (same amount of work being done to heat more material). It's a big 3900 lb car, and I do live in an area with mountains, so I could imagine a benefit there.

I have never overheated the brakes in the mountains with this car, but I have done it in my last car. It's something I'd rather avoid.

 

[Audi Junkie]

Is this CRV calipers on an Accord?

 

[Stu_Rock]

Nope. It's F-body Camaro calipers on a Park Avenue.

I did some more Googling and found out that the dual piston calipers are aluminum, so they weigh 4.5 lb less than the one-pot cast iron monsters that came from the factory.

 

[sciphi]

Do it! Especially on the C-body Park Ave, you'll need that extra meat on the pads. It's a stretched H-body (Bonneville/LeSabre) platform, which has entirely inadequate brakes from the factory. Making it larger only makes the problems of warped rotors and quickly going through pads worse.

I can never seem to get more than about 30-50k out of a set of pads. And I'm pretty tame behind the wheel of my LeSabre.

 

[KrisZ]

If you are changing the calipers anyways, or they need a rebuild, then I would definitely do it. You will have longer pad life and maybe better initial bite.

 

[Trav]

If these calipers are rebuilt ask if the aluminum piston bores are sleeved.GM aluminum calipers had corrosion issues in this area,Corvette owners are most familiar with this.
Not sure if this is applicable to your calipers but its worth looking into before shelling out the $$.

 

[SteveSRT8]

they'll have to be really old to have that issue.

Our service vans have dual piston aluminum calipers! And they last for 400 thousand miles (maybe longer)!

 

[Trav]

That probably the case.My old 68 Corvette had to be sleeved and it cost me almost $400,a lot of money back then.
I see some newer models are sleeved OEM,it was just a thought.

 

[SteveSRT8]

just so we're clear, I meant no offense.

Just wanted the OP to know that issue has been resolved.

 

[Stu_Rock]

I (OP) probably should have mentioned the years of the caliper swap. It's 1998-2002 F-body brakes on a 1997-2005 C-body.

The $61 calipers are Raybestos remans that include the bracket, springs, boots, and crush washers. I figure they're probably pretty good parts.



Originally Posted By: sciphi
... [The H platform] has entirely inadequate brakes from the factory ...

I've never felt like the brakes are inadequate in this car, but also note that Park Avenue front rotors are 12 inch, whereas LeSabre rotors are 11 inch. Even so, better brakes are always a good thing.

I wonder if this swap would work for the H-cars. I found on Google that others have done the swap on W-cars that share the same rotors as your LeSabre, but they also get the 12 inch rotors, and if necessary, larger wheels.

The big question is whether the caliper bracket will bolt to your steering knuckle. Looking at CompNine, it seems that 1999 and earlier LeSabres don't have a caliper bracket, so maybe this idea won't go anywhere. It should work for the 2000-2005 H-cars, though.

 

[mechtech2]

Pad wear should be better, and temperatures will be kept lower in racing conditions.
Should you do this? Are you racing and do you have present problems?
A better option may be to simply get better brake pads for your present system.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
just so we're clear, I meant no offense.

Just wanted the OP to know that issue has been resolved.


No offence taken i looked them up and learned something.

 

[UNC038]

I better upgrade is a larger rotor, better leverage and temperature control. They're caliper brackets that allow you to go from a 10.9'' to a 11.9'' rotor which is the best bang for the buck. This requires nothing except new rotors and the bracket. I have them and stopping power is greatly improved.

 

[Stu_Rock]

My (OP) car came with the 12 inch rotors from the factory.

 

[Stu_Rock]

I'm resurrecting this thread to say that I ordered the parts to do this brake swap.

When I bought the car 12,000 miles ago, the front brake pads were at 70% thickness. Yesterday I noticed grinding, and found that the inboard pads on both sides were at nearly 0%.

That seems like horrible pad life, so I decided to go ahead with the big brake swap.

I was planning to get some high-end pads, but I got a great price on loaded F-body calipers with OE-style friction material. The price was nearly the same with or without the pads. It's not what I originally planned, but it'll be good for the sake of direct comparison of caliper performance.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Ouch. Seems the FWD platforms are notoriously hard on front brakes.

But most cars do not have enough swept area for an 'enthusiastic' driver. A carefully thought out upgrade can help.

Please be cautious. Larger volume in the caliper can lead to all kinds of ABS and pedal pressure issues. And your choice of pad is critical on the street.

 

[Craig in Canada]

Originally Posted By: Stu_Rock
I'm resurrecting this thread to say that I ordered the parts to do this brake swap.

When I bought the car 12,000 miles ago, the front brake pads were at 70% thickness. Yesterday I noticed grinding, and found that the inboard pads on both sides were at nearly 0%.

That seems like horrible pad life, so I decided to go ahead with the big brake swap.

I was planning to get some high-end pads, but I got a great price on loaded F-body calipers with OE-style friction material. The price was nearly the same with or without the pads. It's not what I originally planned, but it'll be good for the sake of direct comparison of caliper performance.


As much as I love multi-piston calipers, if the outboard pads weren't also worn I would say that you have more of a slide/caliper operation/maintenance issue and not a design issue. If you aren't wearing the inner and outer pads fairly evenly then something needs fixing.

If it is supposed to be lubricated, make sure it is. If it's supposed to be dry, make sure that it is. If they are in fact "close" in terms of wear and you just didn't mention that, then ignore my comments