Drop the Tax on Bicycles

[andrewg]

Originally Posted By: Silverado12
^^^If you say so. link

But I see from your sig you don't support American manufacturing anyways.


You really should check your facts before you go about waving the flag like a redneck.

Your Chevy Silverado only contains 62% American/Canadian parts with 34% coming from overseas. That doesn't sound much like a real American lover to me when you consider that my Honda Ridgeline is tied with the Ford F150 as being the number one pickup using American sourced parts...75% America/Canadian with ONLY 15% foreign parts.
Facts are kind of difficult to swallow even when one rides around on a Harley, wearing American eagles on garments and waving the flag.
By the way...I work in American manufacturing and served in the military. I don't need you to question my loyalty to the nation because my vehicles don't carry an "American" name on the back.

 

[andrewg]

Originally Posted By: Cubey
Originally Posted By: kschachn
I understand those of you who support and may be members of unions, I don't agree with it but I understand it.


No, I don't think you do understand it.

If by yourself you go to your boss and demand a raise due to rising costs of living despite their refusal to pay a fair wage based on the work you perform, you'll be flat out rejected. If you say "raise my pay or I will walk off the job" they'll say "Fine, it's not hard to replace one person. You're fired."

If you have a collective body of other workers, that is a large amount of the workers that keeps bringing your boss large profits at the lowest pay they feel they can get away with, you have a bigger chance of getting paid fairly since it brings the business to a grinding halt if 50 workers demand a raise and the boss refuses vs 1.

I honestly don't think you understand what has happened, which applies to most Americans. They're too busy working 2-3 jobs to look into the reasons, or just don't REALLY care about what is going on in this country, so long as they themselves have a reasonably comfortable life. The latter of the two tends to the happen the most the higher one's income is.

The rich are actually WORSE at dealing with money than the poor (generally speaking of course) because they have so much of it. You;'d be okay with tens of thousands, or even hundreds of thousands of dollars in lost money in the stock market because you pull in MILLIONS of dollars a year. It's a drop in the bucket for you. It's pocket change almost.

If you live on $1,000 a month you have to be a lot more careful with how you spend your money than if you pull in $10,000 a month. It's the same reason you often hear how people will millions in the lottery and are broke after 10 years or less. Why? They were rich and didn't know how to handle money, despite being poor/middle class prior. They get amnesia about how to manage money properly due to the delusion about being rich solves all your problems and you never have to worry about being careful with money again.

Donald Trump is an EXCELLENT example, actually. He's more or less broke, at least compared to the wild claims he makes about how rich he is. He doesn't even own the buildings that bear his name and he's had to file bankruptcy several times. I'm not sure why anyone thinks he's a good choice to run the country, based on the SEVERAL bankruptcies alone. Do right wingers WANT him to totally bankrupct the US? Nah, they just don't care about the US. They care about more someone they look up to being in office than about what they will do to the nation. Talk about literal "big brother" worship.


So when it comes to human beings in general, you subscribe to the power of the collective being more "American" or at least more important than the power of the individual?
Your post just illustrates the naive thinking process of progressives (you guys liked to be called that now...I guess it sounds better than liberals) and as to why I am a conservative on most issues.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: Silverado12
Not really. We have roads, police, fire, military, schools, teachers in our society. Our public parks projects and bike trails/lanes are part of our "socialist" system too.


Yeah but that's about it, right? It is isolated items that society has decided to be monopolies, but it is a very minor subset of the economy as a whole. Exceptions rather than the rule.

Besides, at least one of the things you mention don't have to be a monopoly as has been demonstrated here in Wisconsin.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: Cubey
Originally Posted By: kschachn
I understand those of you who support and may be members of unions, I don't agree with it but I understand it.

No, I don't think you do understand it.


Well, I'll tell you one thing I understand. I am much less a Communist than I am a Socialist.

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: andrewg
75% America/Canadian with ONLY 15% foreign parts.


Does the other 10% come from Mars?

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: Cubey
Originally Posted By: kschachn
I understand those of you who support and may be members of unions, I don't agree with it but I understand it.

No, I don't think you do understand it.


Well, I'll tell you one thing I understand. I am much less a Communist than I am a Socialist.


Wait, so you're socialist leaning but you're anti-union? Talk about conflicting ideology!

 

[andrewg]

Originally Posted By: Cubey
Originally Posted By: andrewg
75% America/Canadian with ONLY 15% foreign parts.


Does the other 10% come from Mars?

The actual number on the data was >15%. I forgot the ">" and I am assuming the parts supply fluctuates slightly...that is why the ">" was used.
http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2012/03/what-percentage-of-your-truck-is-made-in-america.html

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: andrewg
So when it comes to human beings in general, you subscribe to the power of the collective being more "American" or at least more important than the power of the individual?


Yes. Individualism is what has screwed up the country in the past 35-40 years. It's become about selfishness, "more for me, less for everyone else" not about what's best for the common good of your fellow man. That is NOT the spirit of America. At least not 20th century America, post 1929 until around 1975-1980. You're talking about 17th-19th century America. What's stunning is how you refuse to acknowledge how 90% top tax rate worked so well from the 1930s until somewhere in the 1960s or 70s when it had been dropped several times, the worst when Reagen took over in 1980.

You love to ignore 50 years of economic history, the GREATEST ERA IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD, because it conflicts with your screwed up political view.

Sorry, we're not going back to the "good ol' days" of being a third world country with slavery, at least not if us Progressives have anything to do about it.

Atheists such as myself shake our heads at christian conservatives who like to love to quote Jesus but refuse to live the way he taught. You can't have it both ways. Well, you *can*, but that makes you the hypocrites you are.

 

[andrewg]

Originally Posted By: Cubey
Originally Posted By: andrewg
So when it comes to human beings in general, you subscribe to the power of the collective being more "American" or at least more important than the power of the individual?


Yes. Individualism is what has screwed up the country in the past 35-40 years. It's become about selfishness, "more for me, less for everyone else" not about what's best for the common good of your fellow man. That is NOT the spirit of America. At least not 20th century America, post 1929 until around 1975-1980. You're talking about 17th-19th century America. What's stunning is how you refuse to acknowledge how 90% top tax rate worked so well from the 1930s until somewhere in the 1960s or 70s when it had been dropped several times, the worst when Reagen took over in 1980.

You love to ignore 50 years of economic history, the GREATEST ERA IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD, because it conflicts with your screwed up political view.

Sorry, we're not going back to the "good ol' days" of being a third world country with slavery, at least not if us Progressives have anything to do about it.

Atheists such as myself shake our heads at christian conservatives who like to love to quote Jesus but refuse to live the way he taught. You can't have it both ways. Well, you *can*, but that makes you the hypocrites you are.


You call me a hypocrite and decry corruptness as an evil, yet tell me that you'll be supporting Hillary once Sanders gets humiliated at the convention. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black!
You are full of assumptions (among other things). I am a conservative....AND an atheist. The ridiculous notion that individualism has lead to the downfall of our nation is laughable. It's the direct opposite. Without it, we would never have become the nation we have. Carnegie, Ford, Morgan, and all those people that invented great things had NOTHING to do with collectivism.
Third world country with slavery? Wow...you know you are one strange individual with very bizarre notions. You mix up your history and make attempts at making points like you've got dyslexia.
This is why I should have stuck to my statement yesterday that because you insult and assume so much...and make little sense with your rantings...that I am finished trying to have discussion with you.

You are now on my IGNORE list and I thankfully won't have to endure your nonsensical remarks any further.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: Cubey
Wait, so you're socialist leaning but you're anti-union? Talk about conflicting ideology!


A rational response would have been more effective.

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: andrewg

You are full of assumptions (among other things). I am a conservative....AND an atheist. The ridiculous notion that individualism has lead to the downfall of our nation is laughable. It's the direct opposite. Without it, we would never have become the nation we have. Carnegie, Ford, Morgan, and all those people that invented great things had NOTHING to do with collectivism.


Andrew Carnegie was a union buster who caused deaths to his workers.
Henry Ford was anti-semitic
No idea which "Morgan" you are referring to.

Originally Posted By: andrewg

Third world country with slavery? Wow...you know you are one strange individual with very bizarre notions. You mix up your history and make attempts at making points like you've got dyslexia.


Since you don't seem to be aware of it, I'll education you: Prior to the civil war, the US had slavery. *gasp* Yes, I know this must come as a shock to you! Sorry I couldn't soften the blow any better than that.

By today's standards, the US was a third world country in most of the country (except for major cities like New York) until the New Deal came along. The New Deal saved America from becoming full blown socialist/communism, for better or worse.

People like to claim unions had nothing to do with the top tax rate. Evidence suggests otherwise:

Originally Posted By: andrewg

You are now on my IGNORE list and I thankfully won't have to endure your nonsensical remarks any further.


This folks, is the conservative equivalent of "LALALALA! I CAN'T HEAR YOU! LALALALA!"

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: Cubey
Wait, so you're socialist leaning but you're anti-union? Talk about conflicting ideology!


A rational response would have been more effective.


You need to brush up on your reading/writing comprehension.

You said: "I am much less a Communist than I am a Socialist. "

That means you are more socialist than you are communist. If you are comparing two things to yourself and you state you are less of one, that automatically means you are more of the other.

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: Silverado12
Not really. We have roads, police, fire, military, schools, teachers in our society. Our public parks projects and bike trails/lanes are part of our "socialist" system too.


Yeah but that's about it, right?


You DO know that about 20% of the US budget is spent on the military, right? So if you ONLY go by the military, the US is at least 20% socialist/communist. And oddly enough, the conservatives are the ones who adore America being at least 20% socialist/communist!

 

[Silverado12]

Originally Posted By: andrewg
Originally Posted By: Silverado12
^^^If you say so. link

But I see from your sig you don't support American manufacturing anyways.


You really should check your facts before you go about waving the flag like a redneck.

Your Chevy Silverado only contains 62% American/Canadian parts with 34% coming from overseas. That doesn't sound much like a real American lover to me when you consider that my Honda Ridgeline is tied with the Ford F150 as being the number one pickup using American sourced parts...75% America/Canadian with ONLY 15% foreign parts.
Facts are kind of difficult to swallow even when one rides around on a Harley, wearing American eagles on garments and waving the flag.
By the way...I work in American manufacturing and served in the military. I don't need you to question my loyalty to the nation because my vehicles don't carry an "American" name on the back.


I'm prior service too, but I don't feel the need to shove it in your face like a redneck would. Your other 2 vehicles (convenient that you cherry pick the only one w/American content, BTW) are completely foreign, so you don't support union made and American manufacturing. God forbid if/when YOU'RE out of work don't go sniveling to anybody about it or go the the gov't for any assistance. If I had my way the Silverado would be 100% domestic. That wasn't my choice and I wrote GM an email about it. It's just the new normal.

 

[Cubey]

Actually, I was in error. It was 20% in 2011. It has been scaled back to around 16% now, thankfully. But even so, conservatives have no problem with socialism/communism as long as it's the kind they like.

 

[Cubey]

I'm just speaking in general with this post. I'm not directing this comment at anyone in particular.

My last "foreign" car (at it's very roots, at least) was a Japanese designed Suzuki Swift, built in Canada, by an American company (GM/Geo). Of course, I bought it more than 20 years after it was made, so it doesn't exactly matter where something is made if you get it USED since it's not like you contributed to the company that made it by being it used.

My current car, a 2003 Pontiac Vibe, has a GM body and a Toyota chassis, interior, engine, transmission; and was assembled in California. But again I bought it used, so it actually doesn't mean much.

I do try to buy USA made parts when I can, however.

 

[Silverado12]

Originally Posted By: Cubey
Actually, I was in error. It was 20% in 2011. It has been scaled back to around 16% now, thankfully. But even so, conservatives have no problem with socialism/communism as long as it's the kind they like.


Although I'm with complete agreement w/you Cubey, I'm out of this discussion now. I've said all I'm going to say. Some folks we just can't reach.

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: Silverado12
Originally Posted By: Cubey
Actually, I was in error. It was 20% in 2011. It has been scaled back to around 16% now, thankfully. But even so, conservatives have no problem with socialism/communism as long as it's the kind they like.


Although I'm with complete agreement w/you Cubey, I'm out of this discussion now. I've said all I'm going to say. Some folks we just can't reach.


The "willfully ignorant", to put it nicely.

 

[andrewg]

Originally Posted By: Silverado12
Originally Posted By: Cubey
Actually, I was in error. It was 20% in 2011. It has been scaled back to around 16% now, thankfully. But even so, conservatives have no problem with socialism/communism as long as it's the kind they like.


Although I'm with complete agreement w/you Cubey, I'm out of this discussion now. I've said all I'm going to say. Some folks we just can't reach.


And some folks live in a dream world.

 

[dishdude]

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