Does Valvoline SynPower contain PAOs/esters?

[Bruce T]

Valvoline SynPower runs smoother and quieter than Mobil 1 in my '97 Camry V6 (jjbula has posted good UOAs), but I recently learned this "Full Synthetic Motor Oil" is highly refined petroleum oil (Group III). I was angry with Valvoline for lying, but such claims can legally be made by US advertisers - just not by chemists or ethicists.

I'm no chemist, but the MSDS on the Valvoline website looks suspiciously incomplete. For those of you who have seen the full MSDS, does Valvoline SynPower contain even the smallest amounts of PAOs or esters?

Thanks,
Bruce Thanscheidt

[ April 28, 2004, 04:07 PM: Message edited by: Bruce T ]

 

[DSteven]

I believe the Valvoline synpower is all Group III. And oh yes, Valvoline has fed me a lie, too.

They insisted on installing their MaxLife transmission fluid (multi-vehicle formula...yeah right) in the Dodge Stratus (needs ATF+3). The trans acted weird, was slow to shift to 4th gear, if not at all at times, and finally was in need of an overhaul. The 'warranty' they gave it for 30,000 miles upon initial fluid exchange was now something they refused to stand behind. I finally had to eat the loss. However, their new MaxLife synthetic will be interesting to have UOA's. I prefer Mobil-1, if paying the money for synthetic...why pay everyone for a real PAO and get a glorified Group III, when Mobil-1 actually does sell a PAO?.. Hope all goes well with your engine. Have you ever considered trying the next step up in viscosity?

 

[sbc350gearhead]

Synpower may contain a small amount of esters for the additive package...........a very small amount.

 

[DSteven]

I am sorry for not thinking about the additive pckg. I was not taking that into account. Although, what % are the additives that are PAO's?

 

[Dr. T]

No they're not lying...it doesn't have to be a PAO in order to be a synthetic.

 

[Schmoe]

Ahhhhh....Vavoline has adopted the ol' Castrol syndrome.

 

[Bruce T]

The reason I asked if Valvoline SynPower contains esters is because I'm using it for an Auto-Rx engine cleaning. If it contains esters (perhaps even in an additive package), then they'll fight against the three esters in Auto-Rx. If necessary, I can switch to a cheaper dino oil instead of SynPower (Chevron/Havoline or Castrol GTX).

After the engine cleaning, I want to try Red Line 5W30. It has posted good UOAs in Camry V6s, and it's also an oil designed to match my sporty driving style. Yep, the right side of the tachometer is my "happy place."

DSteven, I'm sorry to hear about your transmission problems. A major driveline failure is horrifying, but it's even worse when your dealer is unresponsive. Is it too late to escalate it to higher levels at Dodge? I wish you luck.

I don't know much about ATFs. I use Red Line MT-90 in my 5-speed manual transmission, which now shifts better and runs quieter than with Mobil 1 gear lube. This gear oil feels luxurious to the driver, but esters come at a cost.

[ April 29, 2004, 02:05 PM: Message edited by: Bruce T ]

 

[JohnnyO]

In a way I'd prefer Valvoline because they have a plant in my town and I like to buy local, but both my newer vehicles call for 5w-30. Wally-World does not carry 5 qt jugs of Synpower in that weight and so Mobil 1 ends up being a bunch cheaper, besides which it IS a true full synthetic. I did put Synpower in my mom's Caddy during a brief period when W-W jacked the price of M1

, but her car calls for 10w-30. UOA comparing that with the previous batch of M1 will be forthcoming in a few months.

 

[Bruce T]

Searching through previous BITOG posts, I found the answer to my original questin from G-Man II:

"Yes, virtually all Group III based synthetic oils have some esters blended in. This is needed for solubility reasons and because Group III alone is just as poor at seal swell as PAO."

"The one exception that I know of is Shell Rotella T Synthetic. Shell blends some Group I in to get the solvency and seal swell needed."

For more information, see the following two threads:

http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=000871

http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=003454

[ May 21, 2004, 03:17 PM: Message edited by: Bruce T ]

 

[Motorbike]

There is only one thing I really know about Valvoline and the SynPower they make and that is :

They have no intentions of honoring the SynPower rebate that was on their website for a brief time

Confirmed by telephone minutes ago .

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=35;t=000108

 

[Bruce T]

Yes, companies today put so many stipulations on their rebates ("fine print"), it's almost impossible to collect. While they might successfully avoid the costs of paying these rebates, it's very bad PR for the company.

[ May 21, 2004, 03:58 PM: Message edited by: Bruce T ]

 

[Santo Fontana]

Its too bad they wont honor that rebate.

Just look at all the attention they spurred up here with the rebate - which quickly turned into negative attention.

Oil co's that get bashed on BITOG would do well to let us try out some free samples and do UOAs, they could very well win over some customers.


[edit]
Also, I know Castrol cant stop talking about how their Syntec has esters, should we assume it is just the very small amount used to mix in the adds or do they really spike their GIII with esters?

[ May 21, 2004, 06:33 PM: Message edited by: Santo Fontana ]

 

[doitmyself]

Curious - Dsteven, who was the "they" that insisted on installing the Valvoline tranny fluid. Chryslers are notorious for requiring the correct fluid and many "required" rebuilds were simply symptoms of the wrong fluid.

Blackstone Labs confirmed that my fluid was changed out to a non ATF+3 fluid and I forced the garage to do a free tranny flush.

You got screwed and a bit of assertiveness on your part would have gotten the tranny fixed at THEIR expense.

 

[DSteven]

doitmyself--Sorry to forget...it was a Valvoline Instant Oil Change that insisted the car get their MaxLife ATF Dexron/Mercon fluid. They said it met the requirements of ATF+3 and ATF+4! Chrysler has only recommended totally against the use of it, or anything other than the ATF+3/4. I should have been more persistant about the situation. Valvoline just ignored me the best they could. That company is a big hoax. They lied about the product and the guarantee that it wouldn't adversely affect the transmission. Then after paying $117.00 for a simple transmission fluid flush, nothing more was wanted of me when the trans acted badly. But the store did do two flushes of ATF+3 and gave a new filter and pan gasket. That helped a lot. If the car wouldn't have been rear-ended and totalled a month after that, I would most likely have persisted more. Any advice to that? Thanks for the response.