Dodged a bullet with F150

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2010 F150 w/4.6 Have been chasing a rough idle in drive with the AC on for some time now, and when I change plugs they looked lean. No codes initially, checked for vacuum leaks etc, etc. I'm a decent shadetree mechanic but could find nothing. This week, come home after a round trip of about 250mi, taking my gas tank down to about 1/4 or less. Get out of the truck and I hear snapping and banging under my truck. Look underneath , and my plastic gas tank is nearly imploded, sucked in like an empty drink bottle. From other forums,have read about this problem..turns out, the solenoid valve in the charcoal canister that vents/filters the fuel tank fumes had failed. Apparently, there is no fail safe mechanism, so the constant running of fuel pump, sucks all the air out, none can get in, so it implodes. Now for the dodge the bullet part, some have had this happen to such an extent, that the sending unit for fuel level was damaged and some have suffered pump damage as well, resulting in hundreds of $ in repairs for a $60 solenoid failure. This solenoid failure can also contribute to a lean condition, so I'm hopeful for this as well. If you have an F150 and it seems to idle rough in drive, especially with AC on or you suspect a lean condition, check this valve first. I believe it's official name is the canister purge solenoid valve, was $63 from my local Ford dealer, as none of the chain parts houses had stock...they were more expensive anyway. AT least at the moment, it appears there was no damage...so far
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I'm surprised one could fail completely, yet not trigger an error code. OBDII systems are built to monitor the EVAP system because it is a critical smog device.
 
I agree..yet it did. This has been an issue , with the idle anyway, for over 50k miles, with no code until last month or so, and it was for the upstream O2 sensor on passenger side (forget the code, sorry). Lots of examples in the forums..damaged fuel tanks, bent fuel pump rods, damaged fuel level sending units, etc..
 
FWIW: if you hear any air moving when you start to unscrew the fuel cap you have a problem. Investigate ASAP.
 
Originally Posted By: artificialist
I'm surprised one could fail completely, yet not trigger an error code. OBDII systems are built to monitor the EVAP system because it is a critical smog device.

The one on the CVPI failed and it tripped no code. Symptoms were being unable to fill the tank with fuel with the gas pump more than just barely cracked open. Or the pump would trip like it was full.
There is a stage of the EVAP test where it expects the vacuum to remain in the tank for a specified period of time and if the vacuum drops, obviously it has a leak.
Also, though, it watches for vacuum rise. If that occurs, it dumps the vacuum by opening this valve and then closing it again, waiting to see if the vacuum rises again.
The EVAP test entry conditions are pretty stringent, though. It won't occur in the middle or end of a long drive, it has to be right after start-up and at a decent road speed.
Its possible it just never saw enough of a rise during that time to trip.
 
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Jeez, that's awful. I thought something in the tank (overfill protection valve?) had a failsafe vent. If the regular system was supposed to stay within, say, 2 PSI of atmospheric the fail-safe triggered at 4.

This capless thing is a weird twist. I think I'd notice an irregular whoosh when removing my cap.

If it were a GM you'd have it complaining about EVAP for the most specious of reasons.
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Originally Posted By: AITG
FWIW: if you hear any air moving when you start to unscrew the fuel cap you have a problem. Investigate ASAP.


Not entirely true.

Differences in pressure are allowed, and even encouraged on some years, and a lot of makes.

Earlier evap systems had no rear valve. The tank vented and pulled as needed into and from the evap. The vsv would contantly pull from the canister into the intake to burn any fumes.
 
The idle was smoother immediately after the initial code clearing. The CEL came back, 0150 bank 2 oxygen sensor. IT's the upstream sensor, and for some reason , no one and I mean no one has stock on this part. Neither AZ or Advance within any driving distance, or local Ford dealers. They all say the same thing, we can order it...well, I can order it, usually for cheaper. Will get it ordered this week and see how it goes.
 
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