discrepancy in gear box fill amount; toyota.

[simple_gifts]

Car is 2003 !echo!; 5 speed manual. OM says 4 pints for the manual gearbox, amsoil product lookup says 4.1 pints. In the past, probably 4 times, I have had the gear fluid replaced and have always handed them (dealer) 2 qts of Redline and no one has said anything.

Last week I drop the car off to have the driver's side axle seal replaced at an indy shop and give them 2 qts redline for refill. I get the car back and they indicate (3) quarts were added; they added another qt of 75W-90 syn. I ask the head there and he said they used the fill hole for filling and had removed the "level hole" to get the proper level.

One whole quart discrepancy? 2 pints? No need to explain to BITOG'rs my uneasiness at this point. What could explain this?

(the discrepancy, not the uneasiness.)

Is there much to worry about? I suspect maybe across the entire gearbox there might be 3/4" extra depth of fluid?



Thanks.

-T

 

[MysticGold04]

Funny you bring this up, going through the same issue with my Focus. I drained the trans and added 2 qts of fluid. Amsoil says the same capacity for my trans (MTX75) is 4.1 pints (2.1qts) But I have also heard from alot of folks to "fill to spill" out of the fill hole. I bought another quart of fluid, and will probably add it until it spills..

My question is this though - is there anything bad that will come with "overfilling" ??

 

[ARCOgraphite]

On some the fill is 1/2" below the fill (side) hole. I dont know what they are calling the fill hole on the echo. Hope your seals hold. Typically the lube will pump out the vent or vent hose of the case (if designed in) and get all over the car undertray/belly.

 

[Tegger]

Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
Car is 2003 !echo!; 5 speed manual. OM says 4 pints for the manual gearbox, amsoil product lookup says 4.1 pints. In the past, probably 4 times, I have had the gear fluid replaced and have always handed them (dealer) 2 qts of Redline and no one has said anything.

Last week I drop the car off to have the driver's side axle seal replaced at an indy shop and give them 2 qts redline for refill. I get the car back and they indicate (3) quarts were added; they added another qt of 75W-90 syn. I ask the head there and he said they used the fill hole for filling and had removed the "level hole" to get the proper level.

The "head" never saw the car. He's giving you the answer for an AUTOMATIC vehicle. The manual Echo has the exact same fill/drain system just about every manual car has had since before 1908.

Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
Is there much to worry about? I suspect maybe across the entire gearbox there might be 3/4" extra depth of fluid?


No worries. It is literally impossible to overfill a manual transmission car unless you tip the car over on its side while filling, and put the plug back before you tip it upright again. Fluid will dribble out once it reaches the bottom of the fill hole. That's how you know when to stop filling and put the plug back.

 

[simple_gifts]

Quote:

No worries. It is literally impossible to overfill a manual transmission car unless you tip the car over on its side while filling, and put the plug back before you tip it upright again. Fluid will dribble out once it reaches the bottom of the fill hole. That's how you know when to stop filling and put the plug back.


There are 3 plugs in the transmission; a fill hole, a level hole and a drain. If no one takes the level plug out, it is possible to overfill. This is a respected indy shop; I suspect this did not happen. Thanks for the reassurance. I should really learn how to do this myself, since there is a well documented procedure with pics

Here
http://yarisfans.com/forum/yaf_postsm1789_Toyota-Echo-DIY--Manual-Transmission-Fluid-Change.aspx

As someone once mentioned, why pay to have a possibly bad job done, when you can guarantee it by doing it yourself. lol!

 

[Tegger]

Originally Posted By: simple_gifts


There are 3 plugs in the transmission; a fill hole, a level hole and a drain. If no one takes the level plug out, it is possible to overfill. This is a respected indy shop; I suspect this did not happen. Thanks for the reassurance. I should really learn how to do this myself, since there is a well documented procedure with pics

Here
http://yarisfans.com/forum/yaf_postsm1789_Toyota-Echo-DIY--Manual-Transmission-Fluid-Change.aspx

The author of that page has made a GIANT mistake! And I know why.

That bolt on top is a "LOCK BOLT"; it is NOT meant as a "fill" plug. The real "fill" plug is on the SIDE of the transmission, just like he shows later on that page. For drain-and-fill, manual transmissions have been exactly the same since before the Model-T. The Echo is no different.

The reason he used the lock bolt to fill the transmission is because he did not know how to do the job properly, which essentially involves pumping oil uphill into the fill hole using the correct (cheap and commercially-available) hand-pump.
Read this final comment from him:
"**Note: The top plug I placed the manual transfluid into is just noted as a lock bolt on page MX11. Hope it was ok to use this fill hole......."

Uh-oh...

 

[kschachn]

^^ What he said. I have a 2000 ECHO and it takes >exactly< two quarts to fill. The "fill" and "level" hole are the same hole on the side. The top plug/hole under the air box is not the fill hole.

And another thing, the car shouldn't be on ramps. It should be level.

He also used some cheap knock-off gear oil (Mobile 1).

 

[Tegger]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
And another thing, the car shouldn't be on ramps. It should be level.

This is an extremely important point that I forgot to point out (and one that all shop manuals will specify). Failure to keep the car level will result in either an underfilled transmission or an overfilled one, depending on exact placement of the fill plug hole. A professional garage will not make the gross mistakes shown on the Web page referenced above.

 

[simple_gifts]

Digging up an old thread; decided to try my own gearbox oil change today, since this issue was bugging me; bought some MT-90 and MTL,
As my car gets old, I seem to be more inclined to try these tasks myself. I have to keep reminding myself "there is no magic there"