Diesel guys read this

[grizzlybear310]

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I don't know about how hard it is on the engine but it sure does generate plenty of emmisions. There is a move afoot to provide truckstops with electric plug ins to provide 110VAC for on board a/c and other accessories. Then, the engine could be shut off instead of allowed to run at idle. Not only would this improve engine service life but it would save 100,000s of gallons of diesel fuel in the US daily.

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That is already at some truck stops on a trial basis to see how it works.
I think they charge you $10 to use it.
Pretty neat, a self contained unit, all in one, a heater and/or a/c unit.

 

[DiEseLjunKy]

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Just cause you see trucks idling all night long doesn't mean it won't hurt them. Idling is bad for diesels period. I'm surprised that you guys on an oil forum would make such a blanket statement that it's fine you should know better around here. It breaks down oil additives, increases suspended soot, and rasies acidity levels in the oil decreasing intervals. Big truck engines typically burn anywhere from .08 to 1.2 gallons per hour of idling some fleets factor in the wear damage of 1 hour idling as the rough equivalent of 500 miles rolling. So you can factor in that excessive wear with the 3$ a gallon fuel you waste every hour. Now in extreme weather conditions idling is necessary. I do it myself all the time to stay cool or warm. But that doesn't make it ok for the engine.

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youre tellin me that an hour of idling is equal to 500 miles of rolling? at what speed is this being taken, 500 miles per hour? hahhahaha. 500 mile per hour semi's are equal to an hour of idling.
what you said is pretty far out there.

;ets assume at the legal speed limit of 70, it would take over 7 hours to go 500 miles. assuming this more realistic approach, how is an hour of idling (which is super low load and low stress on the bearings and rings) equal to over 7 hours of running at 70?
keep in mind at idle, diesel can be over 150:1 afr.

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I'll agree that could be far out there and was just a wild guess but from reading lots of different articles about in in trucking industry publications I do know it's bad for the engine and there is a significant cost to it. Seems like I recall one company figured their maintinence cost for idling was double the amount of the fuel that was wasted. They may have just pulled that number out of the air like me lol I dunno but I kind of doubt it considering the razor thin profit margins typical of the industry. And from personal experience I know it'll make an engine start consume oil, and a lot of it, more readily. I also know a truck with a lot of idle time will not bring as much $$$ on resale as a similar spec'ed one with low idle. But like somebody else said, if you're not in the vehicle and don't need to idle don't.

 

[STG]

Extended idling IS BAD for modern, emmission equipped diesels. Ford specifically recommends against idling for more that 10 minutes out of very hour of engine time (It's in the owners' manual). These engines will not get upto or remain at operating temperature at a no-load idle. Wetstacking and EGR problems will result. Late model Powerstrokes come factory wired with two up-idle circuits. One sets the idle to 1,200 (up from 900 rpm) and locks the torque converter. This is designed for power take off applications. The second circuit is called the BCP for Battery Charge Protect. This leaves the torque converter UNLOCKED at sets the idle to 1,200 rpm UNLESS the ECM reads low battery voltage. The BCP can vary the idle to a max of 2,400 rpm to charge the batteries. I use the BCP. Hooking up either circuit is a simple matter of finding the correct wire under the steering column and hooking it to one of the OEM Upfitter Switches or an after-market switch. Thia is valid on 2004+ Powerstrokes.

 

[grizzlybear310]

My OM, says no extended idle.
I will live by that since they carry the warranty.

 

[BGK]

http://www.idleaire.com/

If the vehicle can be restarted without extended idling, this device should become required in all truck stops!

 

[scottm1]

dnewton3 summed it up best. Let it idle if you need to, but bump up the rpms to around 1,200 and change the oil more frequently if you idle a lot.

 

[DiEseLjunKy]

Originally Posted By: BGK
http://www.idleaire.com/

If the vehicle can be restarted without extended idling, this device should become required in all truck stops!


Well that's easy for you to say. You probably don't drive a truck and have to hunt for a parking spot after running 11 hours all day 600-750 miles tired and can't find a place to park so you can sleep. I do. These services are overpriced and every one of them comes into a truck stop with a large parking area puts up these huge erector sets of a jumbled mess that reduces available parking and if you park in one without using the service and idling sometimes they will come wake you up and tell you to turn your truck off. There is a huge shortage of truck parking across the country the one thing we don;t need is more of this [censored]. Idleair's cash flow situation has been in the red for many years and is government subsidized. the sooner they go bankrupt the better and then they can tear all those erector sets down. The only real solution to eliminating idling are gen sets and apu's. Ilding does destroy engines and costs big bucks. Trucking companies do know this but until we had $3 a gallon fuel it was a small price they were willing to pay. Bbut more and more trucking outfits are putting apu's and gen sets ten years from now an idling diesel will be a rare thing.

 

[wcbcruzer]

I'm with DieselJunky on this one. Idling a diesel is bad for the engine. EGT's drop too low, which means the fuel isn't completely burned in the cylinders leading to cylinder wall washdown. Soot and carbon is also built up in the cylinders leading to injector failure, sticky valves, etc. The reason big rigs idle all night and can get away with it is because those engines are driven all the time. Engines will last many miles. If one of those engines goes 1,100,000 miles before requiring an overhaul and was idled all it's life, it may have been able to go 1,500,000 miles if it were shut off. But who can tell at that point? Or who cares? So you can say idling won't harm an engine because of what you've seen in real life or on tv (they only show you what they want on tv), but the truth of the matter is that it's not the best to leave a diesel idling. Idling won't kill an engine, but it's just another one of those maintenance things.

High idle helps raise EGTs to help prevent the things I mentioned above. Idling in cold weather may also be more beneficial than shutting off because cold starts take a toll on the engine.

 

[wcbcruzer]

Forgot to add something. Another reason you see big rigs idling is because a lot of the time the truck doesn't belong to the driver. It belongs to some company so the driver could care less about it.

 

[bbslider001]

Originally Posted By: wcbcruzer
Idling is not good for a diesel.


This is quite the moron statement, and who cares about EGR's if you don't have one?

 

[heyjayman]

Given the price of diesel increasing North of $4/us gallon, I predict idle time to drastically reduce

If you've ever been to a base like Thule, Greenland or Ft Greely, Alaska, you will notice the equipment has electric heaters for the coolant, oil pan, transmission pan, fuel tanks (Diesel, not gas for obvious reasons!), TDH sumps (Front end loaders and similar equipment), and axles

There are plugins all around the base with very HD yellow extension cords. They prefer you don't idle, but stop and plug in. If you do have to idle, the equipment has fast idle

I think we're going to see a lot more use of ProHeat or Espar coolant/cab heaters, and also APU's. These are good units, especially the HD ones from ProHeat

http://www.espar.com/html/applications/truck.html

http://www.proheat.com/tb_truckheaters.php

http://www.trucktrailer.carrier.com/Files/TruckTrailer/Local/US-en/trucktrailer/comfortpro.pdf

They even make APU's for locomotive use.

http://www.proheat.com/rm_railapu.php

A lot of fleets are now programming their trucks to shutdown automatically if idled more than 2-5 minutes. In Northern US and Alaska, and Canada, that means either running a ProHeat or an APU to get it started in cold temps

 

[1040 WreckerMan]

We run quite a few ProHeats at work. They are a nice unit despite the numerous problems we have with them.

Already idle time is being closely monitored and some states like California are prohibiting idling at rest areas and are even prohibiting APU's in some areas.

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi,
I never allowed any idling time with my fleet except for up to two minutes at the top of a long grade and depending on the Pyrometer recoding. Going into a Truckstop or Yard was always enough time to stabilise the temps/impeller revs. We always tarined new Drivers on this point and my Senior drivers enforced it "on the road". I never ever had a turbo failure

Turbo placement is very important too and 30 years or so ago turbo failures were a problem. Lubricants, engine design and turbo construction/metallurgy has improved so much

In NA and Europe such devices as "heyjayman" alludes to are great additions - I would certainly use them as needed

With DDEC I always monitored idle time and 6% was my maximum before the Driver was "counselled". Here in OZ many Fleets still have a level beyond 20%!

Distillate here costs around $A1.55 per Litre!!!

 

[BarkerMan]

There is a guy that lets his Dodge diesel engined pickup idle when he goes out to lunch, says it's good for the engine. Everyone tries to tell him to shut if off but he never does. He said that he runs Amsoil and an Amsoil bypass filter and while his is having lunch or at the grocery store his oil is being filtered. He told me that the synthetic molecules are smoother and they carry the dirt to the bypass filter. All this he says refines the oil and makes it better than new. That's why you don't change it. He told me that Mobil copied Amsoil, that Amsoil has the patient on synthetic oil. That's why Mobil had to change the formula. Even trying to remember what he said is giving me a headache. Do people with diesel engines think that running at idle is good for the engine?

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: cowhorse01
This is quite the moron statement, and who cares about EGR's if you don't have one?

LOL, suggest that you re-read the post, and see which TLA you messed up.

 

[tdi-rick]

Originally Posted By: BarkerMan

Do people with diesel engines think that running at idle is good for the engine?


When it comes to diesels and oil I listen to only a few, and Doug is number 1.

 

[Shannow]

agreed

 

[1040 WreckerMan]

Idle time is somewhat of a sticky wicket. If you operate a diesel pickup in "normal" environments you don't need to idle the truck for more than a minuet or so on shutdown and only about a minuet on startup. Just drive off easily until the engine warms up.

However it's in severe duty conditions that it may become necessary to idle the engine, normally it will be a high idle to help load the engine, but not always.

For normal service idling can cause problems such as cylinder wash down, glazing, injector nozzle deposits, and depending on the engine design inadequate oil throw-off from the crank further compounding the cylinder wash down from excessive unburnt fuel.

Keep idle time to a minimum.

 

[LateArrivalforLSU]

Originally Posted By: BarkerMan
There is a guy that lets his Dodge diesel engined pickup idle when he goes out to lunch, says it's good for the engine. Everyone tries to tell him to shut if off but he never does. He said that he runs Amsoil and an Amsoil bypass filter and while his is having lunch or at the grocery store his oil is being filtered. He told me that the synthetic molecules are smoother and they carry the dirt to the bypass filter. All this he says refines the oil and makes it better than new. That's why you don't change it. He told me that Mobil copied Amsoil, that Amsoil has the patient on synthetic oil. That's why Mobil had to change the formula. Even trying to remember what he said is giving me a headache. Do people with diesel engines think that running at idle is good for the engine?

I spewed beverage out of my nose when I read "the synthetic molecules are smoother and they carry the dirt to the bypass filter".

 

[countryboy9799]

Originally Posted By: BarkerMan
There is a guy that lets his Dodge diesel engined pickup idle when he goes out to lunch, says it's good for the engine. Everyone tries to tell him to shut if off but he never does. He said that he runs Amsoil and an Amsoil bypass filter and while his is having lunch or at the grocery store his oil is being filtered. He told me that the synthetic molecules are smoother and they carry the dirt to the bypass filter. All this he says refines the oil and makes it better than new. That's why you don't change it. He told me that Mobil copied Amsoil, that Amsoil has the patient on synthetic oil. That's why Mobil had to change the formula. Even trying to remember what he said is giving me a headache. Do people with diesel engines think that running at idle is good for the engine?


Diesel's actually rebuild themselves idling so its good for them!