A while back I had solicited opinions on what transmission fluid would work best in my 1986 Mercury Capri C3 automatic transmission. It seemed the opinion swayed towards using an inexpensive parts store brand Dex/Merc product since they often tend to be a bit thicker. I bought 12 quarts from the local Advance Auto in the Advance Auto brand. The fluid in the transmission was not bad, it was just worn out. Time and miles took its toll on it so it was time to make the fluid exchange. I completed the exchange over the course of several days by sucking 2 quarts out with a pump and adding 2 new quarts in its place. Then I would drive it and repeat the procedure the next day. After getting all 12 quarts changed out, the transmission does not shift as nicely as it used to. The shift from first to second is not only too soon, but much more harsh than it used to be. The second to third shift is really dopey feeling and often too soon as well. It seems the new, slightly thinner feeling fluid may have caused the transmission to not operate as well. Would the addition of a quart of the Lucas Transmission Fix help? With this transmission being older, a few people had expressed they felt a thicker fluid may be needed for this transmission due to age and the fact that older fluids were most likely thicker, especially the Dexron II/Mercon that the transmission was originally spec'd for. I'd like some input as to which route I should take here. Would the Lucas be a good or bad idea too?
Did a fluid exchange and shifting is worse.
- Thread starter ethangsmith
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Try some LubeGard, and give it some time.
Lucas has shown to have little to no additives that do much of anything. I would be very careful using it on anything that isn't in the "Walking Dead" state and that you are only attempting to prolong its un-dead state.
I would first try a bottle of Lubeguard Red. The 10 Ounce bottle about $11 down here in Texas. You could use 2 in your transmission as their instructions are a max treatment of 2 fluid Oz per quart, but I would start with just one.
I've had good experiences with Lubeguard Red.
I would first try a bottle of Lubeguard Red. The 10 Ounce bottle about $11 down here in Texas. You could use 2 in your transmission as their instructions are a max treatment of 2 fluid Oz per quart, but I would start with just one.
I've had good experiences with Lubeguard Red.
If this sucker uses clutch bands, they're toast. Sorry
did you change the filter?
To answer a few questions- I did already add the Lubegard Red. It goes in every transmission I do a fluid exchange on.
The C3 transmission does not have a throttle valve cable or any electronic pressure solenoid. It's internal line pressures and shifts are completely governed by itself with the aide of a vacuum modulator on the side of the transmission. I found in my Ford manual that the intermediate band is adjustable externally to help the shifts, but I don't have the tools to do it right. Why would this new fluid make the shifts change so much? Did I loosen dirt and create a problem?
The C3 transmission does not have a throttle valve cable or any electronic pressure solenoid. It's internal line pressures and shifts are completely governed by itself with the aide of a vacuum modulator on the side of the transmission. I found in my Ford manual that the intermediate band is adjustable externally to help the shifts, but I don't have the tools to do it right. Why would this new fluid make the shifts change so much? Did I loosen dirt and create a problem?
You do realize that the way you did it was the worst possible way to do it. Changing 2 out of 10 QTs (I am guessing on total capacity) many times is a very slow way to get anywhere close to 90%. It would probably take you at least 10 tries using 2 QTs at a try.
Forget the Lucas anything.
You say the old fluid was not bad, just worn out. How did you determine that? Was is not black? Did it smell? Unless you did a UOA you have no real idea of what condition the old fluid was in except to say it was not new.
Forget the Lucas anything.
You say the old fluid was not bad, just worn out. How did you determine that? Was is not black? Did it smell? Unless you did a UOA you have no real idea of what condition the old fluid was in except to say it was not new.
Originally Posted By: ethangsmith
Did I loosen dirt and create a problem?
Possibly so. That's why you need to change the filter now.
How many miles are on the transmission?
I found in my Ford manual that the intermediate band is adjustable externally to help the shifts, but I don't have the tools to do it right
What tools? I suspect that all you really need to do is adjust the pressure. I would just adjust it down a little (having said that, high mileage automatic transmissions often need a slight increase in oil pressure to work right).
It seems the new, slightly thinner feeling fluid may have caused the transmission to not operate as well.
That's possible, but it's also possible that it's working correctly now and you are just used to it working wrong.
I don't think that there is anything seriously wrong here. I have done exactly the same as you just did, except I drove the car for a week or two inbetween siphoning out the fluid and replacing.
I will also assume that you have the proper fluid level (you did check it with the car warmed up and the engine idleing, didn't you?
Also, I have used plenty of WalMart brand transmission fluid and it works just fine.
If it matters, I drive a 1995 Ford Escort LX with it's original automatic transmission at over 208K miles. I occasionally fix transmissions for friends.
Since you have an Escort, head on over to the forums here:
http://www.feoa.net
Did I loosen dirt and create a problem?
Possibly so. That's why you need to change the filter now.
How many miles are on the transmission?
I found in my Ford manual that the intermediate band is adjustable externally to help the shifts, but I don't have the tools to do it right
What tools? I suspect that all you really need to do is adjust the pressure. I would just adjust it down a little (having said that, high mileage automatic transmissions often need a slight increase in oil pressure to work right).
It seems the new, slightly thinner feeling fluid may have caused the transmission to not operate as well.
That's possible, but it's also possible that it's working correctly now and you are just used to it working wrong.
I don't think that there is anything seriously wrong here. I have done exactly the same as you just did, except I drove the car for a week or two inbetween siphoning out the fluid and replacing.
I will also assume that you have the proper fluid level (you did check it with the car warmed up and the engine idleing, didn't you?
Also, I have used plenty of WalMart brand transmission fluid and it works just fine.
If it matters, I drive a 1995 Ford Escort LX with it's original automatic transmission at over 208K miles. I occasionally fix transmissions for friends.
Since you have an Escort, head on over to the forums here:
http://www.feoa.net
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Before you solicit solutions for your problem, and people post their opinions, there are questions that need to be answered first. Receiving intelligent, thoughtful solutions first require accurate, honest info from you.
As Large asked, have you changed the filter ?
Did something happen that led you to change the fluid ?
How many miles are on the transmission ?
How long have you had this vehicle ?
Exactly what ATF did you put into the trans ?
Can you more accurately describe the fluid that came out ?
Your description of the fluid is useless, yet it is critical info.
Keith
As Large asked, have you changed the filter ?
Did something happen that led you to change the fluid ?
How many miles are on the transmission ?
How long have you had this vehicle ?
Exactly what ATF did you put into the trans ?
Can you more accurately describe the fluid that came out ?
Your description of the fluid is useless, yet it is critical info.
Keith
If you have the old fluid uncontaminated, maybe a UOA?
Its possible new ATF has loosened dirt/crud and it is clogging your filter.
A Magnefine inline filter is always a good option.
Since you went the siphon route, I will assume you did not want to touch the pan and left the old filter in.
Its possible new ATF has loosened dirt/crud and it is clogging your filter.
A Magnefine inline filter is always a good option.
Since you went the siphon route, I will assume you did not want to touch the pan and left the old filter in.
Originally Posted By: KB2008X
Before you solicit solutions for your problem, and people post their opinions, there are questions that need to be answered first. Receiving intelligent, thoughtful solutions first require accurate, honest info from you.
As Large asked, have you changed the filter ?
Did something happen that led you to change the fluid ?
How many miles are on the transmission ?
How long have you had this vehicle ?
Exactly what ATF did you put into the trans ?
Can you more accurately describe the fluid that came out ?
Your description of the fluid is useless, yet it is critical info.
Keith
I did not change the filter since the fluid that came out was very clean. The fluid did not stink like it was burnt at all. It was a red-brown color without any milkiness or particles. This is why I did not touch the filter. Getting clean, used fluid out did not raise any suspicions about particles. The transmission has either 120K or 220K on it. The car has only a 5 digit odometer and we are unsure of the title's mileage is even accurate. I've had the car for 12 years- since 2000. When I bought the car, the transmission had just been flushed and new seals and a filter were put in. After my fluid exchange, I did make sure the fluid was at the proper level. One extra thing to note- when I am accelerating hard, the transmission still holds its shifts well and shifts smoothly. It's only at low speed driving it shifts poorly. Lastly, as I had said before, I used Advance Auto brand Dex/Merc fluid in gallon form.
Before you solicit solutions for your problem, and people post their opinions, there are questions that need to be answered first. Receiving intelligent, thoughtful solutions first require accurate, honest info from you.
As Large asked, have you changed the filter ?
Did something happen that led you to change the fluid ?
How many miles are on the transmission ?
How long have you had this vehicle ?
Exactly what ATF did you put into the trans ?
Can you more accurately describe the fluid that came out ?
Your description of the fluid is useless, yet it is critical info.
Keith
I did not change the filter since the fluid that came out was very clean. The fluid did not stink like it was burnt at all. It was a red-brown color without any milkiness or particles. This is why I did not touch the filter. Getting clean, used fluid out did not raise any suspicions about particles. The transmission has either 120K or 220K on it. The car has only a 5 digit odometer and we are unsure of the title's mileage is even accurate. I've had the car for 12 years- since 2000. When I bought the car, the transmission had just been flushed and new seals and a filter were put in. After my fluid exchange, I did make sure the fluid was at the proper level. One extra thing to note- when I am accelerating hard, the transmission still holds its shifts well and shifts smoothly. It's only at low speed driving it shifts poorly. Lastly, as I had said before, I used Advance Auto brand Dex/Merc fluid in gallon form.
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I would change the filter. Its got 12 years on it from reading your post.
The C3 takes 8 QTs total. You should have used the 10 QTs for a cooler line flush. Your method probably got maybe 50-60% new fluid.
There was a TSB for your vehicle to use Mercon V.
Again - what prompted you to change the ATF after 12 years?
The C3 takes 8 QTs total. You should have used the 10 QTs for a cooler line flush. Your method probably got maybe 50-60% new fluid.
There was a TSB for your vehicle to use Mercon V.
Again - what prompted you to change the ATF after 12 years?
Simply to put new fluid in it. No other reason. I know just time and miles break fluids down, so I figured some new fluid certainly wouldn't be a bad idea.
On a positive note, Advance Auto's Dex/Merc is usually from Warren Dist. Look for a Wne, WPP, or Wse on the bottom. That stuff works fine in all the occasions I've used it.
I change my filter every time the pan comes off... filter and magnet wipe-down...
I change my filter every time the pan comes off... filter and magnet wipe-down...
Good to know. Doing a filter on this transmission is a pain in the rear end. You have to suck the fluid out (No drain plug in the pan!) and then drop the pan, which I'm told is a chore and gets very messy.
As a second note, if I should decide to drop the pan (Or have a shop do it.....) is there a way to add a magnet to the pan? The C3 does not come with a magnet from what I've been told.
As a second note, if I should decide to drop the pan (Or have a shop do it.....) is there a way to add a magnet to the pan? The C3 does not come with a magnet from what I've been told.
Originally Posted By: ethangsmith
Good to know. Doing a filter on this transmission is a pain in the rear end. You have to suck the fluid out (No drain plug in the pan!) and then drop the pan, which I'm told is a chore and gets very messy.
As a second note, if I should decide to drop the pan (Or have a shop do it.....) is there a way to add a magnet to the pan? The C3 does not come with a magnet from what I've been told.
I would think you could get a magnet from a dealer for a car that has one. Or from an old hard disk.
Install a drain plug and a magnetic drain plug?
Personally I would forget the magnet and install an inline Magnefine filter which has a magnet right in the flow and does catch metal (mine and others have a metal paste covering the Magnefine filter when you take it apart.
Good to know. Doing a filter on this transmission is a pain in the rear end. You have to suck the fluid out (No drain plug in the pan!) and then drop the pan, which I'm told is a chore and gets very messy.
As a second note, if I should decide to drop the pan (Or have a shop do it.....) is there a way to add a magnet to the pan? The C3 does not come with a magnet from what I've been told.
I would think you could get a magnet from a dealer for a car that has one. Or from an old hard disk.
Install a drain plug and a magnetic drain plug?
Personally I would forget the magnet and install an inline Magnefine filter which has a magnet right in the flow and does catch metal (mine and others have a metal paste covering the Magnefine filter when you take it apart.
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