Coolant leak in the passenger foot well

[addyguy]

Car still wasn't worth it - you spent 3 times the cars purchase price on this one repair alone!

You could have made 'probably' a years worth of payments on a new Yaris for what you just paid for that ONE repair.

I speak from experience - my first car was a 1985 Buick Skyhawk that I bought for $1200. It was in the shop every month, and I just kept telling myself 'this will be the last repair', and two years later, I dumped it for $300, having spent over $4000 to keep it running. It was still a cheap piece of junk at the end.

Since then, if I've had a 10+ year-old vehicle that needs more than its basically worth in repairs, its gone. I learned, and maybe you will someday.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: sifan
Who knows if the new parts were defective without being pressure tested.


Pressure test is not a QA process; it is a test to find out where is the already existing leak.

Under normal driving if there is a leak you will find out gradually within a couple of days. The mechanic always do a test drive or idle to warm up test and make sure their work is done right, before they give it back to you.

The reason they charge 1hr of labor for pressure test is because of the loading/unloading, cooling down the car, bringing out the tool, etc. They can't do work for free so they charge minimum labor, which is 1 hr. When the car is already doing other work, it takes an additional 30 seconds to 5 minutes to do a pressure test. Also like I said before, a "drain till its water then refill concentrate coolant" type of flush is already performed with the radiator replacement's labor.

Like I said before, there is nothing wrong with getting a car pass 300k and nothing wrong with fixing the problems you have. You just need a more honest mechanic, and start learning how a car works even if you don't do the work yourself (so the mechanics can't lie to you).

I've had a tire shop told me that I need to rotate and balance my other tire when I fix a flat, because otherwise it wouldn't run straight. Needless to say that's the last time I visit that place.

 

[demarpaint]

I had a shop tell me I needed rear brakes because he could see the rivets. They were about 1/8" below the lining. I politely said no thanks. Then he opened up a box of brake shoes to show me how you couldn't see rivets. I told him there were bonded, and riveted shoes. Mine were the riveted kind, and had plenty of life remaining. I suggested he try it on someone else and laughed at him. I won't be going to that shop anymore either.

My suggestion now to the OP is find a new shop, and get rid of that car, it's no longer worth sinking money into.

 

[sifan]

With today's economy I will be extremely concerned about my job security. I need a reliable car to work but don't want to put down the downpayment for a new Yaris and pay for full auto insurance coverage. What were I going to do with a Yaris when I got layoff with remaining new car payments to pay? Sell it and take a loss in the recession? Right now GEICO charges me $300 (which is a lot of money) annually for liability insurance on my Tercel since I am doing 72 mile round trip commute to work on weekdays. Full converage is mandatory for car loan. Besides, Yaris is not as fuel efficient as Tercel. You do the math. I will stick to my Tercel and upkeep the maintenance as it goes. Tercel is one tough little car and will take the beating and keep on going. I can not say the same to the domestic cars.

Even if the economy were good, I would still keep my Tercel and save the money for retirement or my children's college funds, or pay off the mortgage. Nowadays, the new Toyota cars are not as durable and reliable as theirs made in the mid 1990s.

Please check out the following site on Tercel reviews:
http://www.carsurvey.org/reviews/toyota/tercel/

 

[PandaBear]

Sifan,

No need to get angry. I agree with you that keeping the Tercel is Ok, except that you seriously need a new shop.

It is important to know how to fix a car and how many of the components work, fail, and cost, so that the crocks out there cannot scam you into unneeded services.

Most shop don't scam you on cost of components and the amount of labors, because they are well published info and could easily get them into trouble. What they usually do is to get you into unnecessary repairs that are of high cost and little to no benefit.

The coolant drain and refill on top of the radiator replacement is a good example.

 

[sifan]

On the night drop form I checked the box for cooling system flush and asked for radiator checkup. It was on the phone afterward that i agreed on the additional radiator replacement without being informed that a cooling system flush would be included. They charged me according to what I requested technically. I understand that a repair shop tries to survive in this tough economy. I agree I need to be educated more on car repairs and how they are charged. Thanks.

 

[addyguy]

Sifan,

I'll come around a bit, and agree there is merit in you logic. Don't want you to feel 'hounded'. In uncertain times, you don't want to be stuck with long-term financial commitments that you may not be able to meet. Your car and its repairs are paid for, so as you say, if you lose your job, your cars is still useable to look for another one!

That logic was the same one I used for most of my life, buying older used cars so there was no long-term loan to be trapped with. Just that after getting 'hosed' by my first car, I moved on to other used cars when the repairs exceeded the value. Did I come out ahead? Who knows!

There are a lot of extra cost that come with a much newer car, like the increased insurace you mention, and down payment and taxes...so you are avoiding those.

And finally, trust me, I do know how relaible Toyota's, especially Tercels, are. Dad had an '89 that survived dropping all the oil on an errand run, and I knew lots of people who drove them to ungodly mileages. I personally had a 1991 Corolla SR-5 coupe that I drove to 135k miles, then sold it to a buddy who went to nearly 250k on it, before rust got it. They are good cars!

May I ask what oil/filter/interval do you use on this car?

Hopefully no hurt feelings,

Addyguy

 

[sifan]

No hurt feelings. I share your experience. My previous car was a 1991 Honda Civic DX given by my aunt with 70K miles. It costed me $12,000 for the ownership when it reached 150K miles. It was a long story. It was my first and last Honda. I gave it to my father, who is still driving it. After reading the owner reviews on this particular Honda model year on carsurvey.org I realized all the reported mechanical issues happened to my Civic. That is why I picked Tercel after reading all the good reviews on it.

When I first got the car, I used 10W30 Havoline dyno with 3K miles OCI. The used oil looked really dirty. So, about 6K miles ago I installed a Frantz oil bypass filter using a toilet paper roll as the filtering element on my Tercel. I chose 5W30 Mobil 5000 for its detergent. I replaced the first roll after 3K miles, the oil was still very dirty. Afterward I changed the roll every 1000 miles and add 1 quart this winter. This spring I will try any 10W30 dyno oil that is on sale. Depending on the results I might return to 10W30 Mobil 5000 since I am into long OCI with the bypass oil filter.

I used to use a Toyota full flow oil filter, but it caused severe oil leak around the sanwich adaptor due to its thin rubber O-ring (with a circular cross section) no matter how tightly I screwed it. Now I use a Pulator or Fram Tough Guard full flow oil filter which has a thicker O-ring (with a square cross section) that gives a better seal. No more oil leak now. I usually change the full flow oil filter every 3K miles since the Tercel engine is very hard on oil. From one of the Tercel review on carsurvey.org the owner had a 1500 mile OCI. I know someone will suggests that 3K miles is too soon to replace the full flow oil filter. However, since the bypass filter only clean 5% of oil, the full flow oil filter is till working hard on trapping large particles in 95% of oil.

 

[addyguy]

I also had a 1986 Honda Civic Hatch that was wrecked. It was a great car - was sad to see it written off!

Sounds like you are getting this car ready for serious commuting work! I agree these Tercel 1.5's seem to be hard on oil - they only have 3 liters in them (stock), so it must get used up. I think 10w30 Havoline is a great oil - I'm planning on going back to using that on my Cavalier.

How is your consumption? I used to work in a WM oil shop, and when we got older Tercels in, they were often low on oil. I know my dad's used a fair bit of oil (the oil drop didn't help!). My Corolla hardly used a drop, neither did my Civic. In fact, I've never owned a vehicle with a significant oil consumption problem!

 

[sifan]

After the replacement of all the internal engine seals around the timing belt area and the valve cover gasket the engine consumed about 1 quart of oil every 1K miles. After the installation of Frantz oil bypass filter the oil consumption drops to about 1/2 quart every 1K miles. The bypass filter bumps the oil capacity from 3 quarts to 4. A mechanic once told me that Tercel's 5EFE engine is an oil burner.

 

[PandaBear]

Sifan,

Now it makes much more sense why you are keeping this car for long, because you have invested a bypass filter on it.

Does the oil really come out dirty? or is it just dark? Oil gets dark due to particle loading and heat activating the additives. Unless you do a UOA, you couldn't tell whether it is dirty or normal.

I was going to suggest some stuff you could check out on, but decided not to because you may spend the money on that mechanic to fix it preemptively.

 

[sifan]

I do not know exactly how to distinguish between dirty and dark visually. I understand the fact that oil truns dark due to suspended dirty particles. But, either way it is not a good sign to keep the oil in the engine for long. Before using the bypass filter I would say the oil was really dirty like being burned (thick and black). I just checked the oil this morning with the TP roll replacement due next 100 miles. The oil looked dark but not dirty because I could see the golden brown color on a piece of white tissue paper under the sun light.

Well, I want to be educated. Please shoot your ideas.

 

[Jim 5]

I can understand this, but I think the OP needs to find a U-wrench or rent-a-garage and do this work himself. There are plenty of junkyard fixes as mentioned, but it doesn't seem economical to pay premium rates for a car of this value.

Anybody who's willing can do this kind of work on a car, you just need a place to do it. Space can be rented by the hour in any medium to large city.

Nothing wrong with a car addiction if you can keep it economical and sensible.

 

[oilboy123]

Seems like the shop supply charges are kinda high?