Consumer vehicle battery specs - not found

[rlaggren]

I bought an Interstate AGM battery, naively assuming it would be straight forward to get charging specs. Not so. Starting from the store where I bought it where the clearly experienced sales person went into the back room and came out 5 minutes later mumbling about this and that to 3-4 hours on the net looking for _any_ mention of Interstate AGM specs, I have come up empty.

Anybody have thoughts on finding consumer battery specs? Interstate in particular, but maybe this is just the way it is now?


Rufus

 

[UG_Passat]

It's an AGM. So you want a charger that you can switch the charging profile to AGM, from the typical flooded battery

 

[rlaggren]

UG.
Thanks for the quick reply.

Now I look, I wasn't clear enough with my question. I'm looking for the manufacturer's specs for charging the battery, which generally list the voltage and current to be maintained at different stages of the charge. _And_ the full charge resting voltage after surface charge has dissipated, and the self discharge rate. I would hope to find very exact specs for these value.

I have a Pro-Logix PL2140 maintainer with what looks like (from their literature) a 4 or 5 stage charging profile. They describe:
- "fast charge"; which I measure at various voltages, peaking at 14.6v - presumably, current would be 4amps
- "absorbtion"; " at 14.3(?)v, current reducing to below 2amps
- "completion" " at 12.6(?)v, current dropping more and approaching 0amps
- "resting" " at 12.4(?)v when the charger drops into maintenance and essentially shuts off until it tests at some later time and tops off. I am unsure of the exact voltages because I have not tried to test rigorously every 10 minutes or whatever over the 3 or 4 hours the charger will take to cycle after I discharge the battery below 12.2 volts recharging from 12.2 takes more like 8 hours with this maintainer - s/b "after battery volts drop below 12.6". I have only checked on it as I get a chance while doing other stuff.

I'm going to get on Pro-Logix about _their_ voltages, which seem low to me (except the initial 14.6v a few minutes after connecting for any charging).

However, before talking with Pro-Logix, I would much like to find Interstate's official specs on how they want their battery charged, various voltages and switching points; and, particularly, what the battery's fully charged resting volts s/b after surface charge has gone. To the 1/100 volt if at all possible.

Unfortunately, I have a bit of attitude about the responsibility and expected integrity of companies producing a technical product for which good care and handling requires specific information be readily available. At the very least. Honest detailed specific instructions on the importance and consequences of said information and care would be a big plus over and above the data itself. Unfortunately, this information has begun to look like it may not even exist in the case of Interstate batteries.

This lack looks to mean the next time I need a battery I have to see if a product has data available before I consider it further. I had just assumed... When I get more time I'm going to do a search for the battery specs of different makes/models and if I can't find any info, put that battery on a black-list.

But I'm still trying to think Interstate is just a bit backwards about publishing and has not simply stopped providing any customer access to detailed (and important) product data. Maybe because "if we don't provide any info, nobody can call us on it..."? I certainly hope not. It's hard to believe that fleet managers and large OEM's would go along with that crap.


Regards,
Rufus

 

[f355spider]

Rufus, this is not anything specific to Interstate....it is throughout all industries that do not wish to share information to maintain or repair their products. Interstate flooded or AGM batteries do not have any special construction or formulation processes that they promote, so the general charging and maintenance guidance from the battery industry may be the best you can do.

I do see Optima, Odyssey and a few other manufacturers with unique construction that call out their specific charging recommendations. Don't see much from the mainstream manufacturers.

It is a very small market segment that care about such things, and why manufacturers don't care. Look at the average consumer of a car battery, tires, brakes...do they care about specifications, maintenance or service? No, they just want to get back on the road and carry on their day.

 

[brianl703]

Assuming that the battery is made by Clarios:

Contact Us

www.clarios.com

They have a toll-free tech support number, 888-867-8462, though this may only be for Optima batteries (Clarios makes Optima batteries) I'd call anyway, even if they can't help they may be able to give you a number for tech support that can.

 

[rlaggren]

Spider
I'm thinking you're right. I'll look around at some more of the other brands a little, but ...

Brian
Thx for that number. I'll have to decide how much I want to pursue this. I'm going to post some readings taken during the Pro-Logix 2140 charge cycle. "Restarted" after a day of "rest" after the 2nd full charge cycle on the battery; during the rest period, the the maintainer remained connected, but lights indicated that it was "resting").

 

[rlaggren]

Here are my readings during a 4th charge cycle since I bought the battery 1 week ago. The readings began after 12 hours w/out the maintainer attached and the battery voltage declining .01v or so every hour or so.

It appears that on initial connection maintainer immediately ran the amps up to max (4amps) at 14.5-6 volts for 3-4 minutes; this is a guess because I don't have an amp meter attached. Then it reverted to "completion" phase at 13.43v and slowly lessening. This is with a cheap GB meter rated at 1.5%+2 which, if I calc right, works out to +/- .11 volt. But the meter seems well made so I'm willing to believe it maintains some consistency and thus the readings are good, relative to each other. I have now put an little panel meter on it which claims .3% + 2, with the lsd=1mv. This immediately read .02v lower than the GB, and I'm inclined to go with this correction if considering absolute voltages.

12.84 - after a full charge previous day and sitting unconnected overnight
14.64 - attach maintainer, 3 min. in, charge light solid
14.65 - 6 min. in
13.43 - 10 min in; blinking charge light = "completion" phase
13.43 - 20 min. in; blinking
13.43 - 3-1/2hrs in; blinking
13.43 - 4-1/2hrs in; blinking
12.99 - 5hrs in; charge light off, complete light blinking = "resting" phase
12.91 - 7hrs
12.89 - 9hrs
12.86 - 13hrs
12.83 - 24hrs; somewhere in here the complete light went solid
12.83 - 29hrs
12.83 - 34-1/2hrs
12.82 - 49-1/2hrs; maintainer still attached
12.801 - 49-1/2hrs; maintainer removed; panel meter reading
12.787- 51hrs; voltage declining

The charger/maintainer clearly has a plan, but from I have read, the ending voltage of 12.8 is .2 low for AGM batteries.

The other issue I may have is the self discharge which I'll record today and tomorrow. The specs provided with the cheap meter look good, but don't include the input impedance and the vendor specifically disclaims all responsibility in the docs they make available. So it looks like I need to find an ampmeter and see what the lcd meter draws. It's a red 5-digit readout, numbers about 3/8 high, but I'm not an electronics buff and don't right off know what that implies for a load. Anybody?


Rufus

 

[f355spider]

oved; panel meter reading
12.787- 51hrs; voltage declining

The charger/maintainer clearly has a plan, but from I have read, the ending voltage of 12.8 is .2 low for AGM batteries.

Depends on the algorithm. Most maintainers will hold at around 13.2 to 13.3vt at 70F to 80F degrees. If temp compensation is built-in, it will decrease with higher temps and increase with colder temperatures. In my garage in winter, I see around 13.7vt with high 30s ambient temperature with my Battery Minders set on AGM. Some maintainers hold more like 13.6vt continuously without temp compensation.

Every manufacturer is different. You buy into whichever you trust or believe is ideal....or ideal for your circumstances and use. Pro-Logix is a respected brand. I don't own one, but am considering buying one to add to my collection.

Some battery maintainers don't hold the voltage at a set point....they let it drop to some point, then bring it back up. They claim this "exercise" is better for the battery. The concern is what if you need to use the battery and it is nearing the bottom of the point where it will start charging back up again? You will not be starting off in an ideal state. Sounds like the Pro Logix uses this type of programming.

 

[rlaggren]

Thanks for the thoughts.

> programming ["float"]
I don't think it's reached that point yet. At least I haven't caught it in the act and I don't have an ammeter nor a data logging capable meter. Tempting - started looking at likely meters, but the good ones cost. And I'm not getting _two_ of them...

IAC, I detached the Pro-logix maintainer a few hours ago and the measurements since are just the battery eating itself + the draw of the LCD panel volt meter I have hooked across the batt terminals. I do have a very old, small and cheap analog multimeter that reads up to 250ma, but putting it in series with the darn LCD panel meter pins the needle on it. It seems to think the LCD panel meter is pulling somewhere around 500ma. That looks kinda strange, but maybe I just don't appreciate what 5 LCD digits draw; or maybe the resistors in the old analog meter are wacko... But if the LCD volt meter really is pulling 400-500ma that would explain why the battery voltage is dropping quicker than I'd expect when the maintainer is disconnected. Might cobble up an independent supply for the panel meter if I get real motivated - see if that eliminates that "large" current draw powering the LCD panel meter that's freaking the ancient analog meter.

Going to put an actual load on the battery and run it down a little, then put the maintainer back on and let it do another cycle. That will be the third charge since I got the batt. If I understand right, a new battery needs a couple charge cycles to work into it's rated specs. That's the buzz I read, anyway. I don't have a full size charger for this location, but the finishing voltage did seem to be higher at the end of the second cycle of the little Pro-logix. TBD.