Compressor-Side Turbo Oil Leak

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I purchased my 2004 VW Passat GLS sedan with the 1.8T last September with 71,000 on the clock and all seemed well and fine until I decided to perform some maintenance. So far I’ve replaced the timing belt, changed the coolant temp sensor, cleaned out the PCV system and added 16,000 miles. My remaining issue is that my lower crossover pipe that runs from the turbo to the charge air cooler fills up with oil over the course of my 5000 mile OCIs. Actually, it all goes into the intercooler since there's a sloped bottom to it so it puddles in there. The volume of oil, while I haven’t measured it using a measuring cup, is quite significant. I figure that I wipe out about half of a pint after 5000 miles. I think that’s more than what’s supposed to be there from the PCV system. I typically do highway driving and I’ve figured out that if I keep the turbo spooling to a minimum, the oil doesn't go down as much. Taking it easy, I typically lose about a quart every 2000 miles. So, it’s going somewhere else besides just collecting in the pipe. I think what happens is that after it leaks past the piston seal on the compressor side of the turbo, it hits the compressor wheel and turns it into a mist. Some of the oil collects on the walls of the intake tract (especially the intercooler) while the rest is burned in the combustion chambers.

I've tried investigating it myself but I’d like to hear what others have to say. I'm almost positive that it's just the piston seal on the compressor side of the turbo. I don't get any color smoke out of the tailpipe so I think I’m good with the turbine side. I've run a compression check on the cylinders and they were all around 195 psi after warming the engine. That tells me that blow by isn't an issue, as well as the fact that I’ve cleaned the PCV system. I’ve had the entire lower intake tract down and I’ve looked inside the intercooler as well as up into the compressor outlet. You can see the oil dripping down the intercooler fins and inside the compressor housing you can see where it slings the oil around. I've also had the intake downpipe off and I felt no longitudinal movement in the shaft and a little radial movement, just as there is supposed to be. I’ve also seen oil right before the intake butterfly valve, so I know it gets up there too.

My concern though is that I can't seem to find anyone else having a similar problem with their vehicle. I’ve been searching the internet for a similar scenario since I found it a few months ago, but I have never seen anyone with a leak just because a seal went. It’s always because the crankcase pressure is building up from a clogged PCV system or because their whole turbo went south and either smacked the inside of the housing or is smoking like a chimney out of the tailpipe. I also think its odd how it’s leaking so early in its life and only on the compressor side.

My plan of attack is to either buy a rebuild kit for the turbo or try to clean it up using Auto-RX. I’ve had some marvel mystery oil in the crankcase with Rotella T6 for about 3000 miles, but the leak seems to be about the same. I was going to switch to a 15w-40 HDEO to use with the Auto-RX but I’m not 100% sure it’s the seal or if Auto-RX would even do anything. So, I guess I’m really asking if you guys think that running Auto-RX would be the best bet or to just get in there and rebuild the turbo. I’m handy enough to complete either task but I'd rather choose the less invasive of the options.
 
It's the oil seal for the turbocharger 100%. If you don't keep boost on it, oil will seep out of those seals and into the intercooler & ductwork.

There's a two-pronged approach to solving this problem:
1. Keep the engine on boost: Floor it once in a while. Make sure the N75 valve & all vacuum lines to/from it are in good shape (ie, that the turbo produces the amount of boost it's supposed to make). Get someone with VCDS to log MAPS/MAPA/RPM & the MAF reading to make sure everything looks kosher.

2. Oil choice: For all its plusses, Rotella T6 5w40 seems to slip by the oil seals more readily than other oils. I have noticed this myself in the NB and others on TDIClub have as well. You may try switching to Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5w40 and see if that slows consumption.

But if the seals are truly leaking, nothing else will help than getting them fixed via rebuild. ARX most likely will not do anything for it.
 
Originally Posted By: scurvy

But if the seals are truly leaking, nothing else will help than getting them fixed via rebuild. ARX most likely will not do anything for it.


+1
 
Ok, I see what you mean. However, I think it's when I boost that I lose more oil through the seal. I understand that under boost the pressure differential across the seal is less, but for some reason that makes it worse. Maybe the shaft isn't balanced for some reason which opens a gap on the opposite side of the heavy spot for the oil to slip past. It seems to boost fine though and there doesn't appear to be any sort of excess vibration or noise.

Also, isn't the turbo seal like the rings on a piston? I've read somewhere that the rings don't actually spin with the shaft, so what would make them wear out? I was thinking that, like piston rings, carbonized oil could build up beneath the ring and thereby cause it to stick to the shaft. So, when it rotates, it would prevent the seal from making a tight fit on the inside of the housing. That would kind of explain why it leaks more when it's rotating. That's also why I was wondering if the Auto-RX would alleviate the issue since I know how it likes to free stuck rings.
 
Originally Posted By: TZero
Also, isn't the turbo seal like the rings on a piston? I've read somewhere that the rings don't actually spin with the shaft, so what would make them wear out?

I believe the K03 turbochargers have a labyrinth-type seal, which means you have stationary rings of the housing and rotating rings of the shaft. These rings don't actually touch and it's nothing but flow reversals & differential pressure what keep oil from seeping out.

If you do have coked oil in there from running oil too long, poor quality oil, abusing the turbocharger or frequent hot shutdowns it's possible ARX could do something for you IFF coked oil is causing a poor seal. But I would also expect the turbo to be short lived if this were the case as it could also be coked on the bearings.

EDIT: When the turbo is on boost, that creates MORE differential pressure across the seal which keeps oil IN. If the shaft wasn't balanced it would have already grenaded by now. Modern turbochargers are very, very sensitive & intolerant of imbalance. You'd hear it as well, and you could probably have a look to see scoring on the wheels/housings if you popped off the ductwork.

I mean, it's your money and will probably take 5 - 10k miles with ARX before you notice anything, if indeed it does something for you. Personally I'd ditch the thinned out RT6 first and try M1 TDT for at least 5k miles before trying ARX. And I'd start saving for a rebuilt K03, K03s or K04. Turbo problems are frequently cause for upgrades.
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I think what I'll do is hold out on the rebuild until I'm up for my oil change (should be about a month). I don't think there's any cause for concern over what's in there now so I can bear to wait. I want to run an Auto-RX cycle through it eventually, but only after I run a few OCIs through the rebuilt turbo first. The engine doesn't seem like it was beat up but I can't be too sure and I don't want to take any chances. The previous owner appeared to have brought it to be serviced at the local dealer and we all know how the dealers follow strict guidelines for oil
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If I peer into the oil fill cap I can see dark brown varnish on the wall of the valve cover. I know, that's not an indicator of sludge. However, it is evidence that the oil used was not the latest and greatest at the time. Obviously, the plastic camshaft cover obstructs my view of anything that would clearly state the condition of the engine, but why take chances? Hopefully, if I ever have to replace the valve cover gasket I’ll just find the varnish on the cover and not much accumulation on the valves or the cylinder head.

There's one topic I still don't understand, though. Why do the seals go bad if they never touch? I understand how they work (I’m a mechanical engineer) but if they never touch, then they can never wear and that means they last forever (which nothing does but that's beside the point). The only reason I can see them wearing is if the rings that are fixed to the shaft rub against the stationary ring, but that's the thrust collar's job. So what causes them to leak? Any idea what type of material they're made of? Any insight on what's in store when I rebuild the turbo?
 
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