Comparison: Honda vs. Subaru Inverter Generator
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Originally Posted By: SOHCman
which 3 smaller honda units would you suggest instead of the one large? [/quote]
One could easily purchase a few Northern tool Honda powered units of modest size and a large Honda powered unit for the price of one $4500 6500W Honda Inverter unit. Or the 390cc Honda powered one from Costco for $999 and 2 inverter units.
Here is a "cheap" Honda powered unit that will work well for many households. And parts are readily available for these, unlike many Chinese copies. http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_709_709
Here is a nice 4500W 9HP Honda powered unit: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200467313_200467313
Here is a nice 6500W 13HP Honda powered unit: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200467366_200467366
I like conventional "construction site" type portable generators. Trouble free and anybody can fix them.
which 3 smaller honda units would you suggest instead of the one large? [/quote]
One could easily purchase a few Northern tool Honda powered units of modest size and a large Honda powered unit for the price of one $4500 6500W Honda Inverter unit. Or the 390cc Honda powered one from Costco for $999 and 2 inverter units.
Here is a "cheap" Honda powered unit that will work well for many households. And parts are readily available for these, unlike many Chinese copies. http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_709_709
Here is a nice 4500W 9HP Honda powered unit: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200467313_200467313
Here is a nice 6500W 13HP Honda powered unit: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200467366_200467366
I like conventional "construction site" type portable generators. Trouble free and anybody can fix them.
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That Honda you linked to has no fuel capacity and would be a PITA.
Originally Posted By: Silverado12
That Honda you linked to has no fuel capacity and would be a PITA.
Only the first one. And, if you read the reviews, people love it. It's still a high quality unit for a very cheap price.
The others are professional units that, properly utilized, would serve very well for a lifetime.
That Honda you linked to has no fuel capacity and would be a PITA.
Only the first one. And, if you read the reviews, people love it. It's still a high quality unit for a very cheap price.
The others are professional units that, properly utilized, would serve very well for a lifetime.
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Those appear to ve quality units, with good honda engines. Will they be ok for sensative electronics like computers and such, i was under the impression that thats whi the hondas cost more, the inverter gives cleaner power?? Or not the case?
Originally Posted By: SOHCman
Those appear to ve quality units, with good honda engines. Will they be ok for sensative electronics like computers and such, i was under the impression that thats whi the hondas cost more, the inverter gives cleaner power?? Or not the case?
Last time I checked the part list (PDF from Northern Tools), it appears to me these generators do not have a voltage regulator (or AVR), they use a simpler (and cheaper) regulation by a capacitor. The non-inverter and inverters models from Honda use AVR.
An AVR generator maintain a constant 120V (or 240V) independent of load. There are many thing to consider in selection of generator; power, noise, total harmonic distortion (<=6%), Voltage regulation, efficiency (gas consumption), frequency regulation, etc, etc
Those appear to ve quality units, with good honda engines. Will they be ok for sensative electronics like computers and such, i was under the impression that thats whi the hondas cost more, the inverter gives cleaner power?? Or not the case?
Last time I checked the part list (PDF from Northern Tools), it appears to me these generators do not have a voltage regulator (or AVR), they use a simpler (and cheaper) regulation by a capacitor. The non-inverter and inverters models from Honda use AVR.
An AVR generator maintain a constant 120V (or 240V) independent of load. There are many thing to consider in selection of generator; power, noise, total harmonic distortion (<=6%), Voltage regulation, efficiency (gas consumption), frequency regulation, etc, etc
The Champions are the Rolls Royce of Chinese generators!
Company is headquartered in California, and they stock parts there as well. They have a good reputation on the RV forums.
I have had one for several years and no issues. Mine is the 3500w/4000w surge model. I recently powered my house with it during an ice storm, and it ran most things in the house.
It has an auto voltage regulator and the power seems pretty clean.
Company is headquartered in California, and they stock parts there as well. They have a good reputation on the RV forums.
I have had one for several years and no issues. Mine is the 3500w/4000w surge model. I recently powered my house with it during an ice storm, and it ran most things in the house.
It has an auto voltage regulator and the power seems pretty clean.
I have both and I prefer the Robin/Subaru hands down over the Honda. The Briggs are hard to kill too. They just need to spend more time on a good muffler design. I have a big Briggs and it will turn the muffler end cherry red at night. Not something, I like to have at night running next to my trailer I am sleeping in and gas cans on the ground in a grassy field.
Seeing this thread come back, I figure I'll give an update.
The Subaru was sold...not a good fit for us. Drank gas, and had an annoying low-load engine RPM surge.
We had an outage near bedtime a few weeks back during an ice storm and the Subaru was put into service. It was powering the same appliances as our previous inverter...central heat, fridge, a few lights, bedroom TV. Total run time was just under 8 hours, from 10:20pm to 6am.
We've done this on a gallon or less of gasoline with a Honda eu2000i, and later with a Yamaha EF2400ishc (171cc engine). Next door neighbor runs more load overnight with his Honda EU3000is and averages less than 2 gallons of gas consumption for 8 hours.
This Subaru (211cc engine) drank the entire tank at either 2.4 or 2.9 gallons, depending on which website or manual is read. Either way, over double what the Yamaha carried. By 6am it was stumbling, and it died while I opened the garage door to shut it down. I took it to a local Subaru dealer, and the guys said there was no problem.
The Subaru was sold...not a good fit for us. Drank gas, and had an annoying low-load engine RPM surge.
We had an outage near bedtime a few weeks back during an ice storm and the Subaru was put into service. It was powering the same appliances as our previous inverter...central heat, fridge, a few lights, bedroom TV. Total run time was just under 8 hours, from 10:20pm to 6am.
We've done this on a gallon or less of gasoline with a Honda eu2000i, and later with a Yamaha EF2400ishc (171cc engine). Next door neighbor runs more load overnight with his Honda EU3000is and averages less than 2 gallons of gas consumption for 8 hours.
This Subaru (211cc engine) drank the entire tank at either 2.4 or 2.9 gallons, depending on which website or manual is read. Either way, over double what the Yamaha carried. By 6am it was stumbling, and it died while I opened the garage door to shut it down. I took it to a local Subaru dealer, and the guys said there was no problem.
Originally Posted By: crainholio
Seeing this thread come back, I figure I'll give an update.
The Subaru was sold...not a good fit for us. Drank gas, and had an annoying low-load engine RPM surge.
We had an outage near bedtime a few weeks back during an ice storm and the Subaru was put into service. It was powering the same appliances as our previous inverter...central heat, fridge, a few lights, bedroom TV. Total run time was just under 8 hours, from 10:20pm to 6am.
We've done this on a gallon or less of gasoline with a Honda eu2000i, and later with a Yamaha EF2400ishc (171cc engine). Next door neighbor runs more load overnight with his Honda EU3000is and averages less than 2 gallons of gas consumption for 8 hours.
This Subaru (211cc engine) drank the entire tank at either 2.4 or 2.9 gallons, depending on which website or manual is read. Either way, over double what the Yamaha carried. By 6am it was stumbling, and it died while I opened the garage door to shut it down. I took it to a local Subaru dealer, and the guys said there was no problem.
Granted, it is the largest engine of the bunch and turning a larger generator, or did I read that wrong? Does subarue not have an eco-mode when power demand goes down?
Seeing this thread come back, I figure I'll give an update.
The Subaru was sold...not a good fit for us. Drank gas, and had an annoying low-load engine RPM surge.
We had an outage near bedtime a few weeks back during an ice storm and the Subaru was put into service. It was powering the same appliances as our previous inverter...central heat, fridge, a few lights, bedroom TV. Total run time was just under 8 hours, from 10:20pm to 6am.
We've done this on a gallon or less of gasoline with a Honda eu2000i, and later with a Yamaha EF2400ishc (171cc engine). Next door neighbor runs more load overnight with his Honda EU3000is and averages less than 2 gallons of gas consumption for 8 hours.
This Subaru (211cc engine) drank the entire tank at either 2.4 or 2.9 gallons, depending on which website or manual is read. Either way, over double what the Yamaha carried. By 6am it was stumbling, and it died while I opened the garage door to shut it down. I took it to a local Subaru dealer, and the guys said there was no problem.
Granted, it is the largest engine of the bunch and turning a larger generator, or did I read that wrong? Does subarue not have an eco-mode when power demand goes down?
Originally Posted By: SOHCman
Granted, it is the largest engine of the bunch and turning a larger generator, or did I read that wrong? Does subarue not have an eco-mode when power demand goes down?
At 211cc the Subaru is bigger than the Honda EU3000is which is 196cc. The extra size doesn't seem to account for the nearly 2x fuel consumption IMHO.
With that said, the Subaru still solidly beats conventional gen fuel consumption so it's possible I am just too picky. If I didn't know that I could run the same load and time on nearly 1/2 the gas, I'd probably be very happy with the Subaru.
The punchline is that my house uses less than 500 Watts peak (and 80-110W for most of that, until the fridge compressor powers up) during overnight conditions, and the Subaru was too much generator for my specific application.
Granted, it is the largest engine of the bunch and turning a larger generator, or did I read that wrong? Does subarue not have an eco-mode when power demand goes down?
At 211cc the Subaru is bigger than the Honda EU3000is which is 196cc. The extra size doesn't seem to account for the nearly 2x fuel consumption IMHO.
With that said, the Subaru still solidly beats conventional gen fuel consumption so it's possible I am just too picky. If I didn't know that I could run the same load and time on nearly 1/2 the gas, I'd probably be very happy with the Subaru.
The punchline is that my house uses less than 500 Watts peak (and 80-110W for most of that, until the fridge compressor powers up) during overnight conditions, and the Subaru was too much generator for my specific application.
The start current for a fridge is usually somewhere between 6 to 11 amps, and in general the older the fridge the higher the start current. We have a very old admiral freezer that pulls 17.5 amps startup and 400 watts running (about 3 times what a modern unit will require).
A small genset might have the running watts, but leave you with a refrigerator of warm food if it can't handle the startup current.
If your furnace has a blower motor to circulate air to all the rooms in the house, it may have a start up current of 6 to 14 amps.
In general unless you measure the startup current of every motor, you really have no idea of how much generator you require. So if you are going to go for something smaller, you might want to actually run it before you sell the old larger genset.
Sure a smaller genset (especially an inverter type) will drink less gas, but until you actually see that it can start the fridge a smaller one may not be the proper choice.
A small genset might have the running watts, but leave you with a refrigerator of warm food if it can't handle the startup current.
If your furnace has a blower motor to circulate air to all the rooms in the house, it may have a start up current of 6 to 14 amps.
In general unless you measure the startup current of every motor, you really have no idea of how much generator you require. So if you are going to go for something smaller, you might want to actually run it before you sell the old larger genset.
Sure a smaller genset (especially an inverter type) will drink less gas, but until you actually see that it can start the fridge a smaller one may not be the proper choice.
I've been backing up our house on a 2KW inverter every outage since 2006, night & day.
We have hot water baseboard heat, 1/4 hp Taco circulation pump. If there is a startup surge, it barely registers on the Fluke meter I've been using. Running draw for the heat is 0.8 Amps. Fridge is a fairly recent GE Arctica 2002 vintage and doesn't draw much current either.
The heating system is the real advantage here. I've helped neighbors with forced-air heat (natural gas or oil) and have seen what you're saying...had to disengage the gen's Eco Mode and let it run WOT to get the blower fan running. I'd want a bigger gen in that case.
Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
The start current for a fridge is usually somewhere between 6 to 11 amps, and in general the older the fridge the higher the start current. We have a very old admiral freezer that pulls 17.5 amps startup and 400 watts running (about 3 times what a modern unit will require).
A small genset might have the running watts, but leave you with a refrigerator of warm food if it can't handle the startup current.
If your furnace has a blower motor to circulate air to all the rooms in the house, it may have a start up current of 6 to 14 amps.
In general unless you measure the startup current of every motor, you really have no idea of how much generator you require. So if you are going to go for something smaller, you might want to actually run it before you sell the old larger genset.
Sure a smaller genset (especially an inverter type) will drink less gas, but until you actually see that it can start the fridge a smaller one may not be the proper choice.
We have hot water baseboard heat, 1/4 hp Taco circulation pump. If there is a startup surge, it barely registers on the Fluke meter I've been using. Running draw for the heat is 0.8 Amps. Fridge is a fairly recent GE Arctica 2002 vintage and doesn't draw much current either.
The heating system is the real advantage here. I've helped neighbors with forced-air heat (natural gas or oil) and have seen what you're saying...had to disengage the gen's Eco Mode and let it run WOT to get the blower fan running. I'd want a bigger gen in that case.
Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
The start current for a fridge is usually somewhere between 6 to 11 amps, and in general the older the fridge the higher the start current. We have a very old admiral freezer that pulls 17.5 amps startup and 400 watts running (about 3 times what a modern unit will require).
A small genset might have the running watts, but leave you with a refrigerator of warm food if it can't handle the startup current.
If your furnace has a blower motor to circulate air to all the rooms in the house, it may have a start up current of 6 to 14 amps.
In general unless you measure the startup current of every motor, you really have no idea of how much generator you require. So if you are going to go for something smaller, you might want to actually run it before you sell the old larger genset.
Sure a smaller genset (especially an inverter type) will drink less gas, but until you actually see that it can start the fridge a smaller one may not be the proper choice.
Update: I sold the Subaru on craiglist last weekend, bought a used Honda EU3000is yesterday.
Originally Posted By: SOHCman
What did the honda set you back? Found the 3000 model locally for 2 grand, good price?
I got the Honda for $950 with estimated 200hrs on it, in excellent condition.
$2K is good for brand new, there are a few dollars on the table if you shop around and are patient. Try Mayberry's in NJ.
What did the honda set you back? Found the 3000 model locally for 2 grand, good price?
I got the Honda for $950 with estimated 200hrs on it, in excellent condition.
$2K is good for brand new, there are a few dollars on the table if you shop around and are patient. Try Mayberry's in NJ.
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