cobalt mining for lithium batteries…
- Thread starter jstert
- Start date
dnewton3
Staff member
I will generalize here ...
The topic of the electrification of the world in order to save the planet is a mis-placed conversation. As we "clean up" North America, we're actually only dispersing and displacing the pollution to other areas of the world. Topics like the one above (the horrid human and environmental effects of precious metals and rare materials mining), along with the incredible pollution generated in the manufacuring of massive battery systems, goes unaddressed by most "pro green" people. China, as I understand it, generates approximately 30% of the ENTIRE WORLD'S POLLUTION, and really makes no efforts to clean anything up.
The entire topic of solving the world's energy challenges is massively surrounded by people whom live in ignorance, or arrogance; neither of which is helpful to finding a better path.
The topic of the electrification of the world in order to save the planet is a mis-placed conversation. As we "clean up" North America, we're actually only dispersing and displacing the pollution to other areas of the world. Topics like the one above (the horrid human and environmental effects of precious metals and rare materials mining), along with the incredible pollution generated in the manufacuring of massive battery systems, goes unaddressed by most "pro green" people. China, as I understand it, generates approximately 30% of the ENTIRE WORLD'S POLLUTION, and really makes no efforts to clean anything up.
The entire topic of solving the world's energy challenges is massively surrounded by people whom live in ignorance, or arrogance; neither of which is helpful to finding a better path.
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...s-the-price-we-could-pay-for-a-greener-future
In before the lock!
Child labor, toxic leaks: the price we could pay for a greener future
In before the lock!
Yes it's a shell game. The sad thing is that the exploited children don't have better options like playing, or being in school.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Not only that, but the means of exporting these emissions increases transport emissions massively due to the use of huge bunker burning freighters perpetually churning our seas taking our "recyclables" to 3rd world economies (where they often end up in the ocean) and moving sub assemblies and individual components from Asia to various parts of the world only to then be shipped back to the west.
And yes, in 2017, China was close to 30%, it's higher today:
I could care less about CO2 emissions. Keep your hands out of my pocket. There is an excuse to take away money and create more powerful government over the people ever since mankind walked the earth.
People who truly want to curtail CO2 first close your mouths and get to work for a national plan to fast track nuclear power plants, there is no reason right now that we dont have 50 plants under construction, at least one in each state or more in states like CA who have none except for an extended license on one that was to be shut down. Once we have them, then tell me about battery powered cars or h2 or some other fuel. Meantime I can care less.
... and by the way, Mother Earth will always survive, the green promoters are not saving earth, they are looking to save themselves. Earth will adjust by eliminating the number of people who can live on her, she will always be here.
People who truly want to curtail CO2 first close your mouths and get to work for a national plan to fast track nuclear power plants, there is no reason right now that we dont have 50 plants under construction, at least one in each state or more in states like CA who have none except for an extended license on one that was to be shut down. Once we have them, then tell me about battery powered cars or h2 or some other fuel. Meantime I can care less.
... and by the way, Mother Earth will always survive, the green promoters are not saving earth, they are looking to save themselves. Earth will adjust by eliminating the number of people who can live on her, she will always be here.
Last edited:
No truer statement has been made.
4wd
$50 site donor 2026
As I have stated - “fixed” home or industrial batteries are even more insane considering this video only covered one mineral needed
JHZR2
Staff member
“NIMBY”. Just do what the boob tube tells you to do and think.
JHZR2
Staff member
I like these charts.
Im very much a “you don’t ‘deserve’ anything” person, am pretty frugal, and will do what I can. I’ll keep my thermostats low in the winter and high in the summer because it keeps money in my pocket, and is the right thing to do in terms of resource use. I’ll drive slower and more efficient vehicles because it keeps money in my pocket, and reduces gross pollution tonnage (though Imnot fan of CO2 metrics).
What really, really burns me is when I’m expected, no, compelled to cut down intake without holding the actual gross polluters to the same metrics. Even if the per capita numbers differ, the gross tonnage is there. Im not interested in being compelled to do anything by lawyers, economists, and art history majors.
Last edited:
JHZR2
Staff member
Lithium is an issue. You realize other options exist for batteries that don’t require cobalt or nickel?
What will become interesting is recycling at scale. Have you ever taken apart or purposely abused and destroyed a Li-ion battery? I have. Can’t say I’ve seen an easier to recycle thing. Either a mylar balloon or a metal cell, and then wound foils which can be recycled easily.
The challenge is removing the inks on the electrodes, and the electrolytes, which contain intercalated Li and/or Li salts.
4wd
$50 site donor 2026
Until the EPA is in the middle - and back to the (aforementioned) bulk oil burner to ship it to a lower standards country
The other thing to track is price on things such as nickel …
… left to the free market things would level load … but it won’t be …
Last edited:
4wd
$50 site donor 2026
Meanwhile a gold bar -"am I a joke to you?"
There have been actual news reports where news organizations went to the places where cobalt "mining" is being done. I don't like or dislike Joe Rogan, but I'm not going to take any podcast over actual on-site reporting on the issue. There's too much potential for opinion to creep in. I want to see it with my own eyes. Maybe he shows it in the podcast, admittedly, I'm not going to listen to it, because I don't do podcasts at all.
Then there is the fact that LFP batteries are taking over, they're in something like 75% of all Chinese EVs, which is the biggest market for EVs. And CATL, the worlds biggest battery manufacturer, is pushing hard to commercialize Sodium Ion as well. Neither LFP or Sodium require cobalt.
GM is also working on LMR batteries, which also don't require cobalt.
So what does that leave? Phones and tablets? You gonna give up your smartphone? I'll wait.
As for the "mining", since when did people care about poor people in Africa? It became a wedge political issue for people that opposed EVs. Otherwise they wouldn't have given a rip about it. $0.02.
For anyone who was giving money to poor children in Africa, I retract my last statement.
Then there is the fact that LFP batteries are taking over, they're in something like 75% of all Chinese EVs, which is the biggest market for EVs. And CATL, the worlds biggest battery manufacturer, is pushing hard to commercialize Sodium Ion as well. Neither LFP or Sodium require cobalt.
GM is also working on LMR batteries, which also don't require cobalt.
So what does that leave? Phones and tablets? You gonna give up your smartphone? I'll wait.
As for the "mining", since when did people care about poor people in Africa? It became a wedge political issue for people that opposed EVs. Otherwise they wouldn't have given a rip about it. $0.02.
For anyone who was giving money to poor children in Africa, I retract my last statement.
Last edited:
