circuit braker replacement as PM???

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JHZR2

JHZR2

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Hi,

My house has a small amount of old wiring, most of it has been redone. It has a 200A service box in the basement, but some of the brakers look really old.

One strange thing that we occasionally get is that wne we turn on the microwave, it trips the circuit. 99% of the time it wont happen but once in a while it will - it is the only circuit in the house that does this - and we know exactly what other services are on that circuit... it is a fluke kind of thing, or else the microwave is going on its way out...

Anyway, tonight was the first time it has tripped in a long while. I was downstairs right next to the panel when it happened, so I turned on another liht and looked... the braker did not look tripped!

I flipped it to off, and it clicked, then I flipped it to on and it clicked, and all was well again - but this tells me that the braker was in a compromised state.

So, is it good PM to replace ALL brakers at some point in time???

Also, how do you install/pull out a braker? There is a double in my box from an outdoor jacuzzi that the PO had. I tried to pull it out, and though t came off fine on the service in side, it would not come off on the other side. I just couldnt get it with a reasonable amount of force. Am I missing something???

Thanks!

JMH
 
What brand and type are the breakers? How old? Sometimes they go bad - but it's rare. Rather than blame the breaker - look at the cause - what else is on the circuit?
 
The only things that are on the circuit are two single-plug receptacles in the kitchen, one receptacle in the living room, and the switched light on the stairway to the basement.

Everything was off in the LR, only one of the kitchen plugs had anything in it - the one with the microwave, and the basement light was on, as I was down there (23W flouroescent).

So either the microwave (BIG, old kenmore) surges a bit too much at startup sometimes, which may be the case, or the breaker is flaky, or there is something else wrong.

Considering that when it tripped, it didnt trip fully to the off position, this tells me that regardless of what happened to make it trip, there is some 'flakiness' to the breaker. Ill have to see what kind they are. Some are square D, but they are well marked - this one that acts funny is not marked to be easily seen...

Its brother sometimes wiggles loose, and needs to get pressed back on hard, to make connection - telling me that the whole bunch needs some help.

But, then again, is it SOP to change breakers at some point, due to springs getting old, materials getting brittle, etc.?

Id guess that these are ca. 1965.

Thanks!

JMH
 
yeah, breakers do wear out.. changing them is pretty easy (at least for ITE or Square D ones).. you just pull out on the outer edge (the side where the wire comes of), then unhook the inner side, then you unscrew the wire (I do it hot, but you can kill all power if you want). installation is the reverse. takes 10 mins max.
 
Another way that breakers can wear out is to weld themselves closed. It happens when they've been operating near their limit for a long while.

I was drawing 27 amps on 15 amp circuit for a while...
 
Bret's description is about as clear as it gets without pictures. Really pretty simple. There are 3-4 main designs all built by every manufacturer. Best thing is to pull your old one, take it to a electrical specific store (not one of the home improvement giants) and have it matched.

Bob
 
Don't bother replacing all the breakers as PM. I don't think I'd even bother having a spare, since they don't fail with any regularity.

Since this is your first time replacing a circuit breaker, you should definitely cut the power until you figure out how things work. With Square D breakers, I have always unhooked them from the center (input side) first, levering them out with a flat-blade screwdriver. Then they will usually come straight out. (The square D breakers have a single, friction clamp on the outside) The other type of breaker I've seen is very similar, but has different connectors. (I can't remember how that type connects on the outside -- it might hook on a lip. )
 
Zinsco breakers of that vintage are also known for tripping after your wires are on fire. I replaced my entire load center as PM. one contributing factor to that was the breakers are hard to find and cost $50-100 each. a new breaker for my murray is $5.

I'd replace it, they are not very expensive and it will gove you peace of mind.
 
My breakers don't flip fully to off and they are brand new. They flip a couple millimeters at best. You then flip full off then back on to reset. This is normal for mine. I do a lot of my own wiring (simple circuits) and I wouldn't do it live. I would flip the whole house off then pop in a new breaker. Takes 5 minutes and keeps you alive. I would bet the main bus in the box has enough amps to send you to an early grave so I wouldn't attempt it live. Especially if you aren't experienced at it.
 
The main bus in the box has enough amps to do really exciting things if it's shorted out...

...any source of 120V anywhere in a house has enough amps to send you to an early grave.
 
Quote:

Was the microwave on when it last happened?

Click to expand...


it was just starting when it happened... it was in its 'startup surge'... I know microwaves surge a bit, because when my parents got a big one put in, but hadnt put in their dedicated circuit, it would make the overhead lights dip!

JMH
 
Occasionally I have to add an outlet for a theater for a basement buildout. I can't count all the panels I've been in that has line after line piled onto one breaker when there was plenty of room on the buss-bar to add a new one. I clean those situations up when I find them, but a common trouble with them (especially with the piggy-backs) is that the load is right on the edge, but not quite AT the trip-point. The breaker stays hot and gets brittle inside after a period and fails. Aluminum wiring that works a little loose under the screws offers up more resistence than when new, and THAT keeps the breaker hot. They're cheap to buy (take the old one with you), but know what you're doing inside a hot panel. Probably hurts a LOT to get lit up..

You wind up looking like this I bet--->
crazy.gif
 
Is the breaker a 15amp? I think it is common now to use 20amp in the kitchen outlets. I'd swap out the current breaker with a new one. If you still get tripping, it may be worth running a new wire to that outlet so you can put it on a dedicated 20amp breaker.
 
Not advisable unless you go to a 12/2 wire. Never take a 15A circuit to a 20A breaker without you install the larger gauge wiring. Those breakers are there to keep the wire from becoming a toaster element inside the wall.
368581.gif
 
I never said to connect the existing wire to a 20amp breaker silly.

I clearly said to run a new wire, where "new" = 20amps approved.
 
Quote:

Is the breaker a 15amp? I think it is common now to use 20amp in the kitchen outlets. I'd swap out the current breaker with a new one.

Click to expand...


I noticed the second part, but the first part of your post was the most visible, hence, the caution to other readers and the O.P.

You silly.
 
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