Champ PH500XL Nitrile ADBV

[Bellavita]

The tough guards are sealed here. But Walmart will take them back.

Hi SC Maintenance,
The Ultra Synthetics are sealed at my store. Are you sure the Tough Guards are? I'm going to confess that when I want to inspect an Ultra, I'll cut the seal very neatly with my fingernail to open the box. But most of the time someone else has already done that!

 

[Scott S]

What I understand the Tough guard have gone down hill as well..

 

[ZeeOSix]

What I understand the Tough guard have gone down hill as well..

In what way? Haven't seen anything that's changed with them posted here.

 

[Scott S]

I don't remember maybe it was Fram in general I don't personally remember what was said.. I remember the thread the other day, about Wix XP, and the screen missing, on a couple of the filters..

 

[SC Maintenance]

Fram and Champ are both First Brand products. Both are being cheapened in real time.

The Fram orange can no longer has the Silicone valve either, and has gone to an e-core. @Bellavita posted it a while back, and I have confirmed in my store as well. It looks a whole lot like a Luber Finer painted orange - someone needs to cut one of the new ones open.

I have never liked the Tough guard for whatever reason - but if you do I suggest stocking up. First Brands is cheapening everything systematically.

 

[Bellavita]

What I understand the Tough guard have gone down hill as well..

Hi Scott S.
I've not seen any changes in the Tough Guard to date. It carries the same performance ratings, silicone anti drainback and louvered metal center core. I would like to see it go to the nylon core.

 

[jeepman3071]

I think you are over reacting. When the filter is changed at the proper interval, I never had a problem with a nitrile ADBV. Years ago, all you saw was nitrile and engines were surviving just fine.

I think there is a bit of a difference though since this is a filter marketed as "synthetic" which most would think of using it for a longer change interval. It is in a higher tier of filter over the basic Champ "jobber" filter. These previously had a Silicone ADBV, and now have a nitrile, yet I'm sure the price will stay the same or increase, hence the "shrinkflation" comments. When I purchased a bunch of these for my family's Hondas, they are marketed as having silicone, yet the ones I received had nitrile.

Would they work fine? Probably. Is it false advertising? Absolutely.

 

[Bellavita]

Fram and Champ are both First Brand products. Both are being cheapened in real time.

The Fram orange can no longer has the Silicone valve either, and has gone to an e-core. @Bellavita posted it a while back, and I have confirmed in my store as well. It looks a whole lot like a Luber Finer painted orange - someone needs to cut one of the new ones open.

I have never liked the Tough guard for whatever reason - but if you do I suggest stocking up. First Brands is cheapening everything systematically.

Good Morning SC Maintenance,
I think its more standardization than cheapening that is going on. One benefit of the consolidations is they can see redundancies in the brands. Most are what I call fake brands because they have nothing as a differentiator in the product. My hope is there is a reduction in the number of brands and greater standardization of features that better align with the price points and the performance requirements of the product. This will reduce the variety the plants need to produce and package thereby making their processes more reliable. Also, in some way, make it a requirement that the efficiency, micron level and life be stated accurately on the point of sale packaging.

 

[SC Maintenance]

Good Morning SC Maintenance,
I think its more standardization than cheapening that is going on. One benefit of the consolidations is they can see redundancies in the brands. Most are what I call fake brands because they have nothing as a differentiator in the product. My hope is there is a reduction in the number of brands and greater standardization of features that better align with the price points and the performance requirements of the product. This will reduce the variety the plants need to produce and package thereby making their processes more reliable. Also, in some way, make it a requirement that the efficiency, micron level and life be stated accurately on the point of sale packaging.

Your preaching to the choir - I have spent almost 30 years automating factories.

The problem is there actually creating more fake brands. If a Supertech MP becomes the same as a FRAM EG - nitrile valve, e-core - then its just one more fake brand.

Also, traditionally volume should drive price down - but it shows no sign of retail prices dropping.

Also, how much more is a silicone ADBV? Both Supertech MP and Fram EG used to have the Silicone valve, but it looks like there both going away. So they were standardized, but now they will be standardized cheaper.

Anyway, they have lost my business unless I find some NOS Supertech MP's with the Silicone valve. If I want a high quality filter with a Nitrile valve I will just order a Denso.

 

[jeepman3071]

Your preaching to the choir - I have spent almost 30 years automating factories.

The problem is there actually creating more fake brands. If a Supertech MP becomes the same as a FRAM EG - nitrile valve, e-core - then its just one more fake brand.

Also, traditionally volume should drive price down - but it shows no sign of retail prices dropping.

Also, how much more is a silicone ADBV? Both Supertech MP and Fram EG used to have the Silicone valve, but it looks like there both going away. So they were standardized, but now they will be standardized cheaper.

Anyway, they have lost my business unless I find some NOS Supertech MP's with the Silicone valve. If I want a high quality filter with a Nitrile valve I will just order a Denso.

Exactly.

The bait and switch is what bothers me most. If I wanted a cheaper filter, I would've just bought a Champ jobber filter for $2 and been done with it, not paid more for the XL and get a nitrile ADBV.

I know my situation isn't like most, but with a short commute my filter change interval is probably different than many people. My Jeep 4.0L is picky about ADBVs, and since I only drive it 3000-5000 miles/year I change the oil and filter yearly. A $15 filter won't kill me, but it just stinks that the filters that the middle ground "great value" filters are going away, and you either get to pick a $2 jobber filter or an overpriced $15 filter, both with inconsistent quality control.

 

[Bellavita]

Exactly.

The bait and switch is what bothers me most. If I wanted a cheaper filter, I would've just bought a Champ jobber filter for $2 and been done with it, not paid more for the XL and get a nitrile ADBV.

I know my situation isn't like most, but with a short commute my filter change interval is probably different than many people. My Jeep 4.0L is picky about ADBVs, and since I only drive it 3000-5000 miles/year I change the oil and filter yearly. A $15 filter won't kill me, but it just stinks that the filters that the middle ground "great value" filters are going away, and you either get to pick a $2 jobber filter or an overpriced $15 filter, both with inconsistent quality control.

Hi Jeepman3071,
I agree with you not wanting to buy a $15 filter for a 5K OCI. The Fram Tough Guard at $7.17 and the the Ultra at $8.97 are mid range price points with very good performance specs and silicone ADBVs. With your 3-5K OCI these filters could also work for 2 oil changes.

 

[Bellavita]

Your preaching to the choir - I have spent almost 30 years automating factories.

The problem is there actually creating more fake brands. If a Supertech MP becomes the same as a FRAM EG - nitrile valve, e-core - then its just one more fake brand.

Also, traditionally volume should drive price down - but it shows no sign of retail prices dropping.

Also, how much more is a silicone ADBV? Both Supertech MP and Fram EG used to have the Silicone valve, but it looks like there both going away. So they were standardized, but now they will be standardized cheaper.

Anyway, they have lost my business unless I find some NOS Supertech MP's with the Silicone valve. If I want a high quality filter with a Nitrile valve I will just order a Denso.

Hi SC Maintenance,
My apologies that my opinion came across as preaching. Totally not intended.

 

[Scott S]

Champ won't even do anything about it.. RockAuto, still charges me for return shipping and you can't get a hold of a life first thing!!!

 

[SC Maintenance]

Hi SC Maintenance,
My apologies that my opinion came across as preaching. Totally not intended.

“Preaching to the choir” is a euphemism for “I agree with you completely”. No need to apologize.

 

[4WD]

“Preaching to the choir” is a euphemism for “I agree with you completely”. No need to apologize.

They never hear me bcs they sing too loud

 

[4WD]

Champ won't even do anything about it.. RockAuto, still charges me for return shipping and you can't get a hold of a life first thing!!!

How long would you run that filter ?

 

[KCJeep]

Exactly.

The bait and switch is what bothers me most. If I wanted a cheaper filter, I would've just bought a Champ jobber filter for $2 and been done with it, not paid more for the XL and get a nitrile ADBV.

I know my situation isn't like most, but with a short commute my filter change interval is probably different than many people. My Jeep 4.0L is picky about ADBVs, and since I only drive it 3000-5000 miles/year I change the oil and filter yearly. A $15 filter won't kill me, but it just stinks that the filters that the middle ground "great value" filters are going away, and you either get to pick a $2 jobber filter or an overpriced $15 filter, both with inconsistent quality control.

The Tough Guards always worked well on my Jeep and are still middle ground. First Brands hasn't ruined that one, yet anyway.

 

[jeepman3071]

The Tough Guards always worked well on my Jeep and are still middle ground. First Brands hasn't ruined that one, yet anyway.

Yep, I bought a box of them for the Jeep 4.0s I service (3 of them) so should hold me over for a while. All of them have silicone ADBV, and metal center tube with holes. I feel a little weird about buying a box of filters (like a hoarder) but it will take the guessing out of servicing at least a few vehicles I care for.

 

[Scott S]

How long would you run that filter ?

Probably 4 to 5,000 miles, which I know it will be fine for. But from the factory it comes with a silicone ADBV so that tells me Ford requires it. It was about 2009 when they started using silicone anti drain back valve on the vehicles.. I was managing a franchise of quick lubes at that time..

 

[Scott S]

My plan was, to change my oil before I went in for surgery on Tuesday, I'm going in for lumbar fusion and decompression surgery. But since these filters came in, I didn't bother. I'm going to be laid up, with no bending, lifting twisting for 3 months so what I have in there now will just stay in there, it's Mobil 1 Advanced 5W20 with a Pure one filter, with about 3,000 miles on it, I changed it 6 months ago.