Can a bad vacuum brake booster cause a soft pedal?

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Aug 3, 2024
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I've been battling a soft brake pedal concern on my 2014 Nissan Frontier for years now. I know these trucks are notorious for this issue even from new, something I noticed when I first drove it at the dealership. I don't drive it often as it's my wife's daily, but when I do I swear the pedal travel is getting worse. I've tried everything...new master cylinder (twice), braided steel hoses, a replacement ABS unit, and gallons of fluid bled through the system using everything from a Motive power bleeder to speed bleeders. I used every ABS technique in the book, including actuating the pump and solenoids with a scanner and locking up the brakes in gravel before bleeding. All my efforts have been well-documented on this very forum but no real improvement has been noted.

All that leaves is the vacuum booster, which I know is grasping at straws as a failing booster typically causes the opposite problem but I have also read that in rare cases a vacuum leak can cause excessive pedal travel. What makes me think this is a possibility is that with the engine off and booster bled down, the pedal is hard as a rock, but as soon as I start the engine down the pedal goes. I know a soft pedal is almost always air in the system or a bad master cylinder, but this was going on before anything was done to allow air in the system so I have to think out of the box here.

Am I possibly on the right track here? It makes little sense but I've tried everything else and can't imagine what more I can do. As always any input is appreciated.
 
I have seen that action (the pedal going down upon starting) in older cars. When that happened, the "new" pedal height was just fine, and though not rock solid, did not impact braking in any way.

Maybe you should just accept it as normal for that vehicle and move on.
From what you report, I think you've cover ALL the possible failure points and believe that your brakes are good.
 
I've been battling a soft brake pedal concern on my 2014 Nissan Frontier for years now. I know these trucks are notorious for this issue even from new, something I noticed when I first drove it at the dealership. I don't drive it often as it's my wife's daily, but when I do I swear the pedal travel is getting worse. I've tried everything...new master cylinder (twice), braided steel hoses, a replacement ABS unit, and gallons of fluid bled through the system using everything from a Motive power bleeder to speed bleeders. I used every ABS technique in the book, including actuating the pump and solenoids with a scanner and locking up the brakes in gravel before bleeding. All my efforts have been well-documented on this very forum but no real improvement has been noted.

All that leaves is the vacuum booster, which I know is grasping at straws as a failing booster typically causes the opposite problem but I have also read that in rare cases a vacuum leak can cause excessive pedal travel. What makes me think this is a possibility is that with the engine off and booster bled down, the pedal is hard as a rock, but as soon as I start the engine down the pedal goes. I know a soft pedal is almost always air in the system or a bad master cylinder, but this was going on before anything was done to allow air in the system so I have to think out of the box here.

Am I possibly on the right track here? It makes little sense but I've tried everything else and can't imagine what more I can do. As always any input is appreciated.

Brake boosters are actually complex little devices. More so than many realize.

To answer your question....YES...without question. I know this because for over a year I had a soft braking issue where my brakes were sub par and I also tried EVERYTHING...including TWO brake booster replacements. I can't count the gallons of brake fluid I bled through the system over those months and how many calipers and metal and rubber brake hoses I replaced.

Your systems sound like those I had. I had difficulty believing it could be the brake booster. Mind you, with this vehicle that I have owned for over 20 years, I knew the brakes could be much better.

Being one to never relent or give up.....after months more work chasing the dogs tail and double replacing anything I could not positively confirm, I reluctantly replaced the brake booster yet again. FINALLY I got the brakes back I was missing. The booster is the heart of the system and as important as the MCyl IMO.

Just be aware that a failed/failing check valve or mis adjusted actuating rod or an undetected vacuum leak can also cause similar issues.
 
I've been battling a soft brake pedal concern on my 2014 Nissan Frontier for years now. I know these trucks are notorious for this issue even from new, something I noticed when I first drove it at the dealership. I don't drive it often as it's my wife's daily, but when I do I swear the pedal travel is getting worse. I've tried everything...new master cylinder (twice), braided steel hoses, a replacement ABS unit, and gallons of fluid bled through the system using everything from a Motive power bleeder to speed bleeders. I used every ABS technique in the book, including actuating the pump and solenoids with a scanner and locking up the brakes in gravel before bleeding. All my efforts have been well-documented on this very forum but no real improvement has been noted.

All that leaves is the vacuum booster, which I know is grasping at straws as a failing booster typically causes the opposite problem but I have also read that in rare cases a vacuum leak can cause excessive pedal travel. What makes me think this is a possibility is that with the engine off and booster bled down, the pedal is hard as a rock, but as soon as I start the engine down the pedal goes. I know a soft pedal is almost always air in the system or a bad master cylinder, but this was going on before anything was done to allow air in the system so I have to think out of the box here.

Am I possibly on the right track here? It makes little sense but I've tried everything else and can't imagine what more I can do. As always any input is appreciated.
YES....
 
I don’t think I’ve owned one, but I’ve read that some boosters are 2-stage devices. If the valving gets off it can mess with pedal feel.
 
You can check the booster and its check valve. After the engine has been shut down for around five minutes, pump the brake pedal. If you get 3-5 power assisted pumps before the pedal gets hard, the booster is functioning properly. A bad booster generally will cause a hard pedal.
 
You can check the booster and its check valve. After the engine has been shut down for around five minutes, pump the brake pedal. If you get 3-5 power assisted pumps before the pedal gets hard, the booster is functioning properly. A bad booster generally will cause a hard pedal.
I did notice that the booster would lose vacuum overnight, the pedal would be hard for the first drive in the morning before starting the engine. I replaced the check valve but that didn't help, so I assumed the booster had a slow leak. At no point, however, did I think this had anything to do with the soft pedal issue.
 
Already replaced it...twice.

Yep, so did I..with no improvement.
The only thing I hate more than doing a messy difficult job I don't really wanna do......

Is doing a messy difficult job and getting nothing in improvements for my efforts :mad:
 
I did notice that the booster would lose vacuum overnight, the pedal would be hard for the first drive in the morning before starting the engine. I replaced the check valve but that didn't help, so I assumed the booster had a slow leak. At no point, however, did I think this had anything to do with the soft pedal issue.

My pedal was mushy...like no matter how hard I pressed it just didn't do much.
When the engine wasn't running it was hard as a rock and at the top...IIRC
 
I had that issue on a first gen frontier and an older Toyota pickup truck. The problem was solved by replacing the rear brake proportioning valve.
I think those are gone on the later models, the ABS replaced it.
 
Pulled the trigger and got a replacement booster and gaskets, I'm going to combine that with a front wheel brake job next week.

Wish me luck!
 
Well, the saga continues...

I replaced the booster, which meant disconnecting the brake lines from the master cylinder thus requiring yet another bleeding of the system, something I've not had the best success with thus far. This time was no exception, I pumped yet another quart of fluid through the lines, but the pedal was softer than Dairy Queen ice cream. I went to a nearby gravel parking lot and locked up the brakes many times to activate the ABS and did more bleeding...still worse than before. So I did something I dread doing...I took it to a shop.

I live in a fairly large city with a lot of car repair options, everything from dealerships to chain shops to local garages, but because I never need one I had no idea where to go. I asked some friends for advice and did some online research to finally narrow it down to one place. They've been around for a long time and have a good reputation, so I bit the bullet and left my little truck in their hands. The service rep was knowledgeable enough and inspired confidence, so I left feeling pretty good. I did tell them that I did all my own work (a mistake I learned after the fact) and even printed out a sheet of everything I've done so far with the brakes, including the recent new booster. Well after a couple of days I get a call saying that the booster's internal pushrod was improperly adjusted, which was nonsense because I used my depth micrometer to set the pushrod to within a tenth a millimeter of the stock measurement. Then they said the seal between the master cylinder and booster was missing, also BS because I remember having to hold it in place with my fingertips as I reinstalled the master cylinder. I was told they couldn't use the existing booster because of the "misadjustment" for warranty reasons, so it would have to be replaced and the system re-bled...at the tune of about $1000.

I was not happy but wasn't in the mood to argue, so I said whatever just fix my ****ed truck. The only reason I took it there in the first place was because I didn't have the bidirectional diagnostic scanner needed for a proper ABS bleed. So after hearing nothing for two days I called them for an update, only to be told they were having problems getting the system to bleed properly. Part of me felt validated for knowing even the so-called "pros" couldn't get it to work right, but that was tempered by the fact that my truck still wasn't fixed. The next day I get a text saying my truck was ready to be picked up. Hallelujah, it was about time. Much to my pleasant surprise the pedal felt pretty solid so I was happy about that, but was still miffed about the earlier accusations. I plied the service rep for more information about the alleged missing seal behind the master cylinder, he claimed that now two mechanics told him it was missing. I brought up the fact that if that were the case then it wouldn't hold a vacuum for very long after the engine was turned off, to which he agreed. I then reminded him that he felt the brakes himself, engine off, when I first brought the truck in and it still held a vacuum even after sitting for some time. He just stared blankly. I also noticed the new booster wasn't OEM, something I expected considering the price markup, and gave the guy some grief telling them I don't ever install bottom-shelf aftermarket garbage on my truck. Another blank stare, I just shook my head and drove away. I didn't care as my truck was finally braking properly, or so I thought...

After only a couple days of driving, my wife and I were running errands when I thought there was a problem with the transmission as it wasn't upshifting properly. I soon noticed the brake pedal was much harder than usual, and I truck wouldn't leave from a stop without applying extra power. Obviously the transmission was fine, the brakes were dragging. Fortunately we were almost home, and all four discs were smoking hot when I finally parked. I wasn't happy to say the least, and called the shop immediately to let them know. They sent a tow truck the next morning after getting an earful, I guess the guy finally realized I wasn't the average shadetree as he was exceedingly accommodating. Regardless, I heard nothing back for three days, once again they were having problems and had to call in some sort of specialist. Finally after another day it was ready, once again I went to pick it up and gave everything a once-over before leaving (a career in aviation quality assurance makes this a requirement). Right away I noticed the clip that secures the pin that attaches the booster pushrod to the brake pedal arm wasn't installed, meaning that pin would have fallen out over time making the brake pedal useless. That made me blow my top, getting rather vocal about how my wife drives this truck. The service rep was panicking and called for the guy who did the work right way. To his credit he seemed remorseful and would take care of it immediately, but I had already found the clip on the floor mat and told everyone to get the h*ll away from my truck. I put the clip in myself and tore out of there with no lack of drama.

The only good part was that the brakes finally felt proper again and much to my surprise they installed a genuine Nissan brake booster. I took a little solace in the fact they the learned the "buy once - cry once" lesson of cheap aftermarket parts the hard way, and they went way over book time and likely lost money overall. Serves them right for assuming I didn't know what I was doing even after I told the guy about my background. Needless to say if I ever need to use a shop again it won't be them.

Wow, I had no idea this was going to be so long, I guess I needed to vent my frustration on you fine folks. Sorry about that, and thank you to those who managed to stick around to the end. Hopefully this will be the end of my brake issues once and for all.
 
Well, the saga continues...

I replaced the booster, which meant disconnecting the brake lines from the master cylinder thus requiring yet another bleeding of the system, something I've not had the best success with thus far. This time was no exception, I pumped yet another quart of fluid through the lines, but the pedal was softer than Dairy Queen ice cream. I went to a nearby gravel parking lot and locked up the brakes many times to activate the ABS and did more bleeding...still worse than before. So I did something I dread doing...I took it to a shop.

I live in a fairly large city with a lot of car repair options, everything from dealerships to chain shops to local garages, but because I never need one I had no idea where to go. I asked some friends for advice and did some online research to finally narrow it down to one place. They've been around for a long time and have a good reputation, so I bit the bullet and left my little truck in their hands. The service rep was knowledgeable enough and inspired confidence, so I left feeling pretty good. I did tell them that I did all my own work (a mistake I learned after the fact) and even printed out a sheet of everything I've done so far with the brakes, including the recent new booster. Well after a couple of days I get a call saying that the booster's internal pushrod was improperly adjusted, which was nonsense because I used my depth micrometer to set the pushrod to within a tenth a millimeter of the stock measurement. Then they said the seal between the master cylinder and booster was missing, also BS because I remember having to hold it in place with my fingertips as I reinstalled the master cylinder. I was told they couldn't use the existing booster because of the "misadjustment" for warranty reasons, so it would have to be replaced and the system re-bled...at the tune of about $1000.

I was not happy but wasn't in the mood to argue, so I said whatever just fix my ****ed truck. The only reason I took it there in the first place was because I didn't have the bidirectional diagnostic scanner needed for a proper ABS bleed. So after hearing nothing for two days I called them for an update, only to be told they were having problems getting the system to bleed properly. Part of me felt validated for knowing even the so-called "pros" couldn't get it to work right, but that was tempered by the fact that my truck still wasn't fixed. The next day I get a text saying my truck was ready to be picked up. Hallelujah, it was about time. Much to my pleasant surprise the pedal felt pretty solid so I was happy about that, but was still miffed about the earlier accusations. I plied the service rep for more information about the alleged missing seal behind the master cylinder, he claimed that now two mechanics told him it was missing. I brought up the fact that if that were the case then it wouldn't hold a vacuum for very long after the engine was turned off, to which he agreed. I then reminded him that he felt the brakes himself, engine off, when I first brought the truck in and it still held a vacuum even after sitting for some time. He just stared blankly. I also noticed the new booster wasn't OEM, something I expected considering the price markup, and gave the guy some grief telling them I don't ever install bottom-shelf aftermarket garbage on my truck. Another blank stare, I just shook my head and drove away. I didn't care as my truck was finally braking properly, or so I thought...

After only a couple days of driving, my wife and I were running errands when I thought there was a problem with the transmission as it wasn't upshifting properly. I soon noticed the brake pedal was much harder than usual, and I truck wouldn't leave from a stop without applying extra power. Obviously the transmission was fine, the brakes were dragging. Fortunately we were almost home, and all four discs were smoking hot when I finally parked. I wasn't happy to say the least, and called the shop immediately to let them know. They sent a tow truck the next morning after getting an earful, I guess the guy finally realized I wasn't the average shadetree as he was exceedingly accommodating. Regardless, I heard nothing back for three days, once again they were having problems and had to call in some sort of specialist. Finally after another day it was ready, once again I went to pick it up and gave everything a once-over before leaving (a career in aviation quality assurance makes this a requirement). Right away I noticed the clip that secures the pin that attaches the booster pushrod to the brake pedal arm wasn't installed, meaning that pin would have fallen out over time making the brake pedal useless. That made me blow my top, getting rather vocal about how my wife drives this truck. The service rep was panicking and called for the guy who did the work right way. To his credit he seemed remorseful and would take care of it immediately, but I had already found the clip on the floor mat and told everyone to get the h*ll away from my truck. I put the clip in myself and tore out of there with no lack of drama.

The only good part was that the brakes finally felt proper again and much to my surprise they installed a genuine Nissan brake booster. I took a little solace in the fact they the learned the "buy once - cry once" lesson of cheap aftermarket parts the hard way, and they went way over book time and likely lost money overall. Serves them right for assuming I didn't know what I was doing even after I told the guy about my background. Needless to say if I ever need to use a shop again it won't be them.

Wow, I had no idea this was going to be so long, I guess I needed to vent my frustration on you fine folks. Sorry about that, and thank you to those who managed to stick around to the end. Hopefully this will be the end of my brake issues once and for all.
Thanks for that long, detailed post. It's insane the level of stupidity out there lately with anything. And those glowing "Reviews" online I'm beginning to think they're all paid for! There are marketing companies that businesses can hire to write great reviews just to "stock the pond" and get the total averages up. I'm glad you got it fixed. It's dang (not sure if the real word is censored) scary to think how that shop would mess up someone's vehicle who didn't know as much as you or most of us around here know! They'd be in a lot of danger! Again, glad you got it fixed.
 
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