Block heaters and engine wear
- Thread starter dgeesaman
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The '04 had high idle installed from the factory (or possibly an ECM reflash?)-after a cold start, it'll raise the idle to around 1200-1300 RPM by itself. The 6.0's biggest problem is it makes very little low end power until the turbo boost comes up, & the HEUI oil-driven IP is very finicky when it's cold due to oil viscosity, an injection pressure control that is failure prone, & EXTREMELY difficult to service if the body (Econoline) or cab (F-series) is not removed from the frame!! This is the '04 getting the head gaskets & a host of other stuff replaced @ only 53K miles-the dealer said if it hadn't been a warraty repair, it would have been over $8000! http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k129/meb727/DSC00172.jpg
The 6.0 will automatically increase idle after starting in colder temperatures. The ECU bumps the idle to about 1,000RPM for a short time.
This is NOT the same as engaging the Battery Charge Protect Circuit or PTO circuit. No 6.0 came from the factory with these circuits enabled. You have to hook up the wires underneath the steering column to auxiliary switches. The truck will then up idle to 1,200RPM or higher in Park with the parking brake engaged as long as the switch is on.
This is NOT the same as engaging the Battery Charge Protect Circuit or PTO circuit. No 6.0 came from the factory with these circuits enabled. You have to hook up the wires underneath the steering column to auxiliary switches. The truck will then up idle to 1,200RPM or higher in Park with the parking brake engaged as long as the switch is on.
Originally Posted By: D-Roc
Originally Posted By: Saab9-3
If you put the oil pan heater on a timer you will not have afire.
Why would this make a difference? So, if you didn't have your pan heater on a timer, you would have a fire?
Please explain
What I meant to say is that it is far less likely to have a fire if you put your pan heater on a timer. If the pan heater is on for 10 hours straight, then I can see the possibility of a fire starting. Personally I put mine on for 2 hours prior to wanting to start the car, and the oil feels pleasantly warm off the dip stick (I figure about 20-40C).
Originally Posted By: Saab9-3
If you put the oil pan heater on a timer you will not have afire.
Why would this make a difference? So, if you didn't have your pan heater on a timer, you would have a fire?
Please explain
What I meant to say is that it is far less likely to have a fire if you put your pan heater on a timer. If the pan heater is on for 10 hours straight, then I can see the possibility of a fire starting. Personally I put mine on for 2 hours prior to wanting to start the car, and the oil feels pleasantly warm off the dip stick (I figure about 20-40C).
Originally Posted By: Saab9-3
Originally Posted By: D-Roc
Originally Posted By: Saab9-3
If you put the oil pan heater on a timer you will not have afire.
Why would this make a difference? So, if you didn't have your pan heater on a timer, you would have a fire?
Please explain
What I meant to say is that it is far less likely to have a fire if you put your pan heater on a timer. If the pan heater is on for 10 hours straight, then I can see the possibility of a fire starting. Personally I put mine on for 2 hours prior to wanting to start the car, and the oil feels pleasantly warm off the dip stick (I figure about 20-40C).
I see what you're saying, but block heaters and pan heaters don't keep getting hotter and hotter...they will only heat the oil/coolant up so much. Your oil will not boil either. I've had my pan heater (model 40) on my Dodge Cummins overnight before and it gets pleasently warm...but not hot.
I'm just not following you on how, even if you left a pan heater and/or block heater on full time, you would be any more prone to a fire?
Originally Posted By: D-Roc
Originally Posted By: Saab9-3
If you put the oil pan heater on a timer you will not have afire.
Why would this make a difference? So, if you didn't have your pan heater on a timer, you would have a fire?
Please explain
What I meant to say is that it is far less likely to have a fire if you put your pan heater on a timer. If the pan heater is on for 10 hours straight, then I can see the possibility of a fire starting. Personally I put mine on for 2 hours prior to wanting to start the car, and the oil feels pleasantly warm off the dip stick (I figure about 20-40C).
I see what you're saying, but block heaters and pan heaters don't keep getting hotter and hotter...they will only heat the oil/coolant up so much. Your oil will not boil either. I've had my pan heater (model 40) on my Dodge Cummins overnight before and it gets pleasently warm...but not hot.
I'm just not following you on how, even if you left a pan heater and/or block heater on full time, you would be any more prone to a fire?
The Wolverine oil pan heaters are supposed to be plugged in overnight for best results when temps are below freezing.
According to their website they advertise from -40 to +40 in 2 hours. I don't need more than that
I know that pan heaters do not get hotter and hotter. And I am not saying that if you have a pan heater plugged in all night it is going to catch fire. What I am saying that you are more likely to have a fire if it is plug in for extended amount of time, but pretty rare.
I had called and asked them, I posted what they told me. It could also have been the way I asked the question though. I asked a question about leaving a car sit for a few days in sub-zero cold. They told me leave it plugged in overnight for best results. I was concerned with warm oil getting cooled off hitting cold parts of the engine. They told me that plugging it in the night before I planned on using the car was the best bet. I think it has something to do with the warm oil radiating heat to colder parts of the engine heating them up longer.
I'm just passing info. They are happy to answer questions.
I'm just passing info. They are happy to answer questions.
Engine wear is least when all the parts at at the dimensions set by normal operating temperatures. When the parts are at other temperatures the dimensions are different and you'll get more wear. Will this wear the engine out?...it'll take a very, very long time. As said above, the sooner the engine gets warm the sooner the emissions decrease and fuel mileage gets as good as it'll get
By the way, the 6.0 is not an aluminum engine (only the GM/Isuzu Duramax has aluminum heads and all have iron blocks), and the 6.0 is one of the worst engines International has made. I wouldn't buy one. Get a 7.3 or 6.8 or D-max or Cummins.
By the way, the 6.0 is not an aluminum engine (only the GM/Isuzu Duramax has aluminum heads and all have iron blocks), and the 6.0 is one of the worst engines International has made. I wouldn't buy one. Get a 7.3 or 6.8 or D-max or Cummins.
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Originally Posted By: Ken2
By the way, the 6.0 is not an aluminum engine (only the GM/Isuzu Duramax has aluminum heads and all have iron blocks), and the 6.0 is one of the worst engines International has made. I wouldn't buy one. Get a 7.3 or 6.8 or D-max or Cummins.
I take it you're referring to the reliability issues (EGR coolers, EGR clogging, head gasket failures)? While those are not minor issues, they are the only major ones.
After shopping around a bit, I'm leaning back toward the big block gas engine trucks. There is even less demand for them than diesels (cheaper when new and more room to make a deal), easier maintenance, easier on the drivetrain, quieter. We don't do lots of mountains and miles so the fuel economy and lower torque will be easy to deal with. And last but certainly not least, I don't want to listen to my wife complaining about it not starting or having to plug in the block heater.
We've decided to put off the purchase a little longer, in any case. I'll be one of those brats who are actually rooting for a brief uptick in fuel prices when I'm ready to buy.
Dave
By the way, the 6.0 is not an aluminum engine (only the GM/Isuzu Duramax has aluminum heads and all have iron blocks), and the 6.0 is one of the worst engines International has made. I wouldn't buy one. Get a 7.3 or 6.8 or D-max or Cummins.
I take it you're referring to the reliability issues (EGR coolers, EGR clogging, head gasket failures)? While those are not minor issues, they are the only major ones.
After shopping around a bit, I'm leaning back toward the big block gas engine trucks. There is even less demand for them than diesels (cheaper when new and more room to make a deal), easier maintenance, easier on the drivetrain, quieter. We don't do lots of mountains and miles so the fuel economy and lower torque will be easy to deal with. And last but certainly not least, I don't want to listen to my wife complaining about it not starting or having to plug in the block heater.
We've decided to put off the purchase a little longer, in any case. I'll be one of those brats who are actually rooting for a brief uptick in fuel prices when I'm ready to buy.
Dave
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EGR cooler just started leaking on my buddy Jon's 6.0L. He's just going to do the delete.
Sometimes i wonder if any of you has started a big diesel in -20
celsius without heat?? In the military we used to force our Scania fueltrucks to start in the winter and when they started there was no doubt what so ever if they were hurting or not. Hows about just holding the pedal to metal for 30 seconds just to keep it running stone cold- like bang,klang,bang....and a large cluod of smoke. Fuel wash on cylinder walls and lots of oil dilution.
All coldstarts hurt and the colder ones the most.
A block heater is in my world more efficent than the pan one-
i dont think it would help to push warm oil throu a cold engine block and say it would be better to do the opposite as long as the oil is pumpable. A pan heater will ofcourse be better than anything. On a block heated engine they end up in the 20-50 celsius range after 2 hours and the oil will not be this warm but definately not outside temperature and will quickly absorb heat stored in the block when circulating.
celsius without heat?? In the military we used to force our Scania fueltrucks to start in the winter and when they started there was no doubt what so ever if they were hurting or not. Hows about just holding the pedal to metal for 30 seconds just to keep it running stone cold- like bang,klang,bang....and a large cluod of smoke. Fuel wash on cylinder walls and lots of oil dilution.
All coldstarts hurt and the colder ones the most.
A block heater is in my world more efficent than the pan one-
i dont think it would help to push warm oil throu a cold engine block and say it would be better to do the opposite as long as the oil is pumpable. A pan heater will ofcourse be better than anything. On a block heated engine they end up in the 20-50 celsius range after 2 hours and the oil will not be this warm but definately not outside temperature and will quickly absorb heat stored in the block when circulating.
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