Blackstone tests some engine flushes

[OVERKILL]

Detergents second role is to neutralize acids …

Yup, they are basic compounds and the source of TBN.

 

[Pablo]

It happens. People see the word "detergent" and tend to think that it's like a Mr. Clean magic eraser in your engine.

I put a couple of those in the food processor and poured them in the engine. Should I get a UOA? Flush?


Kidding. JIC.

 

[4WD]

Yup, they are basic compounds and the source of TBN.

We just think there’s TBN in PVL - look at this

https://pdfgenerator-west.exxonmobi...S/Marine/pdsdownload/GL-XX-Mobilgard-5100?p=1

 

[OVERKILL]

We just think there’s TBN in PVL - look at this

https://pdfgenerator-west.exxonmobi...S/Marine/pdsdownload/GL-XX-Mobilgard-5100?p=1

Now that's some serious TBN!!

 

[Slow Car Sport Mode]

I've used it a number of times but have way to validate it - seems legit to me!

So, can we say that you are "vouching" for the LiquiMoly engine flush? As someone that has had an interest in BG EPR (that's Engine Performance Restore)... you've flushed out the Audi it seems? Can you "notice" anything on the butt dyno or with the ear?

 

[TiGeo]

So, can we say that you are "vouching" for the LiquiMoly engine flush? As someone that has had an interest in BG EPR (that's Engine Performance Restore)... you've flushed out the Audi it seems? Can you "notice" anything on the butt dyno or with the ear?

Sure, I'll vouch for it but the issue is...what am I actually vouching for? I can vouch that it has done no harm to my engine. I can also share that my engine was spotless inside when it was partially apart recently which may or may not have anything do to with the 1) LM engine flush 2) HPL engine cleaner and 3) the oil I've used hahahaa. I notice nothing different the times I've used it w/r to sound or power. My honest feeling is this - using this product simply gives you a more thorough drain and may loosen up a few things on the way out. Based on some videos I've seen showing minor compression improvement after use I think it *can* remove deposits from the piston rings which would be my primary concern. I'll continue to use it for the $10 it costs a few times a year.

 

[dbias]

In forty years of driving I’ve never used an engine flush. Even in my oldest vehicle the transit connect with 205,000 miles and it runs like a top with no ticks or oil usage. Just a steady diet of Mobil 1 or castrol on 10k oci. Replaced the valve cover gasket around 180k miles and the top end looked great.

 

[Slow Car Sport Mode]

Sure, I'll vouch for it but the issue is...what am I actually vouching for? I can vouch that it has done no harm to my engine. I can also share that my engine was spotless inside when it was partially apart recently which may or may not have anything do to with the 1) LM engine flush 2) HPL engine cleaner and 3) the oil I've used hahahaa. I notice nothing different the times I've used it w/r to sound or power. My honest feeling is this - using this product simply gives you a more thorough drain and may loosen up a few things on the way out. Based on some videos I've seen showing minor compression improvement after use I think it *can* remove deposits from the piston rings which would be my primary concern. I'll continue to use it for the $10 it costs a few times a year.

I'm thinking you let it idle 10 minutes engine hot before draining, your application?

I also agree with you, if we are saying it didn't hurt that's a pretty good baseline.

Some feel engine flushes kill engines.

 

[BigTimeTA]

Now that's some serious TBN!!

I've never seen any figure that high before. Curious, if these concentrations of detergents and more specifically, dispersents allow any ZDDP tribofilm formation at all?
Maybe a formulation for silver-containing bearings? Relying on other AWs?

 

[OVERKILL]

I'm thinking you let it idle 10 minutes engine hot before draining, your application?

I also agree with you, if we are saying it didn't hurt that's a pretty good baseline.

Some feel engine flushes kill engines.

Some feel they are a waste of money on a reasonably well maintained engine. I'm in that camp. There are places for traditional cleaner/flush type products when dealing with a neglected engine, but using them on one that's been well maintained is simply mental masturbation, you are doing to because it "feels" potentially beneficial, not because there's any real tangible benefit.

If you've got the money to burn and it makes you feel good? So be it, but if you are not in a position to be essentially pissing that money into the wind, then it's just a bad financial decision. Personally, I'd rather spend the money on ammo.

 

[OVERKILL]

I've never seen any figure that high before. Curious, if these concentrations of detergents and more specifically, dispersents allow any ZDDP tribofilm formation at all?
Maybe a formulation for silver-containing bearings? Relying on other AWs?

It's for a 2-stroke marine diesel, seems to be optimized for mitigating corrosion (according to the description). Note that it's also a straight SAE 50.

I assume that given it is so heavy, that a lot of the work is done with viscosity. Yes, tribofilms should establish.

 

[TiGeo]

I'm thinking you let it idle 10 minutes engine hot before draining, your application?

I also agree with you, if we are saying it didn't hurt that's a pretty good baseline.

Some feel engine flushes kill engines.

It's just a prevailing notion with no factual basis. Follow the instructions - LM isn't in business by ruining folks' engines. I let it idle (already warmed up when I add it) for 15 min (they say 10-15) and drain it.

 

[TiGeo]

simply mental masturbation, you are doing to because it "feels" potentially beneficial, not because there's any real tangible benefit.

So basically most of BITOG w/r to which oil they run when ST will do just as well for most of the cars folks are driving here.

 

[kschachn]

So basically most of BITOG w/r to which oil they run when ST will do just as well for most of the cars folks are driving here.

Each for the proper application. I do not use ST oil in my Tiguan nor did I use it in my BMW - just as you don’t in your cars either.

 

[sk_pete]

Some feel they are a waste of money on a reasonably well maintained engine. I'm in that camp. There are places for traditional cleaner/flush type products when dealing with a neglected engine, but using them on one that's been well maintained is simply mental masturbation, you are doing to because it "feels" potentially beneficial, not because there's any real tangible benefit.

that can be true only when doing very short oci. (vague term)
new oils are even less saps, i personally i am pesimistic about their cleaning power.
new engines are squeezed more for eficiency and power, turbos etc... more heat...making things worse.

the standard cleaners in oil are just to keep things tidy after himself.
too weak to make wholehouse cleaning effect.
forums are full of people complaining about oil consumption, just after few years ownership.
we can guess the piston + rings are gunk deep roasted as hell.

 

[kschachn]

the standard cleaners in oil are just to keep things tidy after himself.
too weak to make wholehouse cleaning effect.
forums are full of people complaining about oil consumption, just after few years ownership.

What are the cleaners in oil?

 

[TiGeo]

Each for the proper application. I do not use ST oil in my Tiguan nor did I use it in my BMW - just as you don’t in your cars either.

I figured that went without saying - no Euro ST. I use ST in 2 of my cars where it fits the application (Ford/Lexus).

 

[OVERKILL]

So basically most of BITOG w/r to which oil they run when ST will do just as well for most of the cars folks are driving here.

Sure, if it has the approvals for the application, unless somebody plans on racking up serious miles, at which point a more premium oil may have some actual tangible benefit, Supertech is typically "adequate".

Of course there are always edge cases (Honda VCM for example) and some anecdotal examples where API lubes have not kept engines clean enough for some people's taste.

Personally, I'll just run a better oil and avoid the flushes.

 

[OVERKILL]

that can be true only when doing very short oci. (vague term)
new oils are even less saps, i personally i am pesimistic about their cleaning power.
new engines are squeezed more for eficiency and power, turbos etc... more heat...making things worse.

the standard cleaners in oil are just to keep things tidy after himself.
too weak to make wholehouse cleaning effect.
forums are full of people complaining about oil consumption, just after few years ownership.
we can guess the piston + rings are gunk deep roasted as hell.

If the consumption is the result of wear, flushes aren't going to help.

And yes, detergents + dispersants are designed to keep things clean, not clean-up deposits. If you already have deposits, well, then you were either not using a lube of sufficient quality, not changing it frequently enough, or both.

Deposit prevention in the ring land area is a part of many of the testing protocols now, but that doesn't mean that an oil like M1 EP 0W-20 wouldn't do markedly better in that area than say TGMO 0W-20, despite both having the same API approval.

 

[sk_pete]

If the consumption is the result of wear, flushes aren't going to help.

And yes, detergents + dispersants are designed to keep things clean, not clean-up deposits. If you already have deposits, well, then you were either not using a lube of sufficient quality, not changing it frequently enough, or both.

ha! and why it wears (and sludges) in the first place?
dear customers, our new gdi hyper-engine has 4 turbos& compressors, use this 0w4 supergiga oil, which is good for 4year oci & 55000miles (it may work until the warranty expires, then bye scrapyard)