Thanks for the pointers - I'm going to give this a shot once the weather down here cools off enough to work outdoors.
Best 4 cycle small engine oil for any price.
- Thread starter greenaccord02
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To:greenaccord02, and everyone else who is thoughfull enough to spend the time to pass on some information.
A BIG THANK YOU.
from:JimPghPa
A BIG THANK YOU.
from:JimPghPa
GC/German Castrol availability:
Pep-Boys (at least my local one in Bethel Park PA) now caries GC.
I recently learned of GC and therefore have not looked for it before today so I do not know how long they have caried it.
The information I read about GC said that it was only at Auto Zone. Just leting people know to look for it at Pep-Boys.
JimPghPa
Pep-Boys (at least my local one in Bethel Park PA) now caries GC.
I recently learned of GC and therefore have not looked for it before today so I do not know how long they have caried it.
The information I read about GC said that it was only at Auto Zone. Just leting people know to look for it at Pep-Boys.
JimPghPa
I've used any 10W-30 I had on hand for 2 Hondas, while anything Briggs got the Delo treatment...
I also used Delo 15W-40 in a Generac/Tecumseh generator, should I switch out to MaxLife or M1 HM 10W-30 instead?
I also used Delo 15W-40 in a Generac/Tecumseh generator, should I switch out to MaxLife or M1 HM 10W-30 instead?
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I personally really like the Amsoil motorcycle oils in 10W-30 and 10W-40. However, I understand what you are saying.
You can walk into Walmart and buy, off the shelf, Mobil 1, full synthetic, 10W-40, motorcycle oil, heavy ZDDP pack, 13.8 cSt at 100C, about 86 cSt at 40C, I forget the HTHS but believe it about 4.1. This is an oil designed from the ground up for air cooled engines and engines that sit around a lot.
You can walk into Walmart and buy, off the shelf, Mobil 1, full synthetic, 10W-40, motorcycle oil, heavy ZDDP pack, 13.8 cSt at 100C, about 86 cSt at 40C, I forget the HTHS but believe it about 4.1. This is an oil designed from the ground up for air cooled engines and engines that sit around a lot.
wow, this thread is relevant to my air cooled scooter engine which only produces a puny 10.5 HP .
Have used the mobil MX4T 10W40 and works wonders as engine demands a 20W40 oil SG oil (manual).
Currently using the motul 300V 4T 5W40 which is basically overkill but man is the revving over the top! ride redlines at 9000 rpm.
Have used the mobil MX4T 10W40 and works wonders as engine demands a 20W40 oil SG oil (manual).
Currently using the motul 300V 4T 5W40 which is basically overkill but man is the revving over the top! ride redlines at 9000 rpm.
Re: For an air-cooled 4 cycle, no oil pump, no oil filter engine,
Using the best easily available oil with respect to season:
This is for a generator, therefore when the oil is put in it is unknown what the air temperature will be when it is used.
There are several oil concerns.
1) What to put in when the generator is to be stored and you do not know what the air temperature will be when run? - - - I select GC. - - - Any comments?
2) What to put in when refilling during an outage when it is known that the ambient air temperature will always be above 40 F? - - - I select Castrol HD 30. I would add ZDDPlus to it if I knew how much to add to a quart to bring it to 1400 PPM. I do not know the the ZDDP level for virgin Castrol HD 30, or how much to add to bring it to 1400 PPM. - - - Any comments?
3) What to put in when refilling during an outage when the ambient air temperature might go near maximum ambient of 101 F? - - - I would select Castrol HD 30, and use a large box fan to add ventilation to the original direction of air flow for the motor and generator, and try to limit the maximum load to 75 percent of rated. The manual says do not use a 40 weight oil, but it might be a good idea. I am thinking of Castrol HD 40. - - - And if I knew how much ZDDPlus to add to get to 1400 PPM I would add it. - - - I have not decided for shure to stay away from 40 weight if ambient air is always going to be above 80 F. - - - Any comments?
4) What to put in when refilling during an outage when the ambient air temperature might go below 40 F. - - - I would select GC. - - - Any comments?
5) What to put in during first 10 hours for break in? - - - I changed out the original oil after 2 hours of use. This engine only has about 3 hours of use on it. I run it for about 10 to 15 minutes every 4 months and change the oil once every year. It probably would be a good idea to run a high ZDDP level oil for about 10 hours on a cool day (below 80 F but above 50 F) with a light load (10 to 25 percent). I have been thinking of using Castrol HD 30 with ZDDPlus. - - - The question is how much ZDDPlus shoud I add to a quart of Castrol HD 30 to make a good break in oil? - - - I think about 1800 PPM of ZDDP would be good for break in. Too much ZDDP can damage an engine. Without knowing the VOA for Castrol HD 30, I do not know how much ZDDPlus to add to a quart. If anyone has any sugestion, or input about the VOA ZDDP level for Castrol HD 30, or for #3) above voa for Castrol HD 40, please let me know. - - - Any comments?
Any coments about what easily availabe oil might be best for any of the above 5 applications is welcome. If you know what national stores cary your sugested oil please pass it on.
I think it is a good idea to break oil suggestions into ambient air temperature range and application so please include what application you are making any suggestion for.
Thanks.
JimPghPA
Using the best easily available oil with respect to season:
This is for a generator, therefore when the oil is put in it is unknown what the air temperature will be when it is used.
There are several oil concerns.
1) What to put in when the generator is to be stored and you do not know what the air temperature will be when run? - - - I select GC. - - - Any comments?
2) What to put in when refilling during an outage when it is known that the ambient air temperature will always be above 40 F? - - - I select Castrol HD 30. I would add ZDDPlus to it if I knew how much to add to a quart to bring it to 1400 PPM. I do not know the the ZDDP level for virgin Castrol HD 30, or how much to add to bring it to 1400 PPM. - - - Any comments?
3) What to put in when refilling during an outage when the ambient air temperature might go near maximum ambient of 101 F? - - - I would select Castrol HD 30, and use a large box fan to add ventilation to the original direction of air flow for the motor and generator, and try to limit the maximum load to 75 percent of rated. The manual says do not use a 40 weight oil, but it might be a good idea. I am thinking of Castrol HD 40. - - - And if I knew how much ZDDPlus to add to get to 1400 PPM I would add it. - - - I have not decided for shure to stay away from 40 weight if ambient air is always going to be above 80 F. - - - Any comments?
4) What to put in when refilling during an outage when the ambient air temperature might go below 40 F. - - - I would select GC. - - - Any comments?
5) What to put in during first 10 hours for break in? - - - I changed out the original oil after 2 hours of use. This engine only has about 3 hours of use on it. I run it for about 10 to 15 minutes every 4 months and change the oil once every year. It probably would be a good idea to run a high ZDDP level oil for about 10 hours on a cool day (below 80 F but above 50 F) with a light load (10 to 25 percent). I have been thinking of using Castrol HD 30 with ZDDPlus. - - - The question is how much ZDDPlus shoud I add to a quart of Castrol HD 30 to make a good break in oil? - - - I think about 1800 PPM of ZDDP would be good for break in. Too much ZDDP can damage an engine. Without knowing the VOA for Castrol HD 30, I do not know how much ZDDPlus to add to a quart. If anyone has any sugestion, or input about the VOA ZDDP level for Castrol HD 30, or for #3) above voa for Castrol HD 40, please let me know. - - - Any comments?
Any coments about what easily availabe oil might be best for any of the above 5 applications is welcome. If you know what national stores cary your sugested oil please pass it on.
I think it is a good idea to break oil suggestions into ambient air temperature range and application so please include what application you are making any suggestion for.
Thanks.
JimPghPA
First, as it applies to all points:
yes, the temperature it will start in is unknown, but at the same time there won't be a lot of cold starts. This isn't a commuter car, it's an emergency generator. I assume there's no automatic start or transfer switch. If you decide to fire it up, it will probably be on for a while. Does the power go out a lot where you are? As long as the oil isn't so thick that it interferes with starting, I wouldn't sweat the wear too much.
1) it might be nice to have something designed with storage in mind. Like Amsoil ASE. Supposedly lots of anti-corrosion agents in there for OPE that is stored.
2) I see cold temperatures as a non-issue. You are *RE*-filling. The engine is warm. Run anything you like. The bigger concern is...
3) Now, extra-hot temperatures is another matter entirely. I may be concerned below 101F. Do you load your genset to 100% or does it lope along at 50%. If you're not overloading it, this may be less of an issue as the designed air cooling may be sufficient. Is the genset in the sun or shade? Do you have to account for the beating sun in the heat the engine needs to shed?
4) See #2. The engine is warm, use whatever gives you good runtime and protection. I presume that when your "outage" is confirmed to be over you'll change the oil again for storage from the way you've written in this post. I'd be concerned about selecting a re-fill oil that gets you the longest runtime between changes, since it's running continuously. Perhaps you could get 2, 3 or 4 days per OCI instead of just 1. This might be where HD40s or 15W50s come into play?
5) Amsoil ASE has lots of ZDDP, and is a good storage oil (although maybe pricey to simply throw away once a year). Perhaps move it from your genset to your lawnmower or something so it at least gets used. Any moisture will simply boil off as long as it isn't rediculous in quantity.
Of course if you think too much about all of your different scenarios, you'll have to have a ton of different oils on hand. You certainly don't want to depend on going out and buying something you need (including fuel) when the power is out. Remember Aug/2003? GC or Amsoil ASE might be all you need. A mid-winter start with ASE might be a little tougher than desired, but would it wreck the genset? It's still a 10W.
If you could work out other equipment to use the GC and ASE you could do seasonal OCIs on the genset. GC for winter standby (and consumption in something like a road vehicle the following summer if it was never used) and ASE for summer (with consumption the following winter in something like a snowthrower if it wasn't used?)... Just trying to avoid waste of good oil
yes, the temperature it will start in is unknown, but at the same time there won't be a lot of cold starts. This isn't a commuter car, it's an emergency generator. I assume there's no automatic start or transfer switch. If you decide to fire it up, it will probably be on for a while. Does the power go out a lot where you are? As long as the oil isn't so thick that it interferes with starting, I wouldn't sweat the wear too much.
1) it might be nice to have something designed with storage in mind. Like Amsoil ASE. Supposedly lots of anti-corrosion agents in there for OPE that is stored.
2) I see cold temperatures as a non-issue. You are *RE*-filling. The engine is warm. Run anything you like. The bigger concern is...
3) Now, extra-hot temperatures is another matter entirely. I may be concerned below 101F. Do you load your genset to 100% or does it lope along at 50%. If you're not overloading it, this may be less of an issue as the designed air cooling may be sufficient. Is the genset in the sun or shade? Do you have to account for the beating sun in the heat the engine needs to shed?
4) See #2. The engine is warm, use whatever gives you good runtime and protection. I presume that when your "outage" is confirmed to be over you'll change the oil again for storage from the way you've written in this post. I'd be concerned about selecting a re-fill oil that gets you the longest runtime between changes, since it's running continuously. Perhaps you could get 2, 3 or 4 days per OCI instead of just 1. This might be where HD40s or 15W50s come into play?
5) Amsoil ASE has lots of ZDDP, and is a good storage oil (although maybe pricey to simply throw away once a year). Perhaps move it from your genset to your lawnmower or something so it at least gets used. Any moisture will simply boil off as long as it isn't rediculous in quantity.
Of course if you think too much about all of your different scenarios, you'll have to have a ton of different oils on hand. You certainly don't want to depend on going out and buying something you need (including fuel) when the power is out. Remember Aug/2003? GC or Amsoil ASE might be all you need. A mid-winter start with ASE might be a little tougher than desired, but would it wreck the genset? It's still a 10W.
If you could work out other equipment to use the GC and ASE you could do seasonal OCIs on the genset. GC for winter standby (and consumption in something like a road vehicle the following summer if it was never used) and ASE for summer (with consumption the following winter in something like a snowthrower if it wasn't used?)... Just trying to avoid waste of good oil
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Thank you Craig in Canada for the response.
We do not see many outages here in Pittsburg PA.
There has been major ICE STORMS within several hundred miles of here in all four directions of the compass within the last 10 years. By major ICE STORM I am talking about over 250,000 without power for up to two weeks. The other concern is posible loss of power on the hottest days. That is why I chose a generator with enough power to run the whole house AC.
In reply to your no.1) I did not know about Amsoil ASE. I have only used Castrol HD 30 so far, and was considering using GC for the storage oil. One VOA I saw for GC showed (if I rember right) calcium as a detergent addative. I read somewhere that calcium attracts moisture (not good for long storage) and am therefore concerned that GC might not be the best storage oil. I was considering using GC for storage because I am concerned that the Castrol HD 30 might be too thick for use on a minus Fahrenheit ambient air tempperature winter day.
In reply to your no.3) If used for the whole house AC the generator would only be runing the AC during the start-up. Everything else would be disconected during each start-up. The start-up load of the AC is pushing the limit of the 5000/6250 watt peak generator for the short time during start-up. I tested it and it works. The generator set will be in shade protected from sun and rain below a large tarp over a tall swing set. The running wattage load will probably be about 50 percent in the summer, and 80 percent in the winter.
In reply to your no.4) and 5) I would change oil every day. Our mower is electric, and our snow remover is arm-powerd.
I understand wanting to avoid waste of good oil. After 2.66 years, I have a large plastic jug that has the oil from three oil changes in it and the generator set has about three hours total run time on it.
Thanks for the reply, and for the info about Amsoil ASE, I will have to call the local Amsoil rep.
JimPghPa
We do not see many outages here in Pittsburg PA.
There has been major ICE STORMS within several hundred miles of here in all four directions of the compass within the last 10 years. By major ICE STORM I am talking about over 250,000 without power for up to two weeks. The other concern is posible loss of power on the hottest days. That is why I chose a generator with enough power to run the whole house AC.
In reply to your no.1) I did not know about Amsoil ASE. I have only used Castrol HD 30 so far, and was considering using GC for the storage oil. One VOA I saw for GC showed (if I rember right) calcium as a detergent addative. I read somewhere that calcium attracts moisture (not good for long storage) and am therefore concerned that GC might not be the best storage oil. I was considering using GC for storage because I am concerned that the Castrol HD 30 might be too thick for use on a minus Fahrenheit ambient air tempperature winter day.
In reply to your no.3) If used for the whole house AC the generator would only be runing the AC during the start-up. Everything else would be disconected during each start-up. The start-up load of the AC is pushing the limit of the 5000/6250 watt peak generator for the short time during start-up. I tested it and it works. The generator set will be in shade protected from sun and rain below a large tarp over a tall swing set. The running wattage load will probably be about 50 percent in the summer, and 80 percent in the winter.
In reply to your no.4) and 5) I would change oil every day. Our mower is electric, and our snow remover is arm-powerd.
I understand wanting to avoid waste of good oil. After 2.66 years, I have a large plastic jug that has the oil from three oil changes in it and the generator set has about three hours total run time on it.
Thanks for the reply, and for the info about Amsoil ASE, I will have to call the local Amsoil rep.
JimPghPa
To Craig in Canada:
I have thought it over and decided that since 10W-30 is only good down to -4 F I do not want that as a fill when the generator might be starting at temperature below -4 F.
I am going with GC.
JimPghPa
I have thought it over and decided that since 10W-30 is only good down to -4 F I do not want that as a fill when the generator might be starting at temperature below -4 F.
I am going with GC.
JimPghPa
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