Average new car price is $50K ? Insanity.

[AlphaOmega]

What’s your favorite brand of cars/trucks ???
Just curious

I’m not a “fan boy”, I like sophisticated engineering in regular form transportation (sedans or mid size SUVs), which means I like Mercs, bimmers, Audis. Currently I drive a previous generation E class, but if I was shopping for a car today, I’d pick a BMWs 5 series over current E class because I think it’s a better car for the engineering standpoint. Style is important, but secondary. And besides, true beauty is more than skin deep, so what is underneath is what counts.

Some look at, for example, 5 series and think it looks like needlessly complicated of dubious usefulness Honda accord and for the money it sells I can get a beyond nicely equipped mega truck (whatever ~$70k gets you) that I can transport a couch in once in a blue moon. Whereas I see an ultra sophisticated engineering in a practically-sized form in 5 series, and a primitive “ladder with live axel” and an oversized mucho-themed box attached on top of it, sprinkled with savage-dazzling bells and whistles (King Ranch edition or something) in a truck.

All that being said, I would not cry about a horrible life if I had to drive a Honda Accord, as it’s a fine premium economy car. But because we live once and I like cars, I prefer Germans “Honda accords” that cost twice as much for base model for a reason!

 

[KrisZ]

I’m not a “fan boy”, I like sophisticated engineering in regular form transportation (sedans or mid size SUVs), which means I like Mercs, bimmers, Audis. Currently I drive a previous generation E class, but if I was shopping for a car today, I’d pick a BMWs 5 series over current E class because I think it’s a better car for the engineering standpoint. Style is important, but secondary. And besides, true beauty is more than skin deep, so what is underneath is what counts.

Some look at, for example, 5 series and think it looks like needlessly complicated of dubious usefulness Honda accord and for the money it sells I can get a beyond nicely equipped mega truck (whatever ~$70k gets you) that I can transport a couch in once in a blue moon. Whereas I see an ultra sophisticated engineering in a practically-sized form in 5 series, and a primitive “ladder with live axel” and an oversized mucho-themed box attached on top of it, sprinkled with savage-dazzling bells and whistles (King Ranch edition or something) in a truck.

All that being said, I would not cry about a horrible life if I had to drive a Honda Accord, as it’s a fine premium economy car. But because we live once and I like cars, I prefer Germans “Honda accords” that cost twice as much for base model for a reason!

Can you please give us an example of this "sophisticated engineering"?

 

[AlphaOmega]

Can you please give us an example of this "sophisticated engineering"?

See my post 374, 376, and 377. Not only examples, but direct comparisons in HD+ in under 5 minutes

 

[John105]

All I can figure is this is what changed.

Our grandparents, when they passed away they left their assets to heirs, charity, and a taxing authority. They were savers. If they had luxury items they were wealthy.

Today, people are ok not having anything at all to pass on, and actually pass away owing debts. Look at 75 yo now doing reverse mortgages to live? Is that what anyone wants? I doubt it.

What am I trying to say? We only live once buy that $123k Grand Wagoneer, and live life like a movie star!

 

[John105]

We have the same prices…. Just adjusted for inflation. In fact, performance/content/options per $ is only getting better, as in: more band for one’s buck. I don’t see anything to complain about on this front. Now, that some people’s incomes lag (and have been lagging for decades) behind inflation is another subject

I don’t think this holds true. A concert ticket was $8.50 in 1981. That’s $30 today. I didn’t like it but I paid $177/ticket for 3 concerts last year, because I wasn’t about to pay $400 or $1000 (I did sneak into the pit at one show).

Maybe you were being tongue in cheek about the adjustment for inflation

 

[b_b]

I'm confused as to how an aluminum truck can have surface rust in just 5 years?

 

[KrisZ]

See my post 374, 376, and 377. Not only examples, but direct comparisons in HD+ in under 5 minutes

Then you are simply using industry buzz words.

The BMW suspension is a step up from the economy segment, as it should be, so yes, it is more sophisticated, as in more complex, but where is the "sophisticated engineering"?

You specifically mentioned sophisticated engineering. Engineering in and of itself is complicated and complex. Oftentimes, it is actually the opposite of what you perceive as sophistication. Relatively simple and "unsophisticated" looking solutions can be very hard to engineer.
So just because something looks more complex, doesn't mean more engineering went into it. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. There is no way of knowing for an average person.

Now, don't take it the wrong way. I'm not suggesting that the suspension in a BMW 5 series required less engineering effort than one in an Accord.

 

[hardcore302]

For example?

Gti

 

[AlphaOmega]

I don’t think this holds true. A concert ticket was $8.50 in 1981. That’s $30 today. I didn’t like it but I paid $177/ticket for 3 concerts last year, because I wasn’t about to pay $400 or $1000 (I did sneak into the pit at one show).

Maybe you were being tongue in cheek about the adjustment for inflation

Look, in 2005 Mustang had a base price of $19k.

Guess what is $19k from 2005 is in 2023, adjusted for inflation? It’s about $29,500:

And what is the base price of 2023 Mustang that is a significantly better, safer, faster, comfier, and so on car, in 2023? That’s right, it is even cheaper than a Mustang back in 2005:

 

[AlphaOmega]

Then you are simply using industry buzz words.

The BMW suspension is a step up from the economy segment, as it should be, so yes, it is more sophisticated, as in more complex, but where is the "sophisticated engineering"?

You specifically mentioned sophisticated engineering. Engineering in and of itself is complicated and complex. Oftentimes, it is actually the opposite of what you perceive as sophistication. Relatively simple and "unsophisticated" looking solutions can be very hard to engineer.
So just because something looks more complex, doesn't mean more engineering went into it. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. There is no way of knowing for an average person.

Now, don't take it the wrong way. I'm not suggesting that the suspension in a BMW 5 series required less engineering effort than one in an Accord.

Bud, it takes more engineering to make a long haul aircraft, like Boeing 777 vs a regional jet , like Embraer 175. It isn’t just bigger fuselage, longer wings, and more powerful engines, right? One does not need to be an aircraft engineer to figure this one out. Kind of a similar concept between a Honda Accord grade of car vs BMW 5 series grade of car. Does it make sense now?

And you can have a luxury trimmed, presidential Embraer 175 and a all-economy, Frontier airlines style Boing 777, but this is irrelevant to relative difference between sophisticated-ness in engineering between the two aircraft

 

[AlphaOmega]

Gti

When was the last time GTI coup was under $20k, what year?

 

[KrisZ]

Bud, it takes more engineering to make a long haul aircraft, like Boeing 777 vs a regional jet , like Embraer 175. It isn’t just bigger fuselage, longer wings, and more powerful engines, right? One does not need to be an aircraft engineer to figure this one out. Kind of a similar concept between a Honda Accord grade of car vs BMW 5 series grade of car. Does it make sense now?

And you can have a luxury trimmed, presidential Embraer 175 and a all-economy, Frontier airlines style Boing 777, but this is irrelevant to relative difference between sophisticated-ness in engineering between the two aircraft

Yeah, sure maybe while we're at it lets bring up a space shuttle or rockets. Whatever makes you feel better to swallow the marketing BS.

 

[M56959]

Folks, petty bickering and profanity violate forum rules.

Don't post yourself into time away or losing your membership.