Automatic Transmission whine question

[robnitro]

1995 civic dx with the 4 sp auto.
I changed the fluid recently, by doing a double drain and fill. Drain, fill, run the engine through the gears for a few mins, drain, fill. The transmission started to do a whine around 3000-4000 rpm, whether in P, N, or in gear (I'm saying it's related to revs , not speed or gear).
Shifting is awesome, and this noise happened with honda atf z1, and also chevron atf dex3 (I replaced the fluid again with double drain and fill using that).
It goes away, and comes back, so randomly that I get confused. Also, it happens in the morning, but this morn I just shut off the engine, waited 5 secs and turned it on and it went away. So, I don't think its from cold fluid.

It's strange, and the same noise has happened when I put auto rx in my trans, which worried me, so I drained and filled twice, and it was fine after that. Hopefully the screen isn't clogged and maybe that makes the pump make the noise? Maybe I should run lube control or autorx and leave it in gear sitting for 30 mins to move the fluid around?
Or, maybe there's air caught in the trans? If so, how would I get that out?

Thanks,
Robert

[ January 19, 2004, 02:51 AM: Message edited by: robnitro ]

 

[7TFord]

...It sounds like a pump noise which may be due to some air in the system after your fluid changes or low on fluid if that is possible. As you say a screen change might of been a good idea as it could starve the pump of fluid if it is starting to clog up. Try just putting some miles on it first to see if that changes anything.

 

[robnitro]

Thanks!
The only issue is that the screen is not serviceable. Theres no pan, just a drainbolt.

Maybe I should trade it in for a 99 or 2000 jetta tdi

(That car rocks!)
, BUT I wonder what the dealer would say if he heard the whine. Maybe I can just act dumb and pretend like it could be a belt.

 

[ChrisW]

Hey rob, how is the Chevron Dex3 running in your 95 civic? Did you add any HFM (lubeguard)? Or is it straight Dex3? What was better, the honda Z1 or the chevron? (one is a lot cheaper).

My bro has a 94 civic ex auto that I'd like to change the fluid on.

-Chris

 

[robnitro]

I was running the honda fluid and had no problems. But then I added auto rx (i know, don't fix what's not broken) and it did the whine afterwards. So I drained and filled 2x, and tried out some supertech type f. Shifts much firmer and no shudder at all. But then, I decided to try chevron dex3 mixed with honda atfz1. It was about half and half, with the honda at the second drain and fill. Thats when I started hearing the whine again. It very well may be I underfilled or overfilled. The trans is from a 93 civic, and the dipstick sucks on this version (my older one was much more "solid" IMO). The full mark isn't truly full I would say.

So then I think maybe I clogged the screen, so I put auto rx again but a bit less than normal application, to see maybe it needs to work in slowly to liquify the crap, but the noise was so much more and on my little high stress test (driving up a mountain on a highway at 75 mph keeping it from downshifting) it got to the point where the torque converter wasn't locking up! So, I check out the 2 solenoids, and they are clean and click fine with 9v applied to them.
I decided to drain and fill 3x and put back dex 3 chevron. That helps but still lockup wasn't always coming on (I'm guessing not enough internal pressure?).

So I put it back, and switch out the fluid back to type f, thinking maybe its slippage of clutches. It still makes the slight whine at times, but none of the failure to lockup the torque converter on the mountains test. I added a heavy duty dose of lube control (about 6 oz for the 6qt trans sump), and its been better. I drove hard with it, and let it idle in gear with handbrake on for 45 mins, to let it circulate warm. Possibly this helps dissolve what may be stuck on the screen? I will do a T tec flush with digitaldrifter (he lives nearby) tomorrow or wed, and see what happens.


So basically, I would say that honda fluid is ok, but its not worth it unless you are having trouble with standard dex 3. Chevron looks top notch, and since these transmissions don't have servicable filters, I'd rather do a drain and fill every 20-30k than every 50k with more expensive fluid.

And yes, I am crazy, but heck, thats how one learns! By the way, these problems may very well just be because of how I drive, but it confuses me how nothing happens UNTIL a fluid change. Perhaps the last owner of this transmission never changed the fluid?

 

[robnitro]

Ok, the whine is almost non existant!
I added a heavy duty dose of lube control, not expecting much. It was about 6 ozs or so (A/T is 6.2qt total). Within one drive the noise was happening less. So, I do think it was the screen being plugged from the changes I have done which must have disloged chunks of crud. The lube control dissolved the crap probably, which is why it took a day or two to stop hearing the whine.

I just changed to supertech dex 3 with a double drain and fill and its ok too. Did my heat up by driving with unlocked tc hill test a few times to be sure. BTW, I'm not bashing auto rx, just perhaps the screen on this generation of transmission is crappy?

 

[ChrisW]

I'm concerned that a Dex3 fill on a 92-95 civic (and some integras) auto transmission without HFM would result in sliping as some people have experienced with the newer gen (96-00) civics. It's either that it will cause harder shifts or slippage.

The screen is rather small. Lemme see if I can find a pic of it. It is serviceable, but only by taking apart the whole transmission.

 

[robnitro]

The HFM is for newer transmissions that require honda spec and not dex II in the manual.

In fact, I think it causes harder shifts, digitaldrifter91 has an 89 accord and the same thing happens to him with dex 3 compared to honda (which was made after his car!).

Robert

 

[robnitro]

Oh yeah, is the screen very fine, like how faucets have the screen in the aerator?

Oh yeah btw, the lubegard black isn't even worth it, since lets say it costs 8 bux, you only use 3 qts of fluid so if anything you can get honda fluid for $4/qt. I'd rather have honda fluid, than regular dex3 with lubegard HFM, because supposedly the honda fluid has better cold temp properties. But for me, I prefer a regular dexron, since my transmission specs dex2. I find it kinda *** backwards to say that to copy the old dex 2 spec, you need dex 3 with lubegard. Dex 3 would be more slipperier I would think, plus resists oxidation better!