ATF Flush machines

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Are they safe to use?
My Toyota dealer has one and doesn't use it because they say it transfers to fast (too much pressure?) and causes problems with seals. It just sits in the corner collecting dust. They say it's better to just pour the new fluid in while it drains out the other end.
Has anyone else heard of the machines being a problem with seals?
 
A number of shops in my area use the T-Tech machine, from Clore Automotive. The T-Tech uses the transmission's own pump to transfer the fluid, so there cannot be "too much pressure". There's also no way it can be hooked up backwards, so there's no danger of that other perennial myth, the dreaded "backflushing".

Disclaimer: No, I don't work for them.
 
The better machines measure/weigh the fluid coming out and add fluid at the same rate going in.

RF Overlord - when you say they use the transmissions own pump, not sure I understand. The flush machine has a 5 gallon container of fresh fluid, what gets that fresh fluid from that container info into the transmission? Normally its a 12V controlled rate pump (cheaper ones use air pressure)

It seems most transmission service falls into one of two categories:
1)a transmission flush where they use a flush machine, maybe a can of cleaner (and maybe conditioner) and they say the flush takes care of cleaning the filter. All the fluid gets changed, but the filter does not, nor does the magnet or pan get wiped off.
2)a drain the pan, drop it, replace the filter, wipe clean the magnet and the pan. Only the fluid in the pan gets changed which is about 2/5 of the total fluid
 
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RF Overlord - when you say they use the transmissions own pump, not sure I understand. The flush machine has a 5 gallon container of fresh fluid, what gets that fresh fluid from that container info into the transmission? Normally its a 12V controlled rate pump (cheaper ones use air pressure)


The T-Tech machine has a double-ended cylinder with a piston in the middle, much like a shock absorber. Fresh fluid is pumped into one end, pushing the piston all the way to the other. The machine is then hooked up in series with a transmission cooler line on your car, and the car's engine is started. The transmission's pump pushes the old fluid into the other end of the cylinder which causes the piston to push the fresh fluid back into the transmission at the same rate. There is no external pump used so there is no chance of applying too much pressure. Click on the link I provided above and it will explain the whole process in more detail.
 
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I plan to try the Amsoil automatic transmission flush method; it makes sense and costs almost nothing to do.




I would have someone in the car ready to turn off key quickly if something goes wrong. The only tricky thing to deal with is to estimate the rate that the fluid is being pushed out into the used fluid container and try and pour in at the same rate.

I'd look at the Amsoil website or manual to see how many QTs of fluid you need and have one extra. Also having the caps off the QTs of ATF will speed things up changing QTs as you are pouring.

Best would be to help out a not so good friend change the fluid in his 1980 Pinto so you can gather experience and work out the kinks.

Its possible that if you get a medium size funnel with medium size throat, that the throat diameter will be fine and will limit the fill rate.
 
Well, I decided to try the BG ATF transfer machine at a local auto shop. It hooks up to the oil cooler lines and tranfers the new fluid into the tranny as old fluid comes out (similar to the T-Tech but uses a bladder instead of a piston). Unfortunately, the owner (who knows how to use the machine) gave verbal instructions to an employee on how to do the job and said to train another guy they just hired while he was doing the job. Well, I guess you get the picture...there were several mistakes made while the owner sat in his air-conditioned office.

#1 The new fluid reservoir in the machine needs to be filled (up to 15 qts) with the exact amount required to do the job (13 qts?). They only put 10 qts in because they did not see a gallon jug still sitting in the box I brought with me. They were holding 2 qts in one jug for top-off after the transfer.

#2 The return line fitting on the machine was not fitting correctly so old fluid was spewing on the floor for several minutes. Instead of transferring new fluid into the tranny via the bladder, it was going on the floor. They were not even looking for this to be a problem until I told them to look under the truck.

#3 When they told me the job was finished, I asked them why they didn't use the last gallon jug? Ooops! Well, they didn't see it, but they had to empty the old reservoir because it was full. Now, they pour the last gallon into the machine, but there's not enough old oil to push the bladder into the new fluid. So they tell me the job is finished again and start to check the dipstick. No reading, so they pour the 2 qts saved for top-off into the dipstick hole. Still no reading. So now what?

#4 The employee goes to talk to the owner about the problem. He has poured 14 qts into the machine, and 2 qts into the tranny via the dipstick. 16 qts to do a 13 qt job and there's still no reading on the dipstick! Unfortunately, he only mentioned the oil spill in the beginning of the procedure from the bad fitting.

#5 The owner now has to make good on the oil shortage and tries to satisfy my wishes. Unfortunately for him I'm pretty disturbed about spending $160+ on 4 gallons of AMSOIL ATD, and neither he nor I know how much of that ever got into my tranny! Since ordering more from AMSOIL was not an option, I suggested he find some Castrol Transynd at a GM dealer or auto parts store. No luck, in fact no one had ever heard of this Castrol product, including a Castrol salesrep across the street at Auto Zone. So we settled on 3 qts of Valvoline full synthetic DEX VI to top off the tranny.

This was quite an ordeal that I still get ____ about. I was very excited to get the AMSOIL ATD into my Tundra tranny, and did quite a bit of homework as far as cost and which procedure to use. I obviously didn't take into account the gross incompetence part of the equation enough. Even though I'm not sure of the exact fill in my tranny, I can report that it is very smooth and the torque converter seems much more consistent now (no hard lock-ups).
 
They were designed to do one thing;take more money from the customer. I've heard all the reps "spill" for the machines and all they talk about is how much more a shop can charge for doing a flush as compared to a drain&fill or pan removal.
Stay on top of your service intervals and you won't ever need a flush. I wonder how so many trannies that have over 200K on them ever made it that far without ever being hooked to a flush machine.
I have a cheap kit that I "flush" a tranny with if it's really bad. It connects to the return fittings on the radiator cooler and I start the vehicle;drain two qts. and add two qts. I repeat the proceedure until the fluid comes out clean. I recently did a Volvo this way and it worked great. It also took only 7qts to achieve a clean tranny plus I didn't stirr up anything in the process. I'll not own a flush machine in my shop. To me it is similar to the old ring a few crooked gas station attendants used years ago. The ring had a sharp needle-like protrusion on the palm-side of the hand. When he opened the hood on your car to check the oil level he would give your radiator hose a good squeeze with the thing on. "Maam, are you lucky you stopped when you did;you have a serious coolant leak!" Story goes he made thousands off that little ring. That was a story told to me by an "old timer" that got his start in a service station beside an interstate years ago. To me, these tranny flush machines are a very fancy model of that ring. It's sad that new car dealers have had to resort to selling gimmics to keep profits up in an ever declining market. I would put a serious question mark over any shop that pushed these things on their customers.
 
Some transmission are not filter serviceable any more most are. If you like you can have a filter change too.

The dopes with their BG machine should be ashamed. Anyway we always fill up the machine to the top and then do the flush. The BG machine will tend to leave the car 1.5 qts low in our experience. We have flushed cars sometimes twice when they are dirty to get back to clean fluid. The machine is not a problem. It is a convenient way to clean out old fluid.

Seems funny we try to change as much oil in out engine but the tranny ah heck with that. Weird. The filters are over looked often but offered often where I am at. But even then I'd still like to have the fresh fluid. Especially when I bought my Ford Focus sued and while the OCI for the engine was a religious experience the Transmission was going on BLACK. Not there yet but getting there. Did a flush and much better. Next time will be the filter and flush.

See no difference between the flush machine for the trans or coolant. And it is the only way to do coolant as far as I am concerned. Yeah we have had the tracks and cars that have had the overflow and drain opened and run for hour with the water overflowing out of both end while flushing a dirty engine. We have had to do several multiple times.

We use the machines on our own cars.
 
There are a couple of things I'd like to say to clarify about my situation. I chose to do a flush rather than a drain and fill because I was disatisfied with the ATF in my transmission and wanted to get as much out as possible. I chose ATD Torque Drive as a replacement because it seemed to offer everything I was looking for to use in my 130K mile transmission. I considered several shops, including a Toyota dealership, to do the job. The local shop I used did not push anything on me. We discussed all options and prices and agreed to $47 for the BG machine flush. Since the pan and screen filter had been cleaned during a recent Toyota servicing at 120K miles, I wasn't overly concerned about that, but would have been nice to have done again too.
This autoshop is not unlike the other ones in the small town that I live. Their parking lot and bays are full of old junkers owned by people who just want their vehicle to run another week and probably can't pay their bill when the job is done. So, to have a customer like me who requests services above and beyond that which will last another week and can pay for it is unusual for the shop. I expect higher standards and they know it. They are embarrassed and I know it. Am I still ____ off? Not really. More disappointed. Will I use this shop again for minor servicing? Probably. I like them personally and want to support the local economy. They don't mind if I observe their work (at least they don't ask me to leave the bay anymore). So, we move on...
 
Indymac, I admire your attitude. Not sure I could look at it as you do if I were in your situation. I have a 00 Tundra, and dropped the pan @ 50K to inspect. At least I now know, but turned out to be a waste of time & effort. All was spotless inside. Since the filter is no more than a strainer, I took it down & cleaned it, cleaned the magnets, and put it back together. Some years back I did a manual flush w/ Amsoil as described in previous posts here. Just for insurance, I also added an external spin on trans filter. I now change the spin on every 5-6K and top off fluid. I then do a pan drain once a year - and I see no reason why this trans won't go the life of the truck. Thanks, Steve
 
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