Article on Microsoft Security Essentials

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Mar 5, 2003
Messages
8,461
Location
Colorado
There was an interesting article written by Paul Thurrott at the Windows Supersite about Microsoft Security Essentials. The article links to an article at the Microsoft website Malware Protection Center Blog.

Essentially Microsoft is disputing the poor grades given by AV-Test to Microsoft Security Essentials and Forefront Endpoint Protection. This is the article by Paul Thurott:

'Microsoft’s antivirus technologies—used in the consumer-oriented Microsoft Security Essentials (MSE) and business-focused Forefront Endpoint Protection products—have pretty much always performed poorly in formal AV tests. But after yet another drubbing, this time by AV-Test, the software giant is finally pushing back. And for good cause: Those tests prove nothing.

In its most recent test, AV-Test refused to grant MSE and Forefront Endpoint Protection its vaunted AV-Test Certified status because the products didn’t detect 28 of its zero-day malware samples, and 9 percent of its recent malware samples. It sounds [censored]. But Microsoft says these tests are flawed and do nothing to show the real-world effectiveness of its antivirus products.

“We take the protection of our customers very seriously, and the investments we make to do these reviews is an example of that commitment,” Microsoft’s Joe Blackbird writes in a post to the Malware Protection Center blog. “It is difficult for independent antimalware testing organizations to devise tests that are consistent with the real-world conditions that customers live in … We prioritize our work on customer impact.”

How far off are AV-Test’s results?

According to Microsoft, although AV-Test’s results indicated that Microsoft’s antivirus products detected only 72 percent of all “zero-day malware,” Microsoft knows from its telemetry data—from hundreds of millions of systems around the world—that fully 99.997 percent of its customers hit with any zero-day attack did not in fact encounter the malware samples tested in this test (basically a 100 percent success rate in the real world). AV-Test’s sample size was just 100 pieces of malware.

Furthermore, though AV-Test’s results indicated that Microsoft’s antivirus products missed 9 percent of “recent malware,” the firm knows from telemetry that 94 percent of these missed malware samples were never encountered by any customers in the real world. So, in the real world, it’s possible that Microsoft antivirus products missed 9 percent of 6 percent of recent malware, although Microsoft doesn’t admit to that.

According to AV-Test, Microsoft scored just 1.5 out of a possible 6.0 for the protection component of its test, and it scored fully 0 out of 1.5 in both zero-day malware and recent malware protection. But according to Microsoft’s usage data, the missed samples affected just 0.003 percent of customers in the real world. Looking past telemetry, the firm used “retrospective analysis” to determine whether any customers had actually encountered malicious files it had missed. And it found that only 2 percent of these files existed across 0.003 percent of customers.

The conclusion: “The other 94 percent of the [AV-Test] samples don't represent what customers encounter,” Mr. Blackbird writes. “When we explicitly looked for these files, we could not find them on our customers’ machines … [But] we're committed to reducing our 0.0033 percent margin to zero.”

The message here is simple. You can conduct tests that prove almost anything. But in the real world, Microsoft’s MSE and Forefront Endpoint Protection products don’t just work, they work very, very well. And this isn’t based on anecdotal data—though this certainly mirrors my own usage and explains why I continue to recommend these products—it’s a fact.'

I have had some reservations about the accuracy of AV-Test testing myself. I noticed that in some testing they were using just 100 examples of malware. I prefer AV-Comparatives and VirusBulletin.
 
While it may be true that some of the tested malware was never seen in the real world, that test is still quite valuable in examining the anti-malware software's "heuristics" or core functionality of looking for suspicious activity.

MSE is certainly better than nothing, but Paul is now a MSFT employee so of course he will try to stick up for them.

It's just one test, in the end, and I think people need to look at multiple sources of data and make an educated decision (like anything else in life).
 
Yes I agree it is just one test and people do need to look at multiple sources. I do check AV-Test, AV-Comparatives, and VirusBulletin quite a bit when I am trying to decide on a antivirus program.

I did see a test done by an independent researcher recently on Windows Defender in Windows 8. Windows Defender actually did quite well. I guess I am trying to like very much the free Microsoft Security Essentials and the free Windows Defender for Windows 8.

I do put the AV-Test testing in third place behind AV-Comparatives and VirusBulletin.
 
Interesting article, enjoyed reading it. From a more pragmatic point just share my experience with Norton Internet Security and how I came to use MSE.

Several years back I was using Norton IS and got a fairly bad virus/trojan that would redirect my browser to some strange sites rendering it useless. Norton IS was supposedly up to date and monitoring when it happened. Ran a scan several more times to no avail. Tried to get in touch with Norton for support, most I could get was an online chat in which they basically ended up saying they couldn't help me.

Finally called Microsoft and their IE support rep spent at least a couple hours manually cleaning my files, getting the computer/browser working, no charge. Then he recommended I install MSE which I did and I haven't looked back. It's the only virus/malware program I have on two computers, been satisfied. To be fair, now I believe Microsoft charges for the service I recieved for free.

So, while MSE may not be "the best", practically speaking for me it's been more than " better than nothing". Or perhaps better than nothing with nothing in my experience being Norton Internet Security.

Thanks for posting the article.
 
I use the free MS security software on my computers; haven't had a problem that I know of since I started using it.

Granted, I also do the following:
- Modified hosts file that redirects malware/adware sites to loopback
- Use a non-administrative account for everyday use*

*This is a huge one. At my last job, we had a huge problem with people's computer getting infected with malware even with virus scanners. This pretty much all but stopped the problems. Over the course of one weekend, we revoked local admin rights for everyone. The malware slowed down a TON.
 
Have used every brand ever to hit the market. MSE is the only thing that has caught malware and prevented it from be downloaded/installed on my computer. In the 8 years I have owned my current desktop this has happened about 5 times. It quarantines it, and then I safely delete it. The Big N could never get rid of anything, and made my computer horribly slow.

I think in the real world it works well because it is integrated with the OS updates and it all runs automatically and in harmony. Chevy's tend to be more dependable than Cadillac's
 
Paul is NOT a paid Microsoft employee. Where did you hear that from?

In fact, Steve Sinofsky kept him, and many other IT journalists far away from Microsoft's knowledge circles. Now that Steve is gone, we'll see more info coming from MS.

I do have to agree with Paul, testing on stuff not in the wild is fairly pointless. Testing on real-world stuff, you know the things grandpa clicks on or the kids click on, is the best tests of any anti-spyware package.

MSSE is fine. It's not the best, but it's decent.

People complained for years that Microsoft never had an anti-spyware package as part of Windows. Now that it does, people are still complaining.

Miller88's solution is one of the most powerful ones out there...redirected HOSTS file. And daily use, with UAC on, only run as standard user credentials. It doesn't solve everything as malware can install to an individual's account folders, but it's still a great 1st line of defense.
 
I am not sure exactly how they test at AV-Test but in Windows 8 it is not just Windows Defender (pretty much the same as MSES) but also IE 10, SmartScreen Filter that protects the entire computer, Windows Firewall, and some other technology. It is all of that working together and not just Windows Defender. In Windows 7 it is MSES and the Windows firewall and the SmartScreen Filter in IE 9. And of course, it is the common sense of the computer user.

I was impressed by some testing of Windows Defender in Windows 8 that I saw. Windows Defender actually did a good job against real zero day malware. That was just one test against a limited amount of malware.

I still like Kaspersky and ESET Smart Security but I would be tempted to use Windows Defender in Windows 8.
 
I use it with great success to remove malware and virus that Norton missed and Malware Bytes cannot remove.
 
Interesting. Recently, the java exploit gave me a nasty redirect virus that would send me to websites with trojan viruses.
Here is the list of antiviruses/antimalware that were unable to to detect or prevent the redirect virus:
AVG,
Spybot S&D
Spywereblaster
Kasperski
Malwerebytes antimalware
Bitdefender

Some of those are top contenders on AV comparo sites.

Too bad I didn't try MS software just for laughs, but it was dead last in the AV comparos.

This is how I cleaned it: After tons of googling I found that manual cleaning of browser cache did it.

I didn't think if it myself because I had settings to clean cache automatically after each session, but the virus changed the settings.
 
Originally Posted By: Triple_Se7en
friendly_jacek

What antivirus do you use now?


I used to use AVG free AV and switched to Bitdefender free AV after the incident, as it had higher sensitivity by av-comparatives.org in 2012 (99.9% vs 96%), so it makes me feel somewhat better.

I forgot to mention that I also used Combofix, Roguekiller, Adwcleaner, Securitycheck, and TDSSkiller per the bleepingcomputer.com advice. None of those worked on the virus that kept doing random redirects to click.livesearchnow.com rogue site.
 
Originally Posted By: mechtech2
I turned off Windows Defender and use MS Security Essentials exclusively.


Security Essentials is supposed to disable defender upon installation, as do many of the 3rd party antivirus products, FWIW.
 
One more thought that is each month with the security updates from Microsoft you get that month's Malicious Software Removal Tool, I still feel that their combination of integrated services is why it works so well. If you don't do the monthly updates and don't scan weekly either manually or automatically, you have a fair chance of getting burnt.

On another thought about Microsoft. If they just sent Steve Balmer to the old Microsoft Retirement Home, Microsoft would again rise to the top in all their endeavors. JMHO
 
Originally Posted By: Hermann
One more thought that is each month with the security updates from Microsoft you get that month's Malicious Software Removal Tool


Commercial 3rd party AVs get one to several updates per day.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top