Ammunition

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You can't tell me that the manufacturers can't make enough ammo to support citizen needs. The 2 wars overseas have wound down, the military is not likely to be consuming ammo at the same rate.

The local shooting ranges are empty, nobody is shooting it up. Nobody is "hoarding" ammo, as there is none for sale. NONE.

So, while hoarding went on a few months ago. Today, you cannot purchase enough to cover a range day.

We have a private backyard range. We shoot 22 quite a bit. The local WalMart has not seen any in weeks.

Sorry, but when all other possibilities are ruled out, there is only one logical conclusion. And that conclusion is .gov involvement.
 
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You may not know this but George Soros owns most of the ammunition manufacturing companies and many arms manufacturers as well.


Simply and totally untrue. Soros owns zero ammo companies.

The stuff about .gov ordering ammo, sure yes they buy ammo, but study the facts and find the truth. Normal buys for normal training.

Lastly, what civilians buy is actually greater than the government. 5X as much and a LOT more when you include .22LR. .22LR is made in totally different factories than CF.

So a lot of this is just bull. What we have is just a huge surge in demand. I mean HUGE. No way are the manufacturers truly tooling up and some, while adding shifts, are not exactly buying new buildings and such. Also distribution is just and old archaic a couple pallets here and there distribution. Sure Walmart has their demands, but the stuff disappears there as well - in fact my Walmart 25 miles away never seemed to have much choice even before the banic.

People are taking ammo cache to a whole new level. Mine was fairly huge to start. I never see 9mm anymore and I simply can't find 9x18. I have cases of .223, 1000's or 10mm, .45ACP, etc.
 
I don't know WHY there is a shortage of virtually every type of ammunition, but it is [censored] me off! about the .22LR being scarce I will offer this...since alot of centerfire calibers went missing first it is a logical conclusion that folks were stocking up on .22 to have something to shoot until ammunition supplies return;

whether the gubberment is causing havoc in the industry is something we will not likely ever find out...all I know is the DHS (and its various subsidiaries) are buying 1.6 billion rounds of ammo (mostly hollowpoint stuff for pistols and submachine guns) scares the [censored] out of me! then there's other reports of orders for 7000 + new firearms with 'select fire capability' and the latest purchases of 2700 MRAT's (mine resistent armored transports) that are repurposed military vehicles from Iraq and Afghanistan...why do they need all this stuff for use inside U.S. borders?!? makes me stop and go hhmmm...
 
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Originally Posted By: Lakersguy
I was sent this this AM. I have not researched if this is true.

You may not know this but George Soros owns most of the ammunition manufacturing companies and many arms manufacturers as well. He's selling ONLY to the government right now, per WH & DHS orders. My son works for ATK, who owns just about all the rest of the ammunition companies that Soros doesn't own. He tells me that ATK has been ordered by the federal government to curtail sales of ammunition, primers and powder to the
retail market.


What you see currently on the shelves is old stock and
what's left in the warehouses since the CT shootings and new stock will NOT be appearing anytime soon. ATK and Soros' companies have more than enough government contracts to keep them going for years to come. Like Soros' companies, ATK is a huge defense contractor and they've been told to sell ONLY to the DOD, TSA, FBI, DHS and local/federal law enforcement agencies. This is VERY scary and VERY ominous for what's coming down the pike in the future.

My son has seen the proposed pricing schedule for Federal, CCI, Hornady,Remington, Winchester and several other ammunition manufacturer's lines of ammunition, components, reloading equipment (ATK owns Outers, RCBS, Hoppe and a host of others) and he's flabbergasted! As an example, when the sales of .22 LR bulk ammo resumes, the pricing will be over $50.00 for a 535-round Value Pak! That's nearly a dime-a-shot!! They're also going to raise the prices by 300 - 400% on dies, presses, powder measures and the like. He's in management there at ATK in Salt Lake City and they're NOT happy with it at all! They firmly believe this will basically shut-down the civilian market while leaving the government as the only purchaser of their products. He saw the government pricing for the centerfire ammunition they've been stockpiling and their prices have actually dropped
from a year ago so the feds are buying this stuff REAL cheap while we can't even get our hands on it at all!


Feel free to pass this on so gun owners will be aware of what we're up against. I doubt the NRA can do anything about it, IMHO. La Pierre can get on all the talk shows he's invited to and cry the blues about the assault weapons laws that are forthcoming from the WH but the real crux of the matter will be whether or not we'll ever be able to purchase ammunition (at all) or, if we can, what we'll be paying for it. As an
aside, here, I deal a LOT with Midsouth Shooters Supply for my reloading components. Two weeks ago I ordered 500 cases each of .45 Casull, .44 Magnum, .357 Magnum and 9mm Parabellum. I was told everything I had ordered was out-of-stock and no in-stock delivery date was being forecast.
They wouldn't even accept a backorder for this stuff! Think the
government isn't manipulating it? Think again, my friend..


This is ridiculous. My local gun shop just received a large shipment of ATK ammo. Bulk Federal and Blazer .22LR are $22.99

They are also having a weekend sale of Blazer Brass 9mm for $12.99 and Blazer aluminum .45ACP for $16.99.
 
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a lot of military vehicles are not coming home from Iraq and Afghanistan....they are typically left behind and destroyed since it's more expensive to transport them back than what they're worth. Plus, it's a boost to the local governments economy to sell/use the scrap that's left behind.
 
Its all just supply and demand. Everytime king Obama talks all the sheep get frightened and go on a panic buying spree. .22lr being cheap, popular, and NOT re-loadable it became a target to everyone. once the hoarding started, supply disappeared. even if someone got a few cases in the first few costumers with $$$ in their pocket bought it all instantly turning the supply back into 0. luckily now most places are rationing ammo to prevent hoarders from cleaning them out.
I work at a small local shop and we have been busier then ever. unfortunately with shelves empty and no re-supply its not as good of business as you would think. but the amount of people coming in who don't know much about guns coming in asking for "ar-15s" because thats what they see on TV is HUGE. so many stupid people feeding into the scare making the problem even worse. so many people are concerned and uneducated alot of them coming in asking us what is illegal now already thinking everything must be registered or high caps mags are banned. people don't even realize nothing has changed yet and its all talk. its just media and rumors scaring them. That is the problem, frightened uneducated people
 
I'm thinking the shortage of ammo is due to a series of events:

-Obama got elected.
-Obama got re-elected.
-Big shooting in the news.
-Another big shooting in the news.
-Legislators and gun grabbers start making more noise than usual.
-Christmas.
-Gov't volume purchase (regardless of actual volumes)
-Old hoarders, new hoarders, new guns requiring break-in and range visits, and the beforetheytakeitaway buyers.

Viola! Instant and long lasting shortage.

It sucks, no matter the reason.
 
Pablo and Mr_Incredible have it right. It is US not THEM that caused the shortage. Pretty much exactly the same when there is panic gasoline buying. Suddenly there is a big rush to get it, even if you don't really need it.

Most Wal-marts get their deliveries on Tuesday or Thursday evenings. Speculators know when and buy it up.
 
Originally Posted By: Pete C.
Pablo and Mr_Incredible have it right. It is US not THEM that caused the shortage. Pretty much exactly the same when there is panic gasoline buying. Suddenly there is a big rush to get it, even if you don't really need it.

Most Wal-marts get their deliveries on Tuesday or Thursday evenings. Speculators know when and buy it up.

Thankfully a few people still have common sense and the ability to reason.
 
Originally Posted By: Pablo
The stuff about .gov ordering ammo, sure yes they buy ammo, but study the facts and find the truth. Normal buys for normal training.


8,000 rounds per DHS employee, assuming that every single one of them uses a gun, is certainly a thorough training programme...make some of them desk jockeys, and it's seriously thorough.

I'd be lucky to use a quarter that many sheets of A4.
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Pablo
The stuff about .gov ordering ammo, sure yes they buy ammo, but study the facts and find the truth. Normal buys for normal training.


8,000 rounds per DHS employee, assuming that every single one of them uses a gun, is certainly a thorough training programme...make some of them desk jockeys, and it's seriously thorough.

I'd be lucky to use a quarter that many sheets of A4.


If they come back next year and buy the same amount, then yes. The word being put out by their info weasels is this is a multi year buy.
 
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Sure Walmart has their demands, but the stuff disappears there as well - in fact my Walmart 25 miles away never seemed to have much choice even before the panic.


That's a very well written response. But, it's simply untrue, locally. WalMart, Gander, AND every gun shop in town can't get, and have not gotten any ammo at all. And, for quite some time.

So, either it's going to WalMart, Gander Mountain and gun shops in Topeka, and not Palm Beach County, or it's not going to any of those markets.

I fly all over the country. It's the same everywhere I've been. And, the response from shops is the same. Shops universally say: We can't get any. AND,,,, WE CAN'T ORDER ANY!

Unless it's birdshot. Plenty of that available. Pallets and pallets.

So, WHERE IS IT GOING?
Click to expand...
 
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Originally Posted By: Cujet
Pablo said:
Quote:
Sure Walmart has their demands, but the stuff disappears there as well - in fact my Walmart 25 miles away never seemed to have much choice even before the panic.


That's a very well written response. But, it's simply untrue, locally. WalMart, Gander, AND every gun shop in town can't get, and have not gotten any ammo at all. And, for quite some time.

So, either it's going to WalMart, Gander Mountain and gun shops in Topeka, and not Palm Beach County, or it's not going to any of those markets.

I fly all over the country. It's the same everywhere I've been. And, the response from shops is the same. Shops universally say: We can't get any. AND,,,, WE CAN'T ORDER ANY!

Unless it's birdshot. Plenty of that available. Pallets and pallets.

So, WHERE IS IT GOING?


Some places, including Walmart DO get ammo. Read the gun boards. The big ones. People are getting some ammo.

But trust me - I'm not arguing with you - WHERE is it going??? How MUCH are people buying? Again part of it is the archaic distribution channels, but still - that doesn't cause ammo to disappear.
Click to expand...
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Pablo
The stuff about .gov ordering ammo, sure yes they buy ammo, but study the facts and find the truth. Normal buys for normal training.


8,000 rounds per DHS employee, assuming that every single one of them uses a gun, is certainly a thorough training programme...make some of them desk jockeys, and it's seriously thorough.

I'd be lucky to use a quarter that many sheets of A4.



8000 rounds per isn't really all that much. I've shot 2000 rounds of .45ACP just randomly throughout the year. I can see needing that quantity for real, intense training.
 
Originally Posted By: The_Eric
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Pablo
The stuff about .gov ordering ammo, sure yes they buy ammo, but study the facts and find the truth. Normal buys for normal training.


8,000 rounds per DHS employee, assuming that every single one of them uses a gun, is certainly a thorough training programme...make some of them desk jockeys, and it's seriously thorough.

I'd be lucky to use a quarter that many sheets of A4.



8000 rounds per isn't really all that much. I've shot 2000 rounds of .45ACP just randomly throughout the year. I can see needing that quantity for real, intense training.


While I agree that 2,000 rounds is good training, 8,000 annually is a lot more than most train. Further, not all DHS carry weapons...the TSA is part of DHS...and I don't think the folks in blue at the airport are getting out to the range much...

If this isn't a multi-year buy, then it's ridiculous...
 
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