Alignment Cam Bolts - Small Washer Positioning Location

[Fitz98]

I received my AC Delco cam adjustment bolts for my Expedition upper control arms today.
They came with cam washers with a square opening for allowing 3/8" ratchet insertion for adjustment.
Also came with smaller diameter washers (2 per bolt)
I am assuming these smaller washers go to the inside of the cam washers act as a shim to allow room for the ratchet to install into the square opening for adjustment.

Can anyone confirm the proper placement for these smaller washers?
Towards the inside of the larger cam washer between the frame mount and the cam washer like this?


Or towards the outside of the larger cam washers between the cam washer and the bolt head and nut like this?

 

[MasterSolenoid]

I installed those on my ex-Ford Ranger.
Clean up any matting surfaces that those Cams & Washers go against.

What, no instructions ?
Alot of videos on You-Tube about them.
---------------------------
Starting at 2:45

 

[Fitz98]

Perfect! Thanks.

 

[14Accent]

Small washers 100% go outside the cams, not inside.

 

[Fitz98]

Small washers 100% go outside the cams, not inside.

You sound so certain and the guy in the video seems so certain it goes the other way...this creates confusion for me, since I don't see why they are even needed at all.
Looking at some of the factory cams in videos, it seems like they have a small shim welded on the inside of the cam washers.
Also would make sense if it went on the inside, it would give room for the head of the ratchet to fit into the square hole for adjustment.
If this were any other scenario for fastening, I would definitely put the smaller washer on the outside.
I don't know because I don't know why they have the extra washers and what their function is, are they shims, or spacers, or are they there to distribute the torque load of the bolt and nut more across the face of the cam washer when torqued?
Maybe if it were placed to the inside, it would take the friction off the cam washer face and the frame mount allowing the cam washer to "roll" for adjustment? That's all I can think of.

 

[14Accent]

You sound so certain and the guy in the video seems so certain it goes the other way...this creates confusion for me, since I don't see why they are even needed at all.
Looking at some of the factory cams in videos, it seems like they have a small shim welded on the inside of the cam washers.
Also would make sense if it went on the inside, it would give room for the head of the ratchet to fit into the square hole for adjustment.
If this were any other scenario for fastening, I would definitely put the smaller washer on the outside.
I don't know because I don't know why they have the extra washers and what their function is, are they shims, or spacers, or are they there to distribute the torque load of the bolt and nut more across the face of the cam washer when torqued?
Maybe if it were placed to the inside, it would take the friction off the cam washer face and the frame mount allowing the cam washer to "roll" for adjustment? That's all I can think of.

If you look at the notches on the frame where the upper control arm bolts locate, you'll notice the tabs aren't very tall. It's hard to describe, but imagine looking at the mounting points head on. You'd have something like I:O:I where "I" is the raised guides and O is the eccentric.

If you place the small washers inboard, you give the eccentrics less ability to push/pull against those tabs which will make them much less effective. You want the eccentrics working against the strongest part of those raised tabs, which would be the part located closest to the frame.

I believe the washers are there to provide more even clamping force to the eccentric, and also space the nut and bolt just enough to make them easier to adjust/tighten.

 

[Fitz98]

If you look at the notches on the frame where the upper control arm bolts locate, you'll notice the tabs aren't very tall. It's hard to describe, but imagine looking at the mounting points head on. You'd have something like I:O:I where "I" is the raised guides and O is the eccentric.

If you place the small washers inboard, you give the eccentrics less ability to push/pull against those tabs which will make them much less effective. You want the eccentrics working against the strongest part of those raised tabs, which would be the part located closest to the frame.

I believe the washers are there to provide more even clamping force to the eccentric, and also space the nut and bolt just enough to make them easier to adjust/tighten.

I understand exactly what you are saying. That all makes a lot of sense. Thanks for taking the time to clarify.

 

[14Accent]

I understand exactly what you are saying. That all makes a lot of sense. Thanks for taking the time to clarify.

No problem! One other thing I missed: when tightened, if you had the washers inboard you would have very little contact patch between the washer an the frame, assuming you installed them in that fashion. With the eccentric against the frame, you have much more surface area providing resistance to movement.

 

[Fitz98]

No problem! One other thing I missed: when tightened, if you had the washers inboard you would have very little contact patch between the washer an the frame, assuming you installed them in that fashion. With the eccentric against the frame, you have much more surface area providing resistance to movement.

Got it. Any advice on adjustment good enough to get to alignment? I was just planning to put a mark to show centerline of existing bolt on the bracket and install so cam bolt is in line with that mark as close as possible. Only needs to be good enough to be safe to drive for 10 miles or so.

 

[14Accent]

Got it. Any advice on adjustment good enough to get to alignment? I was just planning to put a mark to show centerline of existing bolt on the bracket and install so cam bolt is in line with that mark as close as possible. Only needs to be good enough to be safe to drive for 10 miles or so.

When I do them, I just set them at 12 o'clock and then put them on the rack. By 12, I mean the bolt at it's lowest position and the "cam" at it's highest. That will get you to the shop just fine. I don't see where you mention what year Expi you have, however I'm assuming it's an earlier model. In my experience, after replacing upper arms in these rarely requires much adjustment. In fact, I start by simply reusing the factory non-adjustable bolts. Should they need adjustment, I'll swap to the adjustable setup.

 

[MasterSolenoid]

If I'm wrong, then I stand corrected.
Looks like 14Accent has more experience then I do.
It makes sense to do it his way as long as the Cam Washers sit 'flush' on vehicles frame.

But I would contact the manufacturer of your Cam Bolts and get their Instruction Sheet.
That would put your mind at ease.

Good luck.

 

[Fitz98]

When I do them, I just set them at 12 o'clock and then put them on the rack. By 12, I mean the bolt at it's lowest position and the "cam" at it's highest. That will get you to the shop just fine. I don't see where you mention what year Expi you have, however I'm assuming it's an earlier model. In my experience, after replacing upper arms in these rarely requires much adjustment. In fact, I start by simply reusing the factory non-adjustable bolts. Should they need adjustment, I'll swap to the adjustable setup.

Mine is a 98. When I changed the drivers side, I marked the bolts and washers and the alignment stayed good, when I changed the passenger side, I forgot that step and just lined up the factory bolts and washers with the shiny spots or any other mark I could identify on the frame mount. Pulls to the left now.
Also, I did not have the factory square alignment shims that I have seen in some videos. Only regular bolt and round washers.