ADBV failure in Amsoil SDF-15

[olympic]

Let me start off by stating that the filter pictured below was in use for 4 months and nearly 25,000 miles. A bit extreme, hopefully no damage was done to the engine.

pic #1

I cut the base plate off with a dremel and this is what I found. The ADBV is deformed and has wedged itself between the "neck" on the end cap and the base plate. I'm no expert in this area but it looks like oil could easily bypass the filter media since this ADBV seals the dirty side from the clean side. Could this have been a manufacturing defect or was it likely caused during service? Any help or opinions are welcome.

Pic #2

The media appears to be in good condition and I didn't find any large chunks of metal or sludge in it.

Pic #3

The end caps are welded to the center tube which has an unusual array of perforations. It's a very sturdy unit and I can see no way that the media could fail like in the other Amsoil filter failure thread.

Pic #4

The media appears to be about 4" wide by 8' long.

Pic #5

A close up of the media with a bright light underneath it. This was taken after stretching it out on the floor so that's where any debris on the surface came from. I assume the black/red marbeling pattern is from embedded dirt?

I took a sample of the oil[Mobil 1 5w30] and I should have the used oil analysis results by next Thursday or so.

 

[mountravlr]

Amsoil recommends filter changes at 12,000 miles/6months, whichever comes first, so this filter was in the engine twice too long, at 25K-miles. The media may have caused the bypass valve to open if the media was too clogged to allow proper filtering.

 

[Pablo]

I hate to say it, but it looks like a manufacturing defect - but it's hard to tell. As you know Amsoil doesn't make their own filters, but still hook up with your dealer and at least get it looked at. Since you violated a rule, I doubt you'll get a free replacement if it isn't a factory defect.

25K on the same filter....whoa, I think we have a winner!!

 

[Filter guy]

Catch-22.

You cut the filter open..most filter companies won't warranty it. They can't glue it back together to test it can they?

But what exactly do you expect for your "Claim"?

Unless you use oil analysis, going beyond the recommendations of the engine maufacturer or oil company....... once you go significantly beyond those recommendations..filter companies won't warranty a filter for the "life" of being on a motor. What if you never changed it? Do you expect it should last forever?

As to your question..my guess is that you left the filter on to long, it started to plug up, a pressure spike or surge ( maybe at engine start-up ) caused the ADBV to fail by forcing it in an otherwise wrong position within the filter.


This is one of the reasons why, if a consumer wants to extend their oil drain intervals, you should be doing oil analysis. If you see the wear metals going up in your report, it could be because you're extending the drain interval to long and the filter is going into by-pass mode to often and allowing the metals to remain in suspension in the oil as opposed to being trapped by the filter media.

And that is why filter companies would ask for documentation of an oil analysis report, to see if the consumer is following the guidelines of not over extending the oil or filters life when determining if the filter is at fault for any engine damage claim.

 

[Filter guy]

btw..the media looks fairly plugged to me.

The only test that would determine the condition of the element..is a flow restriction test.

Stretching the media out, looking at it from beneath a bright light means nothing.

It's not the big chunk of metals that means the media is plugged, it's the microscopic pieces that the filter removes during use that plug the filter. As much contaminant that is on the surface area of your element, I would suspect the pores of the media are fairly plugged.

 

[Gary Allan]

quote:

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btw..the media looks fairly plugged to me.

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I agree. When you say "good condition" you've got to mean not torn or punctured.

I don't have a clue as to what would distort a ADBV other than excessive heat and perhaps a bad batch of material in the formation process.

Isn't one ADBV material known for distortion over time??

I don't think anything happened to this engine because of this bad ADBV.

 

[Filter guy]

quote:

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Originally posted by T-Keith:

quote:

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Originally posted by Filter guy:
btw..the media looks fairly plugged to me.

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Gosh Filter guy, haven't you been paying attention, filters don't do anything. If there's something in the filter his engine must be about to explode.

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I know..it's my lack of comprehension which leads me to forget things like this..

 

[olympic]

I know I ran it twice the Amsoil recommended mileage and I'm not looking for a free replacement. Maybe "failure" was the wrong term to use.

This was a one time experiment on my part to see if a full flow filter really could go 25k. From the looks of the media I'd have to say it's too big of a risk. And it's impossible to say if the ADBV was pinched like that at the factory or if it was pushed out of place by oil pressure when the bypass valve opened. I'm going to reduce my filter change intervals back to 12.5k.

On another note, I believe the BE90 bypass filter on this engine was also plugged. The can was cold when I took it off even though the van had just returned from a 300 mile trip. So obviously todays engines do produce alot of particles that load up in the filters. I just hope I didn't do any major damage. The van still runs as smooth as it always did. So I'll just have to wait to see what the used oil analysis says.

[ November 27, 2004, 07:37 PM: Message edited by: olympic ]

 

[T-Keith]

Is ADBV on this design supported by the endcap? On Champion and Purolator filters the ADBV fits over the top of the endcap protrution giving it support. Other filters like Fram don't do this and this allows the ADBV to fail.

http://lesabret.com/filters/fail3.jpg

 

[T-Keith]

quote:

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Originally posted by Filter guy:
btw..the media looks fairly plugged to me.

---

Gosh Filter guy, haven't you been paying attention, filters don't do anything. If there's something in the filter his engine must be about to explode.

 

[olympic]

Yes, the ADBV fits snugly around the protrusion on the end cap. The end cap is pressed against the base plate by the spring at the bottom of the can. So under normal circumstances the ADBV is completely secured and can't shift around. But once the end cap is forced away from the base plate(bypass mode), the ADBV is free to move around.

 

[Brian Barnhart]

For someone who has cut open and closely examined a few filters, it probably comes as no surprise to see an ADBV like the one pictured, especially considering the mileage and Amsoil’s ADBV design. Although that may seem like a lot of miles, given the fact they were accumulated in four months and primarily on the highway, I doubt that mileage was a major contributor to the “failure”. More likely the “failure” was due to a combination of sloppy assembly and poor ADBV design.

The ADBV in the SDF42 (same threads, O.D. and bypass setting as the SDF15) I have appears to:
1) Be made of Cheap black nitrile (as opposed to the more flexible and durable silicone).
2) Have a poor (loose) fit around the baseplate inlet hole.
3) Have an even worse fit to the filter element’s endcap.

However, Amsoil is not alone when it comes to poor ADBV design and fit. Many filters, in addition to Amsoil have poor ADBV designs. This is obvious when they are compared to the good ADBV designs that appear in some, if not all, filters marketed by Wix, Napa (Gold), Mobil 1, and even K&N (though it also uses black nitrile), and possibly others. Sometimes the alignment/fit of an ADBV is so poor it can be seen by simply looking through the filter’s outlet holes/slots.

BTW, a properly functioning SDF15’s endcap isn’t forced away from the baseplate when the filter is bypassing as is suggested in the post above. The SDF15 has a bypass valve built into the filter element (probably in the element’s “front” endcap). If the disassembled SDF15 pictured above didn’t have a bypass valve, it contains the wrong filter element assembly and is certainly defective. That might also explain the “failure”.

 

[Mike_dup1]

Oil filters are a throw away item.

The fact that 25,000 miles was put on in such a short time may have more to do with it wearing out than anything. Thats a lot of heat in the filter, averaging 80-mph would make the filter in use for over 300 hrs. Take one of the other less costly brands and run that for 25,000 miles in 4 months, then come back and let us see the results.

Seems more people are willing to say poor quality and forget the use.

fti
The Amsoil filter is manf. by Baldwin/Hastings using the highest quality components avaialble. The compostion of the ADBV and its qualtiy is a opinion and not fact.

 

[Brian Barnhart]

Of course the statements I made above are only my opinion. That goes without saying on forums such as this. Likewise the statement “Baldwin/Hastings us(es) the highest quality components available” is also opinion and not fact. Besides, use of components of the highest quality available doesn’t guarantee a top notch product after assembly.

I believe my comments (opinion) in the earlier post with regard to Amsoil’s poor ADBV design (loose fit) are accurate and are easily seen after sawing open a filter. When I first cut open the SDF42, there were indentations in the ADBV showing it’s obviously poor alignment/fit to the filter element’s endcap (sloppy assembly).

IMO Amsoil oil filters are overpriced. And their components, with the possible exception of the thick housing and generous media, look much like competitor’s filters that sell for 1/2 to 1/3 the price. But, even if they were painted orange, I wouldn’t stoop low enough to call them Framsoil filters.

 

[T-Keith]

Brian, I've found that Purolator's ADBVs fit the most tightly around the endcap and Champions a close second. Wix filters fit well but do not overlap much and at least in the filters I cut apart fits for a thin spacer insert instead of the actual endcap.

-T

 

[Brian Barnhart]

T-Keith,

Yes, the shoulder on Wix’s “spacer” is very narrow and results in very little contact/overlap as you point out. This certainly is a potential weak point of their filters.

But take another look at the ADBV fit around the outlet hole on the baseplate of Purolator and the cheaper Champions (STP, Bosch, etc.). In the ones I’ve cut open, I’ve observed that both of those filters have rather loose fits from ADBV ID to baseplate outlet hole OD. This has been especially true of the Purolators I’ve cut open. I believe this explains the occasional poor ADBV alignment I see in certain filters.

Purolator’s PF47 equivalent and their 14670 (Jeep/Chrysler) filters have the loose ADBV fit I described above. The lower cost Champions are somewhat better. But the Wix, higher cost Champions (M1, K&N), and perhaps the Mopar, and Motorcraft filters seem to be better yet. And the AC PF47s with the black ADBV (and without the ADBV extension into the center tube) have the best fit of the ADBV to both the baseplate and filter element endcap of any filter I’ve cut open.

I’m beginning to believe that ADBV fit has as much or more to do with filter drainback (and start-up noise) than any other filter criteria. If you slide one of the loose fitting ADBVs around on the baseplate, you can almost uncover the edge of the baseplate inlet holes in some cases.

 

[Filter guy]

I'll let you two discuss your differences but i'll add this.

When Champion Labs manufacture their own filters, they incorporate the by-pass valve as part of the endcap design. In other words it is not a seperate piece "dropped" into the endcap.

They have extensive tooling/manufaturing to build their own component parts. All Champ does is buy the raw materials and stamp out everything needed for a particular part number. They also have their own in house chemical lab to produce their own glues ( plastisol).

The Anti-drain is added to the endcap as a seperate piece. Either buna or silicon depending on the specs for the brand being built.