ACEA A3 Dexos 1 oils

[JHZR2]

Anyone look through the spec sheets and find one that meets both?

My 2004 Saab 9-3 requires GM-LL-025-A, which has been superseded by Dexos 1 (and seemingly Dexos 2 as well).

But my saab manual specifically requests ACEA A3 oils if GM-LL-025-A is not available, seemingly pointing me towards wanting a more robust oil for this engine.

Plus, this is a 15k mile, 2-year OCI engine...

So does this exist, or need I use Dexos 2 if trying to stick with A3 oils?

Also, has anyone gotten to the bottom of the question of 15k mile OCIs on Dexos 1? If GM-LL-025-A, which is a long drain spec, is specced back to Dexos 1, which can be had in non-EP Mobil 1 5w30, then is non-EP Mobil 1 5w30 OK for extended intervals?

My personal experience in our 94 previa says that 15k is OK on non-EP oil. But still going through the exercise.

I may stick with Mobil 1 0w-40, but it does not show Dexos 2 around our parts at least... And I think its actually the ESP variant which may be different than US-market 0w-40 anyway.

 

[Lead Shoes]

Mobil 1 0w40 would be my choice, or run rotella 5w40

and 15k miles/2years!??!!!? I hardly see 15k as feasible, let alone a 2 year oci of any mileage proving good wear numbers, at the most go 6 months to 1 year and up to 10k miles on Mobil 1 0w40, with out sampling for a used oil analysis.

 

[unixguru]

If I'm not mistaken Mobil 1 0w-40 was the proffered oil for this engine. I would use either Mobil 1 0w-40 or German Castrol in this engine. Can't say anything about any ESP oils, but would probably avoid them.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Brenden
Mobil 1 0w40 would be my choice, or run rotella 5w40

and 15k miles/2years!??!!!? I hardly see 15k as feasible, let alone a 2 year oci of any mileage proving good wear numbers, at the most go 6 months to 1 year and up to 10k miles on Mobil 1 0w40, with out sampling for a used oil analysis.


I may well stick with the Mobil 1, but as its formulation changes, it may not be the optimum choice any longer. RTS does not carry any relevant spec besides API SM.

Ive proven good wear numbers, dont worry, I have a long experience running 10-15k OCIs backed by used oil analysis on multiple vehicles.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: unixguru
If I'm not mistaken Mobil 1 0w-40 was the proffered oil for this engine. I would use either Mobil 1 0w-40 or German Castrol in this engine. Can't say anything about any ESP oils, but would probably avoid them.


It was, but the bottles no longer show the GM-LL-025 series on them, and that series has been overtaken by the Dexos series which is also not shown on the 0w-40.

Since Saab is no longer GM, I fear they may have "forgotten" about the requriements for specs relevant to Saab in NA.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Doesn't Dexos 1 spec focus on fuel economy, among other things? As such, I doubt you'll find an oil that carries Dexos 1 and ACEA A3 certifications. Dexos 1 is ACEA A1/A5 territory, such as Mobil 1 5w30.

But it is strange that Dexos 1 replaced GM-LL-025-A since the latter wasn't about fuel economy so it was possible to find oil that met both 025-A and ACEA A3.

 

[Lead Shoes]

That is really impressive if you can do a 2 year 15k OCI, I have yet to see that feasibility on this site, can I get a link to the UOA posted? if you can pull that of I would stick to what ever oil you were using.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Brenden
That is really impressive if you can do a 2 year 15k OCI, I have yet to see that feasibility on this site, can I get a link to the UOA posted? if you can pull that of I would stick to what ever oil you were using.


https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1523446/

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/94-toyota-previa-mobil-1-10w-30-best-uoa-ever.16722/

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/m1-ep-10w-30-in-1994-toyota-previa-w-198k.17987/

OK, so a little under 15k, but close enough.

 

[dparm]

Dexos1 is fuel economy.

"Engine oils meeting the GM dexos I / dexos1™ specification are now required as the factory fill for nearly all EU and US petrol powered cars from the General Motors group (Vauxhall, Opel etc). The exceptions will either require dexos2™ or other specifications (refer to your owners manual for details). dexos 1 engine oils are classed as fuel-economy oils and supercede GM LL-A-025, GM 6094M and GM 4718M."

"GM dexos II / GM dexos2 ™ is the new oil specification for for all EU GM group vehicles from May 2010 onwards. GM dexos 2 oils are fully backwards compatibile for older vehicles and replaces both the GM-LL-A-025 and GM-LL-B-025 engine oils specifications."

 

[JHZR2]

Right but LL-025-A isn't...

 

[Finklejag]

Mobil 1 Extended Performance 5w30 is dexos1 approved.

 

[JHZR2]

I know. But by definition Dexos 1 supersedes GM-LL-025-A, which means that standard M1 should meet my saab's up to 2 year, 15k OCI comupter algorithm.

Which of course is why I dont trust the Dexos superseding the LL spec... Which is why Im at least trying to get as robust an oil as I can...

 

[dparm]

GM is obviously more concerned with CAFE than high-stress situations (and possibly branding) hence the move to dexos.

 

[ltslimjim]

Why not try a Lubro Moly product?

https://napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=ANJLM2038_0318083871

^That one lists ACEA A3 for example. Not sure if any Napa locations near you carry it, or perhaps something more applicable, though.

 

[NateDN10]

It does seem like your best bet would be to find a dexos2 product. I assume you know where to find the list, but I'll post it again anyway.

Another decent option might be to go for oils that meet other manufacturers LL specs for gasoline engines.

 

[LeakySeals]

I'm sure this has been discussed before but I have read that GM dexos standards are more stringent than GF-5 (no idea if that's true). Here is the GM dexos Licensed Products list.