We should see the tbn come up after the last sample because of the adding of a quart of makeup oil. As of this upcoming 10k sample the two oils are at the same amount of makeup oil.
9,000-mile results are in!
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I tend to agree, as a preferred Amsoil customer I'm paying alot more for a qrt of Amsoil S2000 0W/30 syn oil, than Mobil 1. These results are not completely conclusive (black & white) but do show what might be seen as a possible insight as to an outcome from a show down. I haven't abandoned ship but I am concerned about getting what I pay for. We need to continue this with other members using UOA between Mobil 1 and Amsoil in their own vehicles, new and old.
Good going so far!
Good going so far!
From data looks like Mobil is better than many thought it was. Price per dollar Mobil wins hands down...and down the street at Walmart!!! Wear wise Amsoil takes the crown and the question of going 25k in certain ideal driving conditions it might but not be realistic for everyday drivers. As far as comparing Oil to Oil...either you believe in Mobil or you believe in Amsoil...tuff call...but for the consumer Mobil has very much improved and the consumer wins either way...
I'm still a radical...I like the Amsoil S3000 5w-30...But the Mobil SUV 5wt-40 for price per say is awesome...Mobil is tuff...
The sample is coming out today.
I am sorry guys, it has just proven difficult to guarantee comparable mileage over an entire year.
With this unfortunate reality in mind, do people still want to see additional oils tested beyond Amsoil? I can keep going if people like the results despite the test's shortcomings, or I can donate the excess funds to charity and move on to some other project. Whaddaya think?
Cheers, 3MP
I am sorry guys, it has just proven difficult to guarantee comparable mileage over an entire year.
With this unfortunate reality in mind, do people still want to see additional oils tested beyond Amsoil? I can keep going if people like the results despite the test's shortcomings, or I can donate the excess funds to charity and move on to some other project. Whaddaya think?
Cheers, 3MP
Patman
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I say to keep going, and use some of the extra funds to pay for gas, since that seems to be why you're not driving the Camaro as much this year.
Definitely, keep going!
I promised a while ago to publicly post a "read" on this report for the benefit of all BITOG friends.
Basically the wear rates are normal at 9000 miles except for lead which is a bit elevated by the oxidation rate of the ASL formula which is a given for this chemistry.
TBN is lower but is not an issue yet. I am NOT afraid of ASL reading 0 as like Redline it will still provide plenty of reserve alkalinity in this application.
What is concerning me is the Vis rise. I am a stickler for a design grade to stay there throughout the drain.
We are solidly at SAE 40w and while many may think that is good,the bearing wear trend tells me differently.
Since the 10K result are about to be revealed I thought I should post this ASAP. Been very busy folks and sorry for the delay.
Basically the wear rates are normal at 9000 miles except for lead which is a bit elevated by the oxidation rate of the ASL formula which is a given for this chemistry.
TBN is lower but is not an issue yet. I am NOT afraid of ASL reading 0 as like Redline it will still provide plenty of reserve alkalinity in this application.
What is concerning me is the Vis rise. I am a stickler for a design grade to stay there throughout the drain.
We are solidly at SAE 40w and while many may think that is good,the bearing wear trend tells me differently.
Since the 10K result are about to be revealed I thought I should post this ASAP. Been very busy folks and sorry for the delay.
Thanks Terry. Is a viscosity increase always correlated with increased Pb? I've seen some reports where the viscosity jumped but Pb was ok. I'd like to see Redline make it next to see how well it holds its viscosity.
Also, Terry how do you see the ASL vs M1 comparison thus far? A wash? M1 retained it's TBN better and stayed in grade while ASL had better wear #'s but thickened.
Also, Terry how do you see the ASL vs M1 comparison thus far? A wash? M1 retained it's TBN better and stayed in grade while ASL had better wear #'s but thickened.
So why in this application did the ASL thicken but other applications it doesn't?
(I can argue percentage vis increase but that goes nowhere, I just want to discuss why)
(I can argue percentage vis increase but that goes nowhere, I just want to discuss why)
Pabs, Since ASL,ATM,TSO seems to have a natural affinity to thickening in many applications I suspect that anything in a given engine that provides a little bit of anti oxidation solvency will help. Like;Ring seal, fuel dilution, fuel adds, oil adds, driving styles, oil consumption,etc.
Buster my friend, I won't speak to the comparison yet cause the fat lady of testing isn't finished.
The rise of any wear element is associated with the lubricants ability to prevent wear, increased vis by itself is not the reason for the increase, oxidation of the base chemistry in this application is.
Amsoil has a theory of formulation that is very different than M1 and we are seeing a good look at it here, keep going.
I say let brand bull stop by the way side and just look at this as two chemistries in the same engine perform in real time.
Call the oils M and A if that helps take the brand blinders off.
3MP doesn't look like a prejudiced tester to me.
Buster my friend, I won't speak to the comparison yet cause the fat lady of testing isn't finished.
The rise of any wear element is associated with the lubricants ability to prevent wear, increased vis by itself is not the reason for the increase, oxidation of the base chemistry in this application is.
Amsoil has a theory of formulation that is very different than M1 and we are seeing a good look at it here, keep going.
I say let brand bull stop by the way side and just look at this as two chemistries in the same engine perform in real time.
Call the oils M and A if that helps take the brand blinders off.
3MP doesn't look like a prejudiced tester to me.
Terry, all oils thicken from what I've seen. RL might be more resistant to thickening, but the wear numers suck most of the time so it's a take your pick thing. We've seen numerous Amsoil reports that don't thicken well above 10k miles. I'd attribute the thickening more to the nature of this engine then anything. We all know these LS1s show sloppy UOAs. So I'm giving Amsoil the benefit of the doubt here. M1 thickens too. Any oil will over X amount of miles.
"Terry, all oils thicken from what I've seen."
OK Buster, that quote says it all.
How many oil results have you studied for thickening out of grade ? Causal studies ?
You are ready to publicly make recommendations based on your data ?
You may need to pin down the first two questions before groping for conclusions. Leave the brand names out, its just chemistry and economics.
OK Buster, that quote says it all.
How many oil results have you studied for thickening out of grade ? Causal studies ?
You are ready to publicly make recommendations based on your data ?
You may need to pin down the first two questions before groping for conclusions. Leave the brand names out, its just chemistry and economics.
ASL/ATM did thicken quite often on BITOG in the past, which is what I think your refering too. We've seen plenty of UOAs on BITOG with Amsoil not thickening as well.
GC seems very shear stable. M1 does well too. RL is but we've seen many so so to poor UOAs for RL.
How can any oil go past 15k miles and not thicken any?
Isn't it rather a typical oil problem of all brands over long drains? I'm not talking about oils using LC either.
[ July 23, 2004, 03:49 PM: Message edited by: buster ]
GC seems very shear stable. M1 does well too. RL is but we've seen many so so to poor UOAs for RL.
How can any oil go past 15k miles and not thicken any?
[ July 23, 2004, 03:49 PM: Message edited by: buster ]
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