2011 Honda CRZ, unknown oil, unknown miles, high aluminum and iron?

[zstand]

My other twin just bought this Honda CRZ. We changed the oil the other night and I thought to save a sample for Blackstone. It came from a used car lot so I have no idea of the type of oil or miles on it. The aluminum and especially the iron are flagged as high. I would appreciate any thoughts from the experts at BITOG on this report. I dumped this oil and went back with PP 0w20 and a Fram Ultra filter. How many miles should I go with this engine? Short trips back and forth to high school, with plenty of knuckle-headed teenage driving thrown in. Thanks in advance!

 

[zstand]

Not sure why you have to click on the PDF to get it to show. In the past my uploaded pics have appeared in the post.

 

[Imp4]

I'd take Blackstone at their word. Wait and see. Resample in 5000 miles and establish a trend. The singular datum isn't enough information in this case. Besides, all you can do is drive it or rebuild it. Unless you have alternate plans???

 

[zstand]

No, just drive it. Will change again in 5k and see where it is at.

 

[ammolab]

I think with a TBN of 1.5 that the oil was in there a long time....thus the high metals. Run your new oil 2 or 3 thousand miles and pull a sample for the lab.

 

[daves87rs]

Originally Posted by ammolab

I think with a TBN of 1.5 that the oil was in there a long time....thus the high metals. Run your new oil 2 or 3 thousand miles and pull a sample for the lab.

+1

 

[Imp4]

Originally Posted by ammolab

I think with a TBN of 1.5 that the oil was in there a long time....thus the high metals. Run your new oil 2 or 3 thousand miles and pull a sample for the lab.

I think you have a good point here. Ideally, if you can pull the sample at 3k without changing the oil you'll save a few bucks. If the sample checks out well, you could sample again at 5k-6k and really start to get a good picture of the situation.

 

[zstand]

Originally Posted by ammolab

I think with a TBN of 1.5 that the oil was in there a long time....thus the high metals. Run your new oil 2 or 3 thousand miles and pull a sample for the lab.

How do you guys recommend pulling a sample? A little from the oil pan or is there a good pump system I could get to pull from the dipstick?

 

[aquariuscsm]

That looks like an incredibly weak oil. The PP you replaced it with will be much better I bet.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Originally Posted by ammolab

I think with a TBN of 1.5 that the oil was in there a long time....thus the high metals. Run your new oil 2 or 3 thousand miles and pull a sample for the lab.

Agreed. But I would ABSOLUTELY not waste valuble money sampling again. Use you ears for odd harmonic engine noise to tell you if there is an issue. Why? The low Phos, the High insolubles the, low TBN and high fuel all point to an oil that was in service for likely near double the suggested interval. And possibly the use of a cheap bulk, non-certified recycled oil used by a rental service agency. or Possibly a top off of non-compatible oils - there is oil mixture given the odd % of Na, Ti and Ca not seen on any VOA. But Your Chromium , tin and lead are good - so I would say no worries. Other than the fact you bout an OLD Honda hybrid with 140K miles on it. How is the battery pack life ?

 

[zstand]

How is the battery pack life ? Unknown. Can this be checked? This was the choice of my high school boy. I suggested a 4 cylinder Accord. Wasn't my money, so let him go with the CRZ. May end up being a life lesson.

 

[Imp4]

Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite

Originally Posted by ammolab

I think with a TBN of 1.5 that the oil was in there a long time....thus the high metals. Run your new oil 2 or 3 thousand miles and pull a sample for the lab.

Agreed. But I would ABSOLUTELY not waste valuble money sampling again.

Hmmmm.... Wix Oil Analysis Kit #24077 is $9.51 + $2.99 shipping to Illinois. Another $7.99ish shipping to get the sample to Wix and for about $20 you'll have some actual data on the engine performance with fresh oil. No need for "Use you ears for odd harmonic engine noise to tell you if there is an issue" mumbo jumbo because by that point it will be too late. Next point...

Originally Posted by zstand

How do you guys recommend pulling a sample? A little from the oil pan or is there a good pump system I could get to pull from the dipstick?

Option 1: If you have a pump already, you can sample from the dipstick. Option 2: Drain the oil into a clean container and take the sample from the stream. Then pour the oil back in and wait for sample results Option 3: Shop vac method with help from a friend.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Originally Posted by Imp4

No need for "Use you ears for odd harmonic engine noise to tell you if there is an issue" mumbo jumbo because by that point it will be too late ..

I've seen many a UOA miss a failing engine. Most parts are in the pan and in the filter not in the oil This is a professional voodoo tool used by all the great mechanics, engine builders and drivers - though they may all be gone now. Or .... Deaf I would again be more concerned about the battery and trans. Depends on your level of paranoia. Hybrid reports can be tricky due to short dutycycle and a lot of stop / start. But IMP4 the the WIX report looks to be a good deal for 20 quid !

 

[bulwnkl]

Originally Posted by Imp4

No need for "Use you ears for odd harmonic engine noise to tell you if there is an issue" mumbo jumbo because by that point it will be too late.

This is the fallacy of most individual people's use of UOA on their personal vehicles. There are exceptions, but the general question is: What will you do if the next sample looks the same (or a bit worse)? Will you tear the engine down to look for a source of iron and aluminum? That wouldn't be worth hardly any average driver's or owner's time or effort, and they wouldn't actually do it anyway if there are no significant drivability issues. If on the other hand you _don't_ tear the engine down at least partly (IOW, if you ignore the results), then why did you spend the money for the UOA? The answer is clear and easy: This is a hobby for most all of the private individuals who do it on their personal vehicles. As a hobby, you run a UOA if you feel like it, and you don't if you don't.

 

[Imp4]

Let's take a trend theoretical trend of 3 or 4 UOAs in which my iron/aluminum numbers went 12/9, 27/22, 52/34, 133/78. Assumptions are same oil, same driving conditions, no abuse of the car, 10 year old vehicle. As a shade tree mechanic, I definitely would not think of rebuilding it because I don't have the skills. At 10 years old, it's likely not worth it to pay someone to rebuild either. I sure would think long and hard about selling it or trading it though!!! Also, knowing a car is on its way out gives me a head start on finding a replacement. The luxury of buying a newer car before the old one gives up the ghost is almost priceless. In summary, knowledge enables choices, instead of forced action.

 

[Amkeer]

Do as Blackstone recommends and don't sweat it. Chances are the vehicle was somewhat neglected.

 

[bulwnkl]

Originally Posted by Imp4

Let's take a trend theoretical trend of 3 or 4 UOAs in which my iron/aluminum numbers went 12/9, 27/22, 52/34, 133/78. Assumptions are same oil, same driving conditions, no abuse of the car, 10 year old vehicle. As a shade tree mechanic, I definitely would not think of rebuilding it because I don't have the skills. At 10 years old, it's likely not worth it to pay someone to rebuild either. I sure would think long and hard about selling it or trading it though!!! Also, knowing a car is on its way out gives me a head start on finding a replacement. The luxury of buying a newer car before the old one gives up the ghost is almost priceless. In summary, knowledge enables choices, instead of forced action.

I agree that operating on imagination can allow us to imagine our expenditures have 'saved' a lot more than they cost.