I used to be all American (big three) and when I bought my first Honda 30 some years ago I owned one ever since due to reliability. Not a fanboy of anything but I trust the Honda and Toyota vehicles in my fleet more than the Corvette or F-150.
2011 Camry, a little surprised, slightly disappointed.
- Thread starter EA82
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I keep cars for a long time too. My always covered '90 Miata's (220K miles) AC failed at around 175K miles. I had the entire system replaced with modern refrigerant and components 4 years ago. Then 6 months ago the cat went bad and I replaced it as well. Other than that the car is on it's original motor, clutch, alternator, starter, diff, etc. Runs almost perfectly.
One thing I've noticed with vehicles - even very reliable ones - is that after 200K miles things start to fail. Imo that applies to Hondas and Toyotas as well. Having a vehicle where literally nothing fails over 200+K miles is not possible, imho. The best you can hope for is good general reliability, which I believe my Miata has done well,. As did my e30 3 series, and my wife's '05 X3. We also had a '96 V6 Accord which was decent, but things started failing badly on that car by 175-200K miles.
I agree Toyota is a decent brand, certainly much better than American brands imo. But I wouldn't expect anything different after 200K miles than we had with our other vehicles. Vehicles only last so long, even with how easy my wife and I (and many BITOG members) are on them.
One thing I've noticed with vehicles - even very reliable ones - is that after 200K miles things start to fail. Imo that applies to Hondas and Toyotas as well. Having a vehicle where literally nothing fails over 200+K miles is not possible, imho. The best you can hope for is good general reliability, which I believe my Miata has done well,. As did my e30 3 series, and my wife's '05 X3. We also had a '96 V6 Accord which was decent, but things started failing badly on that car by 175-200K miles.
I agree Toyota is a decent brand, certainly much better than American brands imo. But I wouldn't expect anything different after 200K miles than we had with our other vehicles. Vehicles only last so long, even with how easy my wife and I (and many BITOG members) are on them.
Shrug. You provided your experience with "surprise" and "disappointment" but little actual useful detail even with your comparisions with other brands so its hard not to dismiss it as a bashing/complaint thread. These kinds of threads produce very little value.
Man, you’re all right. Sometimes we all just vent. I’ve worked on a few Camrys and have found with basic maintenance they are capable of running some miles. One I care for has about 295k. It’s surprising how much it doesn’t need, but on the other hand, it has been well-cared for by all indications.
I bought a used Lexus sedan a few years back. It was a complicated vehicle, and when I bought it it had a number of problems at a relatively low mileage - sunroof motor, seatbelt retractor, fuel pump recall, not a single working door lock motor. Used car warranty replaced it all. BUT it surprised me for a 7 year old Toyota. On the other hand, the wiring harnesses are dressed 3x better than my ford. The rubber weather stripping was 3x thicker than the rubber on my ford. The fit and finish was better in every way. The seats don’t rattle. Ford covers many holes with plastic, Toyota uses metal. Toyota is not infallible by any means, but in my limited, personal experience, they are better built vehicles.
If you're gonna quote my word quote the whole phrase, I said "a little surprised " and "slightly disappointed ".
Nah. You had an opportunity to elaborate but are clearly content with mediocrity.
Bone yard alternator! Old skool for the win!
Dare I ask how much? Did you pull it? All the wonderful wreckers around here are long gone. I miss the days of strolling through the yards. I replaced the alternator on a friend's cherry '68 Nova for $5, or something like that.
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I used to participate in their quarterly surveys. Sad that they were unable to monetize their data.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
Toyota has problems? No way.
$75 plus tax, they pulled it for me.
Nick1994
$100 site donor 2024
Yeah, not as long as I'd expect the life of those parts to be either. But they're still pretty cheap and easy to fix.
Just think of it this way, you could have a Genesis. I say that as mine is at the dealer with some pretty hefty repairs. Again.
Just think of it this way, you could have a Genesis. I say that as mine is at the dealer with some pretty hefty repairs. Again.
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First of all, I'm sorry that your car broke. It's distressing when those breakdowns happen when you've been led to believe something is nearly perfect and it's letting you down.
I say this is a person who recently bought his first Toyota product, I don't think a reliable Toyota product is that much better than a reliable product from most other manufacturers. Given the problems with the two GR engine (leaking timing chain covers, early versions using rubber oil lines for the variable valve timing, and more commonly in the minivan versions having head gasket issues) there are some areas that the Ford Cyclone V6 is better and the pentastar V6 is better. If all cyclone V6 engines were designed the way that the truck versions were with the water pump being driven by the drive belt, I would have gladly bought another Ford product with that engine. My family's experience with the Penta star engine has been great so far and we've had five of them. The problem was the cars that they were in weren't comfortable. I'm not saying the 2GR engine is in a great engine it is, it's just not as perfect as some people have hyped them up to be. The main area where I think Toyota does stand out is usually with their transmissions. There's going to be things that are going to break no matter what you buy:
My 97 Intrepid and to have an EGR valve, intake gasket, tie rods Inner and outer, power lock modules, windshield wiper motor, cooling fan motor for the radiator, and a refrigerant recharge. It ran till 193,000 mi It was worth all of it I would do it again.
My 02 Intrepid ES needed the tie rods, brake light switch, some part that made it smell like gas in the cabin, clock spring (though that was my fault), a new flasher module, new windshield wiper motor, and That's all I remember. I traded it at 156,000 because the previous owner foolishly installed an aftermarket sunroof that leaked I couldn't take it anymore. Did I regret the purchase of that car? Absolutely not. Maintenance is just part of it.
My 99 LHS had to have vacuum booster, master brake cylinder, new brake lines (to add perspective the car was 15 years old whenever I bought it And the first year model was known to have these problems. The brake lines was because of corrosion since I live in the rust belt), tie rods, windshield wiper motor, intake gasket, and some suspension components. It currently has 158,000 mi and I'm going to get rid of it soon. Did I regret the purchase of this car? No. It's my favorite car I ever owned. And I don't think even the Lexus can feel its shoes in terms of the comfort.
My 13 200 needed that annoying oil filter housing and needs a new sensor for the ABS to quit malfunctioning. Did I regret the purchase of this car? It's hard for me to say. I consider the car's service to have been reliable. It is fuel efficient. It is surprisingly fun. Is very torquey. But it isn't comfortable. But most cars made these days aren't.
I still consider all those cars to be reliable because nothing major blew up. The intake gaskets weren't that expensive compared to a head gasket. I'm perhaps more forgiving of having to fix little things I can live with it if I love the car. I will say that as much as I like my Lexus, If I had the ability to travel through time and buy any three of my LH cars again over it I would. I can handle some quirks if I can be in perpetual comfort.
I say this is a person who recently bought his first Toyota product, I don't think a reliable Toyota product is that much better than a reliable product from most other manufacturers. Given the problems with the two GR engine (leaking timing chain covers, early versions using rubber oil lines for the variable valve timing, and more commonly in the minivan versions having head gasket issues) there are some areas that the Ford Cyclone V6 is better and the pentastar V6 is better. If all cyclone V6 engines were designed the way that the truck versions were with the water pump being driven by the drive belt, I would have gladly bought another Ford product with that engine. My family's experience with the Penta star engine has been great so far and we've had five of them. The problem was the cars that they were in weren't comfortable. I'm not saying the 2GR engine is in a great engine it is, it's just not as perfect as some people have hyped them up to be. The main area where I think Toyota does stand out is usually with their transmissions. There's going to be things that are going to break no matter what you buy:
My 97 Intrepid and to have an EGR valve, intake gasket, tie rods Inner and outer, power lock modules, windshield wiper motor, cooling fan motor for the radiator, and a refrigerant recharge. It ran till 193,000 mi It was worth all of it I would do it again.
My 02 Intrepid ES needed the tie rods, brake light switch, some part that made it smell like gas in the cabin, clock spring (though that was my fault), a new flasher module, new windshield wiper motor, and That's all I remember. I traded it at 156,000 because the previous owner foolishly installed an aftermarket sunroof that leaked I couldn't take it anymore. Did I regret the purchase of that car? Absolutely not. Maintenance is just part of it.
My 99 LHS had to have vacuum booster, master brake cylinder, new brake lines (to add perspective the car was 15 years old whenever I bought it And the first year model was known to have these problems. The brake lines was because of corrosion since I live in the rust belt), tie rods, windshield wiper motor, intake gasket, and some suspension components. It currently has 158,000 mi and I'm going to get rid of it soon. Did I regret the purchase of this car? No. It's my favorite car I ever owned. And I don't think even the Lexus can feel its shoes in terms of the comfort.
My 13 200 needed that annoying oil filter housing and needs a new sensor for the ABS to quit malfunctioning. Did I regret the purchase of this car? It's hard for me to say. I consider the car's service to have been reliable. It is fuel efficient. It is surprisingly fun. Is very torquey. But it isn't comfortable. But most cars made these days aren't.
I still consider all those cars to be reliable because nothing major blew up. The intake gaskets weren't that expensive compared to a head gasket. I'm perhaps more forgiving of having to fix little things I can live with it if I love the car. I will say that as much as I like my Lexus, If I had the ability to travel through time and buy any three of my LH cars again over it I would. I can handle some quirks if I can be in perpetual comfort.
There is durability and reliability. Many cars are not both. One could say a 1970 Dodge Dart with the 225 slant six was able to be both. OTOH the Mercedes 300D is a durable car for sure but not all that reliable being a Mercedes and things going out on it. Camry would have been reliable and durable in the 90's and maybe early oughts. Today many cars are now reliable to a point. I would not be surprised that many manufacturers feel that a car that has gone for 10-15 years to have been reliable and after that you are lucky. Why build a car to last 20+ years when you want to sell new cars. Manufacturers don't like me as I have reliable cars, with an abundance of spare parts making them durable, and so have no need to buy a new car in the next 20 years. I am out of the market for good.
I recently bought a used 2008 Toyota Corolla CE from an original owner with 61,000 miles on it.
I plan to drive it 20k miles a year, as a commuter car. I plan to keep it 100% genuine Toyota parts for any repairs needed
by ordering from one of the low priced online Toyota Parts departments.
https://autoparts.toyota.com/ <- Toyota: Parts: Compare prices for a part of many dealerships.
https://parts.conicellitoyotaofconshohocken.com/ <- Toyota: conicellitoyotaofconshohocken: Lowest prices but no free shipping
https://autoparts.sparkstoyota.com/ <- Toyota: sparkstoyota: 2nd best lowest prices, with free shipping on orders over $75.
https://www.tustintoyota.com/parts/ <- Toyota: Tustin Toyota in California: Another good choice.
On the reddit forums, there are so many owners of that Toyota Corolla generation (2003-2008)
who hit the odometer bug where it gets stuck at 299,999 miles.
Many posters say they owned since new and only had a few repairs for the entire 300,000 miles.
Like all manufacturers, Toyota has good and bad years for each model.
I use Consumer Reports, and look for the most reliable years for any vecicle I buy.
One interesting consensus from the reddit posts was that the 2003-2008 Toyota Corolla's stayed reliable from 200k to 300k miles
with many owners taking them on long trips without worry.
I think that is what separates Toyota's from other manufacturers - the reliability from 200k to 300k miles.
Toyota's stay reliable, other brands start becoming too expensive to repair after 200k miles.
I plan to drive it 20k miles a year, as a commuter car. I plan to keep it 100% genuine Toyota parts for any repairs needed
by ordering from one of the low priced online Toyota Parts departments.
https://autoparts.toyota.com/ <- Toyota: Parts: Compare prices for a part of many dealerships.
https://parts.conicellitoyotaofconshohocken.com/ <- Toyota: conicellitoyotaofconshohocken: Lowest prices but no free shipping
https://autoparts.sparkstoyota.com/ <- Toyota: sparkstoyota: 2nd best lowest prices, with free shipping on orders over $75.
https://www.tustintoyota.com/parts/ <- Toyota: Tustin Toyota in California: Another good choice.
On the reddit forums, there are so many owners of that Toyota Corolla generation (2003-2008)
who hit the odometer bug where it gets stuck at 299,999 miles.
Many posters say they owned since new and only had a few repairs for the entire 300,000 miles.
Like all manufacturers, Toyota has good and bad years for each model.
I use Consumer Reports, and look for the most reliable years for any vecicle I buy.
One interesting consensus from the reddit posts was that the 2003-2008 Toyota Corolla's stayed reliable from 200k to 300k miles
with many owners taking them on long trips without worry.
I think that is what separates Toyota's from other manufacturers - the reliability from 200k to 300k miles.
Toyota's stay reliable, other brands start becoming too expensive to repair after 200k miles.
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And the lemmings (sorry) that buy the paper are unlikely to admit a repair is a problem, but rather maintenance.
Getting a water pump, prophylactically, when doing a timing belt? That's "maintenance" to them and not reported.
Did they make a "mistake" buying that car? For shame, don't admit to having a problem on CR's favorite list.
CR wants their readers to secretly complain to the mothership and not share anecdata online with forums that they can't control. They desperately want to remain relevant for the $$$.
Many cars will perform well if they're maintained like helicopters. It's the nature vs nurture argument all over again.
My ‘03 Avalon is still on the factory charge of the AC system.
I did have the alternator go out earlier this year in a ‘08 Tacoma I had (but recently sold to my BiL). I replaced it with a Denso remanufactured one that I bought from Rock Auto for $150 (after core return). The original had 176k on it, so no complains from me. I liked that truck just a little better than the ‘98 Ranger that I had before it. Both were solid work trucks.
I do maintain every vehicle I have owned very well and most of what I owned was on the more-reliable end of the vehicle spectrum. I also am the kind of person that sees replacing a water pump when I do a timing belt as regular maintenance, but I did that sort of thing for every vehicle. I would rather over maintain than buy a new vehicle.
The worst two vehicles I have owned were a ‘90 Plymouth Acclaim (was just not a very good vehicle) and an ‘01 Honda Odyssey (transmission and auto-sliding doors), but I still got a lot of use out of each of them.
I did have the alternator go out earlier this year in a ‘08 Tacoma I had (but recently sold to my BiL). I replaced it with a Denso remanufactured one that I bought from Rock Auto for $150 (after core return). The original had 176k on it, so no complains from me. I liked that truck just a little better than the ‘98 Ranger that I had before it. Both were solid work trucks.
I do maintain every vehicle I have owned very well and most of what I owned was on the more-reliable end of the vehicle spectrum. I also am the kind of person that sees replacing a water pump when I do a timing belt as regular maintenance, but I did that sort of thing for every vehicle. I would rather over maintain than buy a new vehicle.
The worst two vehicles I have owned were a ‘90 Plymouth Acclaim (was just not a very good vehicle) and an ‘01 Honda Odyssey (transmission and auto-sliding doors), but I still got a lot of use out of each of them.
Doesn't sound horrible but I understand for sure you would expect a little bit better especially with that mileage.
For example my 2003 Corolla in 21 years and just shy of 250,000 mi, it has needed a starter, two wheel hubs, a wheel cylinder and motor mounts.
For example my 2003 Corolla in 21 years and just shy of 250,000 mi, it has needed a starter, two wheel hubs, a wheel cylinder and motor mounts.
I just got rid of a 2000 Camry with the 4 cylinder engine. Supposed to be one of the best Toyotas ever made, but this one only lasted 178K miles.
My 2000 4Runner has 290k miles. It has needed a starter, a pinion bearing, a TPS and a MAF sensor. Still has the original refrigerant in the AC and it blows cold. Original alternator still produces electrons. Still on the original clutch but nobody believes me.
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