2005 Chevrolet 2500 HD, 63k Miles on Oil and AT
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dnewton3
Staff member
This is the factory fill, right?
Given this is (presumably) the factory fluid, the wear metals are likely some portion of break in wear, still hanging around. At some point, you'll be due a change. DEX III (or more appropriately the former DEX/Merc fluids) are still available from many sources, and Mobil even has a TES-389 licensed dino fluid, among other brands.
I'd consider a change soon, to see if the metals drop. I suspect they'd drop significantly.
Information from UOAs is good, and at times, even fun to get. But UOA costs are not cheap. If you "check back" with Blackstone in 6-8k miles, that's another whole UOA to pay for, and I don't expect the fluid wear metals to change much if you leave this load in. My point is that I'd change the ATF and spend the money on the OCI, rather than another UOA in such short order. For the cost of your two UOAs, you could have done an entire OCI (7 qrts for the drain/fill via the pan plug). You've got one UOA at 58k, one at 63k, and they want to suggest another in 6-8k miles ...
Nothing wrong with what you're doing; it's just expensive to UOA so frequently. You could get rid of the break-in stuff, run a D/M fluid for another 50k miles, and then UOA, and have the "noise" of break in gone.
Also, 3oz make up? Did you change the spin-on filter and top off the filter? In all, 3oz means pretty much nothing to the total Allison capacity.
Regardless, nice to see the information. Thank you for the continued interst in helping adding to the knowledge base.
(note - I'll fix the title for you).
Given this is (presumably) the factory fluid, the wear metals are likely some portion of break in wear, still hanging around. At some point, you'll be due a change. DEX III (or more appropriately the former DEX/Merc fluids) are still available from many sources, and Mobil even has a TES-389 licensed dino fluid, among other brands.
I'd consider a change soon, to see if the metals drop. I suspect they'd drop significantly.
Information from UOAs is good, and at times, even fun to get. But UOA costs are not cheap. If you "check back" with Blackstone in 6-8k miles, that's another whole UOA to pay for, and I don't expect the fluid wear metals to change much if you leave this load in. My point is that I'd change the ATF and spend the money on the OCI, rather than another UOA in such short order. For the cost of your two UOAs, you could have done an entire OCI (7 qrts for the drain/fill via the pan plug). You've got one UOA at 58k, one at 63k, and they want to suggest another in 6-8k miles ...
Nothing wrong with what you're doing; it's just expensive to UOA so frequently. You could get rid of the break-in stuff, run a D/M fluid for another 50k miles, and then UOA, and have the "noise" of break in gone.
Also, 3oz make up? Did you change the spin-on filter and top off the filter? In all, 3oz means pretty much nothing to the total Allison capacity.
Regardless, nice to see the information. Thank you for the continued interst in helping adding to the knowledge base.
(note - I'll fix the title for you).
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You are correct, this is the factory fill. From the records I show they did change the spin-on filter once, I think at around 25k. My 04 Dmax is running the Castrol Transynd right now, this 05 is the only one with the factory fill.
The UOA vs change is the thing I've been struggling with myself. With this being the original fluid, viscosity being so low, and with the break-in metals still floating around I'm tempted to change it. If this was my truck, I probably wouldn't have let the factory fill run this long to begin with. This is one of the farm trucks that I'm helping maintain and trying to keep costs down. I'm going to talk it over with the owner, but at this point I think I'm going to recommend the change based on the reasons you provided below.
I siphoned the factory ATF through the dipstick at 58k, and replaced the same amount... that's the 3oz make up. On another post I was questioned how I could continue to do UOA's without having any make-up oil, so this time I listed it.
I've already got about 8 quarts of the Amsoil multi-sync ATF, so I'm probably going to order a bit more and use that for a full flush of the Allison. I'll probably run their Torque-Drive in the 04 Allison and then see how the fluids compare at 50k.
Thanks for fixing the title for me, and for helping me come to the conclusion that it's time to let this factory fluid go!
The UOA vs change is the thing I've been struggling with myself. With this being the original fluid, viscosity being so low, and with the break-in metals still floating around I'm tempted to change it. If this was my truck, I probably wouldn't have let the factory fill run this long to begin with. This is one of the farm trucks that I'm helping maintain and trying to keep costs down. I'm going to talk it over with the owner, but at this point I think I'm going to recommend the change based on the reasons you provided below.
I siphoned the factory ATF through the dipstick at 58k, and replaced the same amount... that's the 3oz make up. On another post I was questioned how I could continue to do UOA's without having any make-up oil, so this time I listed it.
I've already got about 8 quarts of the Amsoil multi-sync ATF, so I'm probably going to order a bit more and use that for a full flush of the Allison. I'll probably run their Torque-Drive in the 04 Allison and then see how the fluids compare at 50k.
Thanks for fixing the title for me, and for helping me come to the conclusion that it's time to let this factory fluid go!
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Man, this just makes the Allison look better and better.
Thanks for posting!
Thanks for posting!
dnewton3
Staff member
Yeah - I'd say it's time to OCI. Get the break-in stuff out; probably not hurting anything, but certainly not helping anything either. The vis will drop, but it's getting lower than even DEX VI (DEX VI will hold it's vis much better, but it does not work well with your older Allison trannies due to seal compatibility issues, regardless of the poo coming out of GM's mouth).
As ususal, the synthetic options get you greatly extended OCIs and will survive extreme temps. Given your current use for this truck, extended OCIs are not a likely situation. And, unless you get the tranny well above 225 F, it's not going to be too hot. However, if you already have the Amsoil ATF, it would be an excellent product to use in this application. The ATD is directly marketed for the TES-295 applications, and often the ATF gets overlooked; I believe it to be an excellent application in the Allison.
I'd say you might ought to consider the (former) Dex/Merc dino fluids. Clearly they have worked well in the past.
Here is a list of the approved Allison TES-389 fluids (ones that are dino that would have formerly been Dex/Merc and have the compatible chemistry for the seals used in older trannies such as your models).
https://fdlrd.swri.org/Allison/ApprovedFluidsList.aspx?Id=2
Of those listed, I've seen the Mobil ATF D/M in just about every autoparts store I've ever been in.
You'll need 8 quarts (7+ a bit for top-off).
I would suggest any decent filter such as a Wix/NG or an Allison, if you have a dealer nearby.
Regards of the fluid you use, I'd run it for 50k miles, then get another UOA and also get it with TBN/TAN. It will likely be able to go much futher than that.
As ususal, the synthetic options get you greatly extended OCIs and will survive extreme temps. Given your current use for this truck, extended OCIs are not a likely situation. And, unless you get the tranny well above 225 F, it's not going to be too hot. However, if you already have the Amsoil ATF, it would be an excellent product to use in this application. The ATD is directly marketed for the TES-295 applications, and often the ATF gets overlooked; I believe it to be an excellent application in the Allison.
I'd say you might ought to consider the (former) Dex/Merc dino fluids. Clearly they have worked well in the past.
Here is a list of the approved Allison TES-389 fluids (ones that are dino that would have formerly been Dex/Merc and have the compatible chemistry for the seals used in older trannies such as your models).
https://fdlrd.swri.org/Allison/ApprovedFluidsList.aspx?Id=2
Of those listed, I've seen the Mobil ATF D/M in just about every autoparts store I've ever been in.
You'll need 8 quarts (7+ a bit for top-off).
I would suggest any decent filter such as a Wix/NG or an Allison, if you have a dealer nearby.
Regards of the fluid you use, I'd run it for 50k miles, then get another UOA and also get it with TBN/TAN. It will likely be able to go much futher than that.
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Originally Posted By: dhellman12
You are correct, this is the factory fill. From the records I show they did change the spin-on filter once, I think at around 25k. My 04 Dmax is running the Castrol Transynd right now, this 05 is the only one with the factory fill.
The UOA vs change is the thing I've been struggling with myself. With this being the original fluid, viscosity being so low, and with the break-in metals still floating around I'm tempted to change it. If this was my truck, I probably wouldn't have let the factory fill run this long to begin with. This is one of the farm trucks that I'm helping maintain and trying to keep costs down. I'm going to talk it over with the owner, but at this point I think I'm going to recommend the change based on the reasons you provided below.
I siphoned the factory ATF through the dipstick at 58k, and replaced the same amount... that's the 3oz make up. On another post I was questioned how I could continue to do UOA's without having any make-up oil, so this time I listed it.
I've already got about 8 quarts of the Amsoil multi-sync ATF, so I'm probably going to order a bit more and use that for a full flush of the Allison. I'll probably run their Torque-Drive in the 04 Allison and then see how the fluids compare at 50k.
Thanks for fixing the title for me, and for helping me come to the conclusion that it's time to let this factory fluid go!
Your going to use the Amsoil for a flush fluid?
You are correct, this is the factory fill. From the records I show they did change the spin-on filter once, I think at around 25k. My 04 Dmax is running the Castrol Transynd right now, this 05 is the only one with the factory fill.
The UOA vs change is the thing I've been struggling with myself. With this being the original fluid, viscosity being so low, and with the break-in metals still floating around I'm tempted to change it. If this was my truck, I probably wouldn't have let the factory fill run this long to begin with. This is one of the farm trucks that I'm helping maintain and trying to keep costs down. I'm going to talk it over with the owner, but at this point I think I'm going to recommend the change based on the reasons you provided below.
I siphoned the factory ATF through the dipstick at 58k, and replaced the same amount... that's the 3oz make up. On another post I was questioned how I could continue to do UOA's without having any make-up oil, so this time I listed it.
I've already got about 8 quarts of the Amsoil multi-sync ATF, so I'm probably going to order a bit more and use that for a full flush of the Allison. I'll probably run their Torque-Drive in the 04 Allison and then see how the fluids compare at 50k.
Thanks for fixing the title for me, and for helping me come to the conclusion that it's time to let this factory fluid go!
Your going to use the Amsoil for a flush fluid?
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