13' Duramax drain interval

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Hi,all I'm a long time follower of BITOG,but never have created an account.I have a 2013 DRW Duramax which is used as a full time Hotshot hauler,hauling loads of up to 36 GCVWR.I purchased the truck with 10 miles and have always changed the oil per DIC,which came out to something like 7k miles.The first oil change was Mobil 1,T6,T5,and then Rotella T from 15k to about 90k miles and then DELO 400LE from 90k to 143k all with AC Delco filters.My question is that I just deleted all the the emissions [censored] so that should supposedly extend the life of my oil from less fuel dilution and soot,so I am trying to see how far I could safely extend my drain interval with either DELO,Rotella T,or Mobil Delvac which I just filled the motor with? Sorry to be long winded.
 

Redland1

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Oh,and I know I could do oil sampling,but I really don't want that expense,and I think from all oil the samples here there should be an average safe oil drain interval without doing oil sampling.
 
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My 2011 bought new in 2012 has all the DEF and injection equipment intact because it is still on warranty and for trade-in purposes. If I removed the emission equipment and chipped the engine, I would drop the CJ-4 oil and go to the old school CI-4+ offerings. Or I might, weather permitting use a mono-grade like Delo 400 SAE 40 or Mobil 1640, both high SAPS. Unfortunately that will have to wait. I hear a 2015 black 3500 CC/LB LTZ calling my name.
 
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You could easily go 10K, But without UOA's....I wouldn't push it much further. LML Duramax engines did not have an issue with fuel dilution in the first place, Extra fuel (For the DEF) comes from a 9th injector in the exhaust. '07-'10 LMM's had fuel dilution issues with a "In cylinder" approach to add fuel. My LBZ was returning great UOA's at 15K OCI's (M1 TDT), To long to wait sometimes or OCI came at an odd time & I didn't feel like draining 10 quarts of oil. 10K OCI's seem to work better for me. With yours obviously being tuned, Did it add any fueling above stock? If so.....You could have fuel dilution you never had before? The ONLY way to know is with UOA's.
 
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Redland 1; Do you have the stock 235/80/17s on the truck? Depending on your annual mileage, moving up to 19.5s or 20" tires might pay for themselves in fuel savings and last longer too. I have 275/65/20s on my SRW, which would reduce your RPM by 7%. I believe American Forged make a 20X7.5 wheel for your 3500 DRW. Your bolt pattern is 8X210mm (new) so unfortunately Ford 200mm wheels won't bolt on. Good points by Clinebarger....the 06 LBZ was the last of the good uns.
 
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Have you thought about Amsoil 12 TBN diesel? I don't see why you couldn't run 15K+ miles on something like doing all interstate holeshots. Id try one 15k mile run with something like Amsoil and do one UOA. That will give you an idea on how long you can actually run. I'm Betting you could go at least that long.
 

Redland1

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My truck is all stock minus the delete tow tune.I only deleted after the DEF tank sensor failed and required a new tank @$600+.I looked at Amsoil in the past and all I remember was that it was expensive,but if i could get 20k out of it without a bypass,that would be worth it to me.As far as synthetics and long drain intervals go is Amsoil really the top Dawg or are the Shell,Rotella,DELO,and Mobil Syns equivalent with a good filter? How far can I really go with synthetics without testing?
 
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Have you changed your ATF to an Allison TES-295 spec? How about your drive shaft, serviceable with grease nipples or stock? Have the front wheel bearings been replaced yet? Brakes and brake fluid? How often do you grease the front end? These trucks are expensive to buy and maintain properly. In my opinion, extending the oil drain interval is a fools errand. How much is 25% of 12 quarts of oil worth, because that is all you are saving? One less oil change over 50,000 miles ain't gonna make ya any richer.
 

Redland1

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Mobil Delvac TES 295,stock aluminum driveshaft,brake pads are almost new,I use the exhaust brake and when I drove big trucks I stopped with engine brake and downshifting no brake wear that way.Brake fluid replaced,wheel bearings intact,front end greased every week.You have got to imagine I ran Canadian built TORNADO hydrovac trucks in the oilfields of North Dakota and me and my crew did oil changes,greasing whole truck which had like a thousand grease zerks,and small repairs all while pushing over 100hr weeks.So I believe I am pretty good at maintenance,but I do like to cut costs wherever I can.I do agree these trucks are expensive and especially when they are for business,but if there is not a safe,cost effective way to increase drain intervals then I will stick to the 7500-8k drains.
 
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A Bakken Oil guy eh? You get it to the surface and me and my friends will take it from there. A couple of things we have in common is our use of the engine brake and choice of ATF. Might even be the factory fill at Allison in everything except GM light duty trucks. Go figure! Here is my beef with the system; If any of the GM Diesels, the 6.6, 2.8 or 2.0 were placed in an industrial application, a 500 hour oil drain interval would be the norm. I could see the little 2.0L Cruze Diesel running a small generator in the back of a pick-up for welding. The 2.8 Canyon/Colorado engine driving an air compressor 24/7 and the 6.6 running a water irrigation pump all day and night. Place any of those engines in a vehicle and suddenly they need a Dexos approved oil and 100 hour oil changes. OK, I get the low SAPS and fuel economy thing for CAFE and emission equipment, but to protect against wear? Gimmie a break. For protection against wear and extended service, I'll take the new fandangle additive package except more of it, and in a thicker oil. Lubrizol and Chevron are both site sponsors, today is Chevron's turn.... DPF and emission equipment removed including urea injection and catalectic convertor, extended drain; Chevron 15W40 #235101 40C 125 100C 15.2 TBN 11 SA 1.37 Phosphorus .139 Zinc wt % .151 CI-4+/SL ZF TE-ML 04C Question of the day; What is that last spec I listed? ZF TE-ML 04C Drive that dually off the pavement and rocks will go through the tires. The only non-mud terrain 255/80/17 I can think of that will fit the stock wheels is Cooper's S/T MAXX. Rant's end.
 

dnewton3

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Originally Posted By: Redland1
Hi,all I'm a long time follower of BITOG,but never have created an account.I have a 2013 DRW Duramax which is used as a full time Hotshot hauler,hauling loads of up to 36 GCVWR.I purchased the truck with 10 miles and have always changed the oil per DIC,which came out to something like 7k miles.The first oil change was Mobil 1,T6,T5,and then Rotella T from 15k to about 90k miles and then DELO 400LE from 90k to 143k all with AC Delco filters.My question is that I just deleted all the the emissions [censored] so that should supposedly extend the life of my oil from less fuel dilution and soot,so I am trying to see how far I could safely extend my drain interval with either DELO,Rotella T,or Mobil Delvac which I just filled the motor with? Sorry to be long winded. Oh,and I know I could do oil sampling,but I really don't want that expense,and I think from all oil the samples here there should be an average safe oil drain interval without doing oil sampling.
First, Welcome welcome to the site as a member now. Second, you can relax. The Dmax is one of the best wearing light-duty diesel engines out there; UOA macro data proves this. Next, while not unheard of, it's kind of ironic that you want to save money by extending OCIs, but you're not willing to pay for the UOAs. Sir, that's a dichotomy if there ever was one. Simply put, you cannot have your cake and eat it too. There are four ways to know when to change oil: 1) arbitrary limit based on the odo; "I change oil ever X,xxx miles ...." 2) IOLMs; typically very reliable and often conservative in their structure 3) Using UOAs as a toy; people look at them, and then promptly ignore the very data they paid for by not understanding the reasons why or why not to change oil 3) UOAs; using logical condemnation limits and data analysis to predict a safe and sane life-cycle for the lube (this is the most rare of all ...) So by your own accord, you've chosen not to use UOAs. OK; fine. That only leaves you with two options: #1 or #2. I recommend you go with number 2. You have no need to use a CI-4 lube; the ULSD fuel in North America now precludes any reason to use a CI-4. There simply isn't going to be enough acid formed that the higher TBN would make any difference whatsoever; again - UOA data shows us that. And, CJ-4 lubes actually have been proven by the big makers to reduce wear and increase cleaning properties; this is old news by now. Folks who tell you to use older API designations simply are stuck in the past and cannot let go and they don't understand WHY things changed. If you still want to save a bit of money, then I suggest you shift your thinking to the choice of lube itself. Any qualified CJ-4 is going to do really well. Head right to W/M and get their ST CJ-4. For any sane OCI duration (as dictated by the IOLM) it will be a great job AND save you a bit of money. However, there are times when even brand names (like the big three; Delo, Delvac, Rotella) can be found on sale or rebate. The point is to pick the least expensive CJ-4 at the time of service and use it. Both VOA and UOA data show that house brand oils are every bit as capable as big brand names. So do your wallet a favor as save a little, because your engine is never going to know the difference. There is no need to be brand loyal here; be true to your wallet. For the IOLM distances (and even past that) any licensed API CJ-4 will do everything you need it to do, and still have plenty of safety margin left for that "peace of mind" and "cheap insurance" that some folks simply insist upon. Also, read this; LOTS of data regarding OCIs and specific to the Dmax: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/used-oil-analysis-how-to-decide-what-is-normal/
 
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I'll go along with that. The reason I went "stuck in the past" with the CI-4+ recommendation was because Redland 1 wanted to go extended oil drain, without the protection of a UOA program. The enhanced additive package should, in theory go longer, but how much longer than a CJ-4 is anyone's guess. Chevron's sales pitch mentions 500 hours in off-road and other industrial applications. There must be a reason for CI-4 and CF engine oils such as Delvac XHP 10W40 to exist or else they would be off the market. As discussed elsewhere, the over the top additive package of these lubricants provide sustainable wear protection for extended service, but not necessarily enhanced short term severe load protection.
 

dnewton3

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I would concede that your CI-4 comment makes sense at the surface, but I caution STRONGLY against extending an OCI, without UOAs. It's just a catch-22 here. He wants longer OCIs but does not want to pay for UOAs. Longer OCIs have risks that even CI-4 cannot address; like silicate tracking, coolant ingestion, etc. Therefore, CI-4 really is only important if LSD fuel is used; that's not the case anywhere in NA that I'm aware of now. Even Mexico has ULSD now, if I'm not mistaken. (And I'm presuming he's going to primarily be in the States, but was willing to conceive that he might go outside the country ...) but it's moot, as ULSD is everywhere for on-road fuel. So acid is a non-issue now. So high TBN isn't really a big deal, even with extended OCIs. Presuming he's not going to get UOAs, then the next best way to save money is buying the cheapest CJ-4 lube he can find on sale and the time he needs it. Might be a store brand, might be a Delo bogo or a Delvac rebate or free Rotella from a buddy. Does not matter as long as it's CJ-4 at least cost.
 
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Originally Posted By: used_0il
There must be a reason for CI-4 and CF engine oils such as Delvac XHP 10W40 to exist or else they would be off the market.
You would have a great difficulty in obtaining those from Imperial Oil, though. That stuff was struck off the sell sheets a long time ago, and there hasn't been a drop of Imperial Oil CI-4+ or older in this province for at least 3 or 4 years. Of course, not every place has ULSD.
 

Redland1

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I should have explained why I did not want to go the oil sample route.An oil change for me cost $39 with tax and that is using Delo 400 and the oem ACdelco oil filter.According to the DIC and my running conditions,it would have me change out the oil between 7500-8k miles which I thought was pretty good.Now that I have deleted,the DIC is no longer accurate and I figured since all the emissions are gone the oil would be able to go longer.An oil sample will run me $35 and i am guessing that the oil could run to about 15k.Now in that case I rather dump the oil at 8k and have fresh oil and filter rather than taking it out to 15k with no real cost savings.
 
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Redland1; did your delete also include the EGR delete. or disable??? I'm thinking it did and therefore your oil will definitely stay cleaner with no where near the soot build up, and that as well could help extend your OCI. Lots of good ideas mentioned here already.
 
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Using XW40s is another example of being stuck in the past in BITOG lore. In that case, and continuing with the Chevron plug we arrive at Delo 15W30, and surprise surprise....free used oil analysis with your purchase. 15W30 40C 89.1 100C 12.0 TBN 9.0 Phos .12 Zinc .12 CJ-4/SM Too thin? Add 33% Delo 400 SAE 40, or get stuck further in the past and use it straight up. Delo 400 SAE 40 40C 136 100C 14.7 SA 1.5 TBN 10.1 Phos .11 Zinc .122 Imagine your Dmax was driving a 300 hp irrigation pump 24/7. A pail of what would you have sitting in the pump house? Delo 400 15W40 CI-4+ Delo 400 15W30 Delo 400 SAE 30 Delo 400 SAE 40 Wal*Mart 15W40
 
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It was a promotional plan when Chevron rolled out Delo 15W30 about a year ago. It is a win-win situation for both. Chevron gets real world feed-back for the cost of existing lab time, and the customer gains trust in their product. I did my own test with Delo's red-headed step sister Duron 30 last winter, the results are in the Diesel UOA threads.
 
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