1 Year 10,000 Mile RP Maxgear Update

[JohnBrowning]

Well to date the only negative thing I have to report is that it no longer shifts well in cold temp.! It still shifts fine in warm temp.'s and once it has warmed up. When it was first added 10,000 miles ago it shifted really smoothly even in -18F weather. 1 year and 10,000 miles later it shifts notchy in 24F weather and anything colder. It would apear that the cold temp. pour point additives must have gone south.

The application is a 2003 Toyota Camry 5spd with aprox. 20,000 miles total with 10,000 miles on this gear lube change interval.

I figured this was significant enough to report!

 

[Whimsey]

Whoa, that's disappointing

. You would think that RP would hold up and not loose it's "performance properties" in only 10,000 miles. And 24*F is not even cold

. What's the "weight" and GL rating of the RP and what "weight" and GL rating tranny fluid is recommended by Toyota?

Whimsey

 

[Quest]

I second JB's finding.

With Castrol Syntec 75W90 GL-5 in my MT (Mazda B6), it only lasted about 1.5 years (as with all other semi-sync and full-sync) before it becomes notchy and also whines louder than before.

I averaged about 16000kms/yr these days and I can't believe how quickly the additives depleted.

I'm doing AutoRx right now and I can sense improvements as time goes by....

 

[JohnBrowning]

It was RP MaxGear 75W90 or 70W90 and is dual rated GL4/GL5. Toyota allows either GL4 or Gl5 to be used and prefers a 70W90. So this was a no brainer drain and fill operation and the fluid is with in the parameters Toyota sugests!

The OEM fluid was notchy all the time. I expected this because I have found that most fluids dino or synthetic lose their shift fill within 10,000 miles or less. I am suprised that it is only the cold shifting charteristics to be affected. Usualy in most applications if they like MTL,MT90 or 50/50 blend you can get about 18,000-20,000 miles tops with Redline and that has been the best I have seen to date.

I do not race this car and it is not that big a deal but I am a little disapointed. The most important thing though is protection of the parts!

 

[jsharp]

I'm going on 3 years now with M1 75W-90 in my 4Runner trans, differentials and transfer case. I can tell no difference from the day I put it in. Might be worth a try JB...

 

[par]

I tried RL 50/50 mix in my 5-speed Tacoma and wasn't impressed. Over all, I've tried nearly every syntheitc (except Neo) and found that Amsoil series 2000 was the right one for me.

 

[jsharp]

quote:

---

Originally posted by JohnBrowning:
jsharp, Thanks I apreciate the heads up. I have tried M1 in other Toyota applications and it works fine. I have found that M1 does not improve shift feel at all though. M1 has the same shift feel as the OEM dino gear lube. In the truck manual transmissions this is not to bad as they are not that notchy to start with and have long throws. In FWD cars a lot of them made in the last 10 years have been getting a very pronounced notchy feel. Some fluids like Redlines MTL and MT90 work mircles in reduceing this notchiness while other do not affect it at all.

RP is a close second in this transmission for reduceing the notchiness. Even with it's cold shifting charteristics deminishing it is still leaps and bounds better then the OEM fluid.

I often try to talk people out of useing M1 in their transmissions because it does nothing to improve shift feel. Toyota transmission especial the truck trany have very agressive synchros and can usualy handle any gearlube you want to use. They must not have any yellow metal either becausee they do not car if you use GL4 or GL5.

For what it is worth the 50/50 blend of MTL and MT90 is the only gear lube that I have ever seen any difference in shift feel with in a Toyota truck.

You do not know how lucky you are because Toyota truck trany will use anything and not complain!!

---

The truck gearboxes are a bit notchy aren't they. I don't remember my old Corolla 5 speed being that way. I noticed improved shifting in my 4Runner when I switched to the M1, especially in cold weather. It's still not perfect though for sure...

 

[JohnBrowning]

Well all of my Toyota Truck Trany experince was in the pre-Tacoma years. I will say that the Tacoma's trany is a bit notchy but the throw is much shorter and the gates are spaced closer together as well. My Dad does not use synthetic gear lube so Ican not coment on the Tacom's like or dislike of any gear lubes. He usualy runs whatever is on sale and changes it every 1-2 year. Last time he used Havoline gearlube because Big Lots had them on sale for $1.69 a quart.

I am going to buy his 1995 Tacom off of him probably next year some time! I will have to try some different lubes on it.

 

[Bror Jace]

JB, why did you go with the MaxGear in a tranny?

Why not try their Synchromax? Too thin? Why not a 50/50 mix of the two?

I've always gotten 30,000-40,000 miles out of MTL in Honda applications ... and even then, shift feel did not change perceptively.

I have an 80/20 mix (heavy on the MT-90) in my Nissan 6-speed. Still shifts OK (for a Nissan). Not sure when I'll change it out.

--- Bror Jace

 

[JohnBrowning]

jsharp, Thanks I apreciate the heads up. I have tried M1 in other Toyota applications and it works fine. I have found that M1 does not improve shift feel at all though. M1 has the same shift feel as the OEM dino gear lube. In the truck manual transmissions this is not to bad as they are not that notchy to start with and have long throws. In FWD cars a lot of them made in the last 10 years have been getting a very pronounced notchy feel. Some fluids like Redlines MTL and MT90 work mircles in reduceing this notchiness while other do not affect it at all.

RP is a close second in this transmission for reduceing the notchiness. Even with it's cold shifting charteristics deminishing it is still leaps and bounds better then the OEM fluid.

I often try to talk people out of useing M1 in their transmissions because it does nothing to improve shift feel. Toyota transmission especial the truck trany have very agressive synchros and can usualy handle any gearlube you want to use. They must not have any yellow metal either becausee they do not car if you use GL4 or GL5.

For what it is worth the 50/50 blend of MTL and MT90 is the only gear lube that I have ever seen any difference in shift feel with in a Toyota truck.

You do not know how lucky you are because Toyota truck trany will use anything and not complain!!

 

[JohnBrowning]

BroJace,Because Syncromesh does not meet the requirments. My manual calls for GL4 or GL5 70W90 gear lube not syncromesh. I am not a big beliver in useing motor oil type replacements in manuals transmissions not calling for them! It is my understanding that Syncromesh were designed to be used in transmissions that were origanal spec.'ed for motor oil or other extremly light weight low additive odd ball fluids.

Next time I am going to try either SP's product line or Redlines in this transmission.

 

[JohnBrowning]

goodvibes, I had it in last year dureing -18F weather adn it shifted like two sheets of wet glass at that temp. No at 24F it shifts like the old OEM fluid. Their is no way to explain other then the fluid is oseing some of it's cold weather charteristics. Once the fluid warms up from driveing it shifts smooth again.

It is not that uncommon. GM syncromesh and pensoil syncrowmesh start to lose their shift charteristics at all temps hot or cold at around 10,000 miles.

 

[goodvibes]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Whimsey:
Whoa, that's disappointing

. You would think that RP would hold up and not loose it's "performance properties" in only 10,000 miles. And 24*F is not even cold

. What's the "weight" and GL rating of the RP and what "weight" and GL rating tranny fluid is recommended by Toyota?

Whimsey

---

I don't think that RP is loosing that much of it's stated performance. It just starts out at the very top of the 75w90 weight scale and it only take a small viscosity move to cause the cold weather issue. I had the exact same experience as JB with my 2zz 6sp. When the temp. increased it still shifted great. RP did tell me that gearmax and synchromesh could be mixed and since the gearmax is a well built GL5, I'm sure the combo would protect well enough but I didn't want to be one to try it either. I don't remember exactly but I think you could use a 2 to 1 ratio max/synchro and still be in the 90 range. Not that different than a mt90/mtl mix. I even cosidered adding %20 0w 20 M1. I'm sure it wouldn't have hurt anything but I'm still looking for something I can just pour in without mixing. I've tried Torco with great results for a couple of months until my dealer drained it by mistake so I have no idea of how it holds up. It's on the thin side of 75w90 and felt it. Tranny was a little more notchy but in the good way.

[ January 09, 2005, 12:28 PM: Message edited by: goodvibes ]

 

[goodvibes]

I can't argue with that. I just think that if it started thinner, It wouldn't be as much of an issue. There's a reason I'm still looking for the right fluid also and the cold weather performance of 1 yr old RP is it.