If 0W16 isn't available I'd use 0W20. Or you could consider checking what they're using in other parts of the world in that application and base a decision on that.
0W-16 Oil....... Really ??
- Thread starter billt460
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Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Originally Posted By: Snagglefoot
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Originally Posted By: Danno
With almost 4000 posts and you haven't heard of 0W-16? It's probably been talked about for at least 3 years on this forum. To give you a preview, your next Camry will probably use 0W-12.
Congrats on the new ride sounds sweet.
I was going to put it a little bit more politely, but yes, there is a lot of discussion on 0w-16 and lower grades on here. Probably very few adopters.
Apparently my Honda Accord Hybrid is back-specified to run 0w-16. Im more hesitant in that because when highway driving, the engine will randomly shut off after going 10 miles at 75 MPH - so heat soak and resultant even lower viscosity is a concern.
For a regular IC engine specified for this oil, Id have fewer concerns if any.
When the engine shuts off, does the water temp go up? When the engine is shut off the vast majority of the oil is down in the pan and doesn’t see any additional heat. In fact you would have shut off the source of hot oil to the pan so it would instantly start cooling off from air flow across the pan. Just an alternate angle.
Fine point, perhaps a bit OT for this thread, but Im sure youre right. Just like an operating engine has the bulk of oil in the pan. My concern is the oil trapped between the piston and the block, and the oil in the bearings. Id suspect that heat will readily transfer into that oil, raise the temperature readily, etc.
And certainly a good reason to have a synthetic oil in those spaces.
Originally Posted By: Snagglefoot
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Originally Posted By: Danno
With almost 4000 posts and you haven't heard of 0W-16? It's probably been talked about for at least 3 years on this forum. To give you a preview, your next Camry will probably use 0W-12.
Congrats on the new ride sounds sweet.
I was going to put it a little bit more politely, but yes, there is a lot of discussion on 0w-16 and lower grades on here. Probably very few adopters.
Apparently my Honda Accord Hybrid is back-specified to run 0w-16. Im more hesitant in that because when highway driving, the engine will randomly shut off after going 10 miles at 75 MPH - so heat soak and resultant even lower viscosity is a concern.
For a regular IC engine specified for this oil, Id have fewer concerns if any.
When the engine shuts off, does the water temp go up? When the engine is shut off the vast majority of the oil is down in the pan and doesn’t see any additional heat. In fact you would have shut off the source of hot oil to the pan so it would instantly start cooling off from air flow across the pan. Just an alternate angle.
Fine point, perhaps a bit OT for this thread, but Im sure youre right. Just like an operating engine has the bulk of oil in the pan. My concern is the oil trapped between the piston and the block, and the oil in the bearings. Id suspect that heat will readily transfer into that oil, raise the temperature readily, etc.
And certainly a good reason to have a synthetic oil in those spaces.
Originally Posted By: hatt
Toyota allows other oils to be used. Obviously 0w-16 isn't the end all. I never prefer to use the lowest common denominator.
That's good news. I can get 0W-20 most everywhere. 4 points off on the high end shouldn't hurt. Especially in the Arizona Summer.
Toyota allows other oils to be used. Obviously 0w-16 isn't the end all. I never prefer to use the lowest common denominator.
That's good news. I can get 0W-20 most everywhere. 4 points off on the high end shouldn't hurt. Especially in the Arizona Summer.
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
I have, and I just don't believe that the only reason for the thinner oils are for fuel economy. I'm not a conspiracy theorist at all, and when people start spouting off about CAFE on here I tend to just roll my eyes, because that's what it smells like to me.
What other possible explanation is there? Manufacturers don't like to spend millions of dollars researching something that isn't broke.
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
I have, and I just don't believe that the only reason for the thinner oils are for fuel economy. I'm not a conspiracy theorist at all, and when people start spouting off about CAFE on here I tend to just roll my eyes, because that's what it smells like to me.
What other possible explanation is there? Manufacturers don't like to spend millions of dollars researching something that isn't broke.
Originally Posted By: Snagglefoot
Actually, I noticed when 5-30 came out, some people said you should use 10-40. Now, with 0-20 out, some people are saying you should use 5-30. With 0-16, they say you should use 5-20. The beat goes on!
It's almost is if whatever you do, DO NOT use what the manufacturer recommends! Even if you're just a little bit off, you'll sleep much better at night.
Actually, I noticed when 5-30 came out, some people said you should use 10-40. Now, with 0-20 out, some people are saying you should use 5-30. With 0-16, they say you should use 5-20. The beat goes on!
It's almost is if whatever you do, DO NOT use what the manufacturer recommends! Even if you're just a little bit off, you'll sleep much better at night.
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
I have, and I just don't believe that the only reason for the thinner oils are for fuel economy.
I don't either. And even if it were true, that doesn't mean a thing as far as engine longevity. Engines are lasting longer than ever today, thinner oils and all.
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
I have, and I just don't believe that the only reason for the thinner oils are for fuel economy.
I don't either. And even if it were true, that doesn't mean a thing as far as engine longevity. Engines are lasting longer than ever today, thinner oils and all.
Originally Posted By: Patman
People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Hey my store in Australia carries 0W20 and 0W16, infact the Shell Helix Ultra 0W20 was on sale at 25% off this weekend. It was one of their advertised specials, to bring people in.
They also had Penrite 0W16 and Nulon 0W16 on the shelves, so I can buy 0W16 easy in Australia. The local Australian oil companies, Penrite and Nulon, embraced 0W16 very early and had their own products out very quickly. They are well respected local companies that everybody are happy to use, that do everything from the thinnest to the thickest.
(Link Nulon 0W16)
I'm seeing that Nulon 0W16 everywhere right now.
People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Hey my store in Australia carries 0W20 and 0W16, infact the Shell Helix Ultra 0W20 was on sale at 25% off this weekend. It was one of their advertised specials, to bring people in.
They also had Penrite 0W16 and Nulon 0W16 on the shelves, so I can buy 0W16 easy in Australia. The local Australian oil companies, Penrite and Nulon, embraced 0W16 very early and had their own products out very quickly. They are well respected local companies that everybody are happy to use, that do everything from the thinnest to the thickest.
(Link Nulon 0W16)
I'm seeing that Nulon 0W16 everywhere right now.
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
I have, and I just don't believe that the only reason for the thinner oils are for fuel economy.
I don't either. And even if it were true, that doesn't mean a thing as far as engine longevity. Engines are lasting longer than ever today, thinner oils and all.
(imo) the Asian mfg's understand the death of their product will come from it's poisonous nature.
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
I have, and I just don't believe that the only reason for the thinner oils are for fuel economy.
I don't either. And even if it were true, that doesn't mean a thing as far as engine longevity. Engines are lasting longer than ever today, thinner oils and all.
(imo) the Asian mfg's understand the death of their product will come from it's poisonous nature.
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Originally Posted By: hatt
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
I have, and I just don't believe that the only reason for the thinner oils are for fuel economy. I'm not a conspiracy theorist at all, and when people start spouting off about CAFE on here I tend to just roll my eyes, because that's what it smells like to me.
What other possible explanation is there? Manufacturers don't like to spend millions of dollars researching something that isn't broke.
What I think is especially laughable on here is the view that the owners manual of x country is what the oil weight should REALLY be and would be without CAFE. There are reasons other than gas mileage that specs differ between countries. It can even reflect the quality or qualities of the fuel. If there's 9000 ppm of sulphur in the fuel you can BET that the manufacturer won't be specing 0w-16. Several manufacturers don't even import direct injection versions of vehicles into those countries. In that sense, this argument on here is way too one dimensional and CAFE is the answer to all things even if it isn't.
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
I have, and I just don't believe that the only reason for the thinner oils are for fuel economy. I'm not a conspiracy theorist at all, and when people start spouting off about CAFE on here I tend to just roll my eyes, because that's what it smells like to me.
What other possible explanation is there? Manufacturers don't like to spend millions of dollars researching something that isn't broke.
What I think is especially laughable on here is the view that the owners manual of x country is what the oil weight should REALLY be and would be without CAFE. There are reasons other than gas mileage that specs differ between countries. It can even reflect the quality or qualities of the fuel. If there's 9000 ppm of sulphur in the fuel you can BET that the manufacturer won't be specing 0w-16. Several manufacturers don't even import direct injection versions of vehicles into those countries. In that sense, this argument on here is way too one dimensional and CAFE is the answer to all things even if it isn't.
Originally Posted By: wemay
@ dblshock...
So what! No one said 40 wouldn't work. But nothing I've run 20 in has consumed oil as you've stated would be inevitable. Stop forcing your beliefs down people's throats. An opinion is one thing, scare tactics, another.
Well said wemay.
@ dblshock...
So what! No one said 40 wouldn't work. But nothing I've run 20 in has consumed oil as you've stated would be inevitable. Stop forcing your beliefs down people's throats. An opinion is one thing, scare tactics, another.
Well said wemay.
Originally Posted By: bubbatime
Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: ARB1977
I don’t see why folks are not comfortable with manufacturers requirements. They’ve done the testing we haven’t.
Because time after time, the ultra thin oils lead to rapid timing chain and balancer chain wear. Especially in hot climates.
I agree. Extended 10K runs in new cars on super duper thin oil, say bye bye to your timing chain, guides, etc. Especially in Texas, Arizona, etc.
Ridiculous!! My timing chains are fine.
Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: ARB1977
I don’t see why folks are not comfortable with manufacturers requirements. They’ve done the testing we haven’t.
Because time after time, the ultra thin oils lead to rapid timing chain and balancer chain wear. Especially in hot climates.
I agree. Extended 10K runs in new cars on super duper thin oil, say bye bye to your timing chain, guides, etc. Especially in Texas, Arizona, etc.
Ridiculous!! My timing chains are fine.
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Originally Posted By: PimTac
Originally Posted By: wemay
@ dblshock...
So what! No one said 40 wouldn't work. But nothing I've run 20 in has consumed oil as you've stated would be inevitable. Stop forcing your beliefs down people's throats. An opinion is one thing, scare tactics, another.
Well said wemay.
emotional response cause the post clearly reads (imo), it's right there for you... read the print.
Originally Posted By: wemay
@ dblshock...
So what! No one said 40 wouldn't work. But nothing I've run 20 in has consumed oil as you've stated would be inevitable. Stop forcing your beliefs down people's throats. An opinion is one thing, scare tactics, another.
Well said wemay.
emotional response cause the post clearly reads (imo), it's right there for you... read the print.
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
I'll bet that in other countries they're using a heavier oil.
That doesn't always mean that they are right. People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Car makers aren't going to specify oils that will shorten the life of their engines. If these thin oils were causing engines to wear out prematurely don't you think we would have seen plenty of evidence of that by now? Ford and Honda have been specifying 5w20 for a couple of decades now.
It's so nice to read your calm, intelligent thoughts amidst the CAFE hysteria that has become so prevalent here over the past several years. The obsession some members have with what people in other countries use is, for lack of a better word, fascinating.
Originally Posted By: JLTD
I'll bet that in other countries they're using a heavier oil.
That doesn't always mean that they are right. People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Car makers aren't going to specify oils that will shorten the life of their engines. If these thin oils were causing engines to wear out prematurely don't you think we would have seen plenty of evidence of that by now? Ford and Honda have been specifying 5w20 for a couple of decades now.
It's so nice to read your calm, intelligent thoughts amidst the CAFE hysteria that has become so prevalent here over the past several years. The obsession some members have with what people in other countries use is, for lack of a better word, fascinating.
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
I'll bet that in other countries they're using a heavier oil.
That doesn't always mean that they are right. People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Car makers aren't going to specify oils that will shorten the life of their engines. If these thin oils were causing engines to wear out prematurely don't you think we would have seen plenty of evidence of that by now? Ford and Honda have been specifying 5w20 for a couple of decades now.
Dang, and I thought I'd edited that fast enough to not repeat a previous post. Since I didn't....I'll address your post:
1) "those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all". Why would they, when manufacturers specify all the way up to 20w50? Plus, you don't sell oils by weight if people "embrace" it, you sell oil by weights that are needed.
2) "Car makers aren't going to specify oils that will shorten the life of their engines. If these thin oils were causing engines to wear out prematurely don't you think we would have seen plenty of evidence of that by now? Ford and Honda have been specifying 5w20 for a couple of decades now"
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
edit:
To be fair, in some applications a 20 grade oil will be fine. Just not in everything, as recently illustrated by Ford going BACK to 5w30 in the 6.2L in the F250/350/etc after recommending 5w20 for awhile. AND Toyota owner's manuals stating that a heavier oil is needed in many conditions.
My point here in case you haven't read the numerous CAFE threads: In the US, CAFE regulations REQUIRE that the oil used to achieve mpg numbers be the ONLY oil recommended in the owner's manual. 20 grades do save a minuscule amount of fuel over thicker grades, so auto makers reap huge financial gains by increasing fuel economy, in tests, a small amount for each vehicle. All well and good, when only looking at mpg.
Why then do these auto makers, with the same engine in other countries, recommend a thicker oil there? If 0- or 5w20 had the same wear results as 20w50(for example) then certainly they'd recommend it in Australia, wouldn't they? Wouldn't they? And make sure that oil was available by offering incentives to the auto parts stores. Or perhaps they're not bound by CAFE restrictions in those countries, so the engineers that designed the engines in the first place can put the best grade of oil for longevity into the owner's manual.
Insert discussion about how automakers aren't concerned as much with longevity as they are with profits. Having engines that last 400000 miles (with 30 grade) reduces sales a lot over having engines that last only 150000 miles(with 20 grade). Don't think for a minute that there isn't a department at every manufacturer that calculates this value for their bottom line.
Last little bit - Yes, most people in the US don't keep their vehicles very long, as opposed to other countries, and this may have contributed to the situation. If the average US buyer sees their vehicle as disposable and keeps it only 5 years or for the warranty, they don't really care how long the engine will last. Statistics show that Americans are keeping cars roughly 11.5 years and the miles during that time are solidly under 150k. (2 minute Google search) In most cases at that distance, any engine should still be running despite the grade of oil used.
I know that tig1 has been using Mobil 1 5w20 for 40 years. I'd be interested to see if any of those vehicles have gone 200k or more.
To be correct, I used Mobil 1 5w20 starting in 1978 while living in Maine. Later I changed to Mobil 1 5w30 and 10-30(in Ford diesels I owned for a number of years) for several years. About 6-7 years ago I changed to Mobil 1 0w20 and have used it for the last 425K in my last 3 Ford engines. In every engine I did 10K OCIs and never had a problem.
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
I'll bet that in other countries they're using a heavier oil.
That doesn't always mean that they are right. People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Car makers aren't going to specify oils that will shorten the life of their engines. If these thin oils were causing engines to wear out prematurely don't you think we would have seen plenty of evidence of that by now? Ford and Honda have been specifying 5w20 for a couple of decades now.
Dang, and I thought I'd edited that fast enough to not repeat a previous post. Since I didn't....I'll address your post:
1) "those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all". Why would they, when manufacturers specify all the way up to 20w50? Plus, you don't sell oils by weight if people "embrace" it, you sell oil by weights that are needed.
2) "Car makers aren't going to specify oils that will shorten the life of their engines. If these thin oils were causing engines to wear out prematurely don't you think we would have seen plenty of evidence of that by now? Ford and Honda have been specifying 5w20 for a couple of decades now"
Over 20,000 posts and been here since '02 and you haven't read the discussions about CAFE?
edit:
To be fair, in some applications a 20 grade oil will be fine. Just not in everything, as recently illustrated by Ford going BACK to 5w30 in the 6.2L in the F250/350/etc after recommending 5w20 for awhile. AND Toyota owner's manuals stating that a heavier oil is needed in many conditions.
My point here in case you haven't read the numerous CAFE threads: In the US, CAFE regulations REQUIRE that the oil used to achieve mpg numbers be the ONLY oil recommended in the owner's manual. 20 grades do save a minuscule amount of fuel over thicker grades, so auto makers reap huge financial gains by increasing fuel economy, in tests, a small amount for each vehicle. All well and good, when only looking at mpg.
Why then do these auto makers, with the same engine in other countries, recommend a thicker oil there? If 0- or 5w20 had the same wear results as 20w50(for example) then certainly they'd recommend it in Australia, wouldn't they? Wouldn't they? And make sure that oil was available by offering incentives to the auto parts stores. Or perhaps they're not bound by CAFE restrictions in those countries, so the engineers that designed the engines in the first place can put the best grade of oil for longevity into the owner's manual.
Insert discussion about how automakers aren't concerned as much with longevity as they are with profits. Having engines that last 400000 miles (with 30 grade) reduces sales a lot over having engines that last only 150000 miles(with 20 grade). Don't think for a minute that there isn't a department at every manufacturer that calculates this value for their bottom line.
Last little bit - Yes, most people in the US don't keep their vehicles very long, as opposed to other countries, and this may have contributed to the situation. If the average US buyer sees their vehicle as disposable and keeps it only 5 years or for the warranty, they don't really care how long the engine will last. Statistics show that Americans are keeping cars roughly 11.5 years and the miles during that time are solidly under 150k. (2 minute Google search) In most cases at that distance, any engine should still be running despite the grade of oil used.
I know that tig1 has been using Mobil 1 5w20 for 40 years. I'd be interested to see if any of those vehicles have gone 200k or more.
To be correct, I used Mobil 1 5w20 starting in 1978 while living in Maine. Later I changed to Mobil 1 5w30 and 10-30(in Ford diesels I owned for a number of years) for several years. About 6-7 years ago I changed to Mobil 1 0w20 and have used it for the last 425K in my last 3 Ford engines. In every engine I did 10K OCIs and never had a problem.
Originally Posted By: SR5
Originally Posted By: Patman
People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Hey my store in Australia carries 0W20 and 0W16, infact the Shell Helix Ultra 0W20 was on sale at 25% off this weekend. It was one of their advertised specials, to bring people in.
They also had Penrite 0W16 and Nulon 0W16 on the shelves, so I can buy 0W16 easy in Australia. The local Australian oil companies, Penrite and Nulon, embraced 0W16 very early and had their own products out very quickly. They are well respected local companies that everybody are happy to use, that do everything from the thinnest to the thickest.
(Link Nulon 0W16)
I'm seeing that Nulon 0W16 everywhere right now.
We have to acknowledge not all of our Aussie buddies insist on high viscosities. Also, one gentleman with an oil temp gauge mentioned his oil temp does not move much between summer and winter. From the standpoint of the 400 deg F oil, it’s a cold day in the Outback. The max temp ever recorded in Uluru was 114 F. Heck, it’s not even close to 150 deg F!
Originally Posted By: Patman
People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Hey my store in Australia carries 0W20 and 0W16, infact the Shell Helix Ultra 0W20 was on sale at 25% off this weekend. It was one of their advertised specials, to bring people in.
They also had Penrite 0W16 and Nulon 0W16 on the shelves, so I can buy 0W16 easy in Australia. The local Australian oil companies, Penrite and Nulon, embraced 0W16 very early and had their own products out very quickly. They are well respected local companies that everybody are happy to use, that do everything from the thinnest to the thickest.
(Link Nulon 0W16)
I'm seeing that Nulon 0W16 everywhere right now.
We have to acknowledge not all of our Aussie buddies insist on high viscosities. Also, one gentleman with an oil temp gauge mentioned his oil temp does not move much between summer and winter. From the standpoint of the 400 deg F oil, it’s a cold day in the Outback. The max temp ever recorded in Uluru was 114 F. Heck, it’s not even close to 150 deg F!
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um...no! 5w-20 is already too thin in my mind...bad enough I have to stick with it in my jeep while under warranty! the powerplant was built with 5w30 specs and later 'certified' to use 5w-20 to increase gas mileage!
Originally Posted By: Vuflanovsky
It can even reflect the quality or qualities of the fuel. If there's 9000 ppm of sulphur in the fuel you can BET that the manufacturer won't be specing 0w-16. Several manufacturers don't even import direct injection versions of vehicles into those countries.
While I agree that some countries do have poor fuel quality, that is not the case for Australia & New Zealand and especially not the case for Europe which probably has the best fuel standards in the world right now. So in that respect you can use Australia, New Zealand and Europe as valid comparisons to your own north American recommendations.
It can even reflect the quality or qualities of the fuel. If there's 9000 ppm of sulphur in the fuel you can BET that the manufacturer won't be specing 0w-16. Several manufacturers don't even import direct injection versions of vehicles into those countries.
While I agree that some countries do have poor fuel quality, that is not the case for Australia & New Zealand and especially not the case for Europe which probably has the best fuel standards in the world right now. So in that respect you can use Australia, New Zealand and Europe as valid comparisons to your own north American recommendations.
Originally Posted By: farrarfan1
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
I'll bet that in other countries they're using a heavier oil.
That doesn't always mean that they are right. People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Car makers aren't going to specify oils that will shorten the life of their engines. If these thin oils were causing engines to wear out prematurely don't you think we would have seen plenty of evidence of that by now? Ford and Honda have been specifying 5w20 for a couple of decades now.
It's so nice to read your calm, intelligent thoughts amidst the CAFE hysteria that has become so prevalent here over the past several years. The obsession some members have with what people in other countries use is, for lack of a better word, fascinating.
You don't think it's a little interesting that manufactures only spec one oil here, say 0W-20, and spec a buffet of oils in other countries? And the kicker. They may not even spec 0W-20 in that buffet.
Also, any hysteria certainly goes both ways. Plenty of members here believe xW-30 in an engine that recommends xW-20 will cause damage. Never mind that most xW-30s are barely thinker than 20s.
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: JLTD
I'll bet that in other countries they're using a heavier oil.
That doesn't always mean that they are right. People always point to the fact that in Europe and Australia the same cars use heavier weight oils but part of it is the fact that those people just don't embrace the thinner oils at all, so stores don't carry it.
Car makers aren't going to specify oils that will shorten the life of their engines. If these thin oils were causing engines to wear out prematurely don't you think we would have seen plenty of evidence of that by now? Ford and Honda have been specifying 5w20 for a couple of decades now.
It's so nice to read your calm, intelligent thoughts amidst the CAFE hysteria that has become so prevalent here over the past several years. The obsession some members have with what people in other countries use is, for lack of a better word, fascinating.
You don't think it's a little interesting that manufactures only spec one oil here, say 0W-20, and spec a buffet of oils in other countries? And the kicker. They may not even spec 0W-20 in that buffet.
Also, any hysteria certainly goes both ways. Plenty of members here believe xW-30 in an engine that recommends xW-20 will cause damage. Never mind that most xW-30s are barely thinker than 20s.
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